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06-05-2012, 06:45 PM   #586
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
The ISO war seem to cool down a bit....
The megapixel supporters will say "proper lighting is still best in photography..." and while that is true...

I think having better high ISO capabilities is still more handy in practical use than having more megapixels in the sensor. I wouldn't mind if a lot of people compare the K-5 successor to, let's say, the D3200, just because of "more resolution" lol. I'd stick to lower MP count with better high ISO capability.

06-05-2012, 07:44 PM   #587
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Alizarine, same here.... but I am more greedy, I want more MP and higher (& better) ISO in K3!
Else I won't pay the price I pay for K5.
06-05-2012, 08:01 PM   #588
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
Alizarine, same here.... but I am more greedy, I want more MP and higher (& better) ISO in K3!
The probability is high that the K-3 will have more than 16mp but not necessarily as big as 36mp...
06-05-2012, 08:13 PM   #589
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I would be more than happy with 16MP again but improvements made in other areas (FF !). The D700 has shown that you don't need to have umpteen MP to make a superb camera.

People keep saying that storage is cheap and that powerful computers are also cost effective .. but as a D800 user pointed out, his out of camera 30-50+MB shots turn into 100-150MB once processed in PS. I don't want to have to buy a more powerful computer and tons of storage, I am more than happy with my iMac and 2 x 1TB off computer storage disks, do I really need to go and triple that power (Aperture/LR3 don't exactly scream on my current 8GB memory iMac) just to stay where I'm at in processing power / speed ? I don't think so.

I am really interested in seeing what the D600 will have in terms of functions, AF and MP. The proven Sony sensor allied to Nikons' AF and flash system in a FF package will be very enticing even without all the bells and whistles of the D800. The K3 (if it stays as APS-C) and maybe another FF camera upstream, need to deliver the (even better) goods just as the K30 has done. Come on Pentax, don't send me to a D700/D600.


Last edited by Frogfish; 06-06-2012 at 05:52 AM.
06-06-2012, 01:53 AM   #590
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frogfish Quote
I would be more than happy with 16MP again but improvements made in other areas (FF !). The D700 has shown that you don't need to have umpteen MP to make a superb camera.

People keep saying that storage is cheap and that powerful computers are also cost effective .. but as a D800 user pointed out, his out of camera 30-50+MB shots turn into 100-150MB once processed in PS. I don't want to have to buy a more powerful computer and tons of storage, I am more than happy with my iMac and 2 x 1TB off computer storage disks, do I really need to go and triple that power (Aperture/LR3 don't exactly scream on my current 8GB memory iMac) just to stay where I'm at in processing power / speed ? I don't think so.

I am really interested in seeing what the D600 will have in terms of functions, AF and MP. The proven Sony 16MP sensor (as used in the D7000) allied to Nikons' AF and flash system in a FF package will be very enticing even without all the bells and whistles of the D800. The K3 (if it stays as APS-C) and maybe another FF camera upstream, need to deliver the (even better) goods just as the K30 has done. Come on Pentax, don't send me to a D700/D600.
My feelings too about the computer side of things, but II don't see how Pentax can stay at 16 MP on APS-C for their flagship camera if the competition movies to 16-24 MP. It's a marketing thing. No matter how good a smaller sensor may be, Pentax will end up slaughtered on the basis of the headline specs which is all the marketeers seem to notice.

I'd have thought the threat from Nikon may come from a D7200/D400 and a D600 in combination, the first offering 16-24 mp in a high-quality package on APS-C and the other at least 16 MP on FF. Pentax might well lose users to both unless it can produce comparable cameras of its own. High-end APS-C users wouldn't settle for a less capable offering on Pentax and those who want FF wouldn't settle for Pentax at all if there is no FF camera or, as now, only vague hints that one day there might be. After all, there might be nothing to stop Nikon lowering the bar further by bringing out a D500 next year at an even lower price point. Moving to Nikon and then being careful over choosing lenses (i.e. not choosing DX-only ones) means you have both bases covered. You can buy one format now and change bodies later, or run both formats together but without having to pony up huge sums for pro-level D800 or D4 cameras.

If these rumours are true - still a big if - I guess it's show time for Pentax: produce the goodies or else. The next six months are going to be as crucial for Pentax as any period for a few years.

Last edited by mecrox; 06-06-2012 at 07:57 AM.
06-06-2012, 08:24 AM   #591
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I do think that the 24MP Sony APS-C sensor can be pushed an extra stop over what we are seeing from Sony. I would not mind a K-3 with the 24MP APS-C sensor as long as the support technologies like AF and SR are noticeably improved. I am hopeful that we see the AA filter removed from the 24MP sensor and really crisp detail.

I have a i7 2.4ghz with 8GBs and SSDs. Working with TIFF files from my 14-bit 16 MP sensor in LR4 is pretty demanding. 14-bit 24MP is going to be a load.

The MPs is not nearly as important to me as improvements in AF (low-light) and accuracy. The Sigma HSM lenses are actually very fast on the K-5. Almost Canon fast. I am interested to see what Canon will do with the 7DII. The bar has been raised pretty high by cameras like the K-5 where IQ and DR pretty much smoke the Canon APS-C line.
06-06-2012, 10:18 AM   #592
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
I have a i7 2.4ghz with 8GBs and SSDs. Working with TIFF files from my 14-bit 16 MP sensor in LR4 is pretty demanding. 14-bit 24MP is going to be a load.
Well I run AMD 6 core processor, but no ssd and 16GB ram and I found that in LR handling files from 645D where slow. When opened and clicked too 1:1 pixelpeeping, it took 9 seconds to go from one to the next with fully opening and loading.

I know I can make my system at least twice as fast, but even then it will be slow.
06-06-2012, 10:27 AM   #593
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Well I run AMD 6 core processor, but no ssd and 16GB ram and I found that in LR handling files from 645D where slow. When opened and clicked too 1:1 pixelpeeping, it took 9 seconds to go from one to the next with fully opening and loading.

I know I can make my system at least twice as fast, but even then it will be slow.
You bought the wrong processor. AMD has been helplessly left behind for 6 years now.

06-06-2012, 11:28 AM   #594
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
I am hopeful that we see the AA filter removed from the 24MP sensor and really crisp detail.
Removing the AA filter would likely improve IQ more than the extra pixels would. Could they tame moire, though? Nikon has done it in the D800e.
06-06-2012, 12:16 PM   #595
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QuoteOriginally posted by civiletti Quote
Removing the AA filter would likely improve IQ more than the extra pixels would. Could they tame moire, though? Nikon has done it in the D800e.
Pixel density of the 24MP APS-C is higher than the 36MP D800, so it should be easier, but it is my understanding that it puts a bigger load on the camera's image processor. We might see a K-3 with either 2 image processors or a newer, faster single processor. How this would affect things like battery life and frames per-second, I have no idea. 14-bit/24MP is going to take a lot of processing power by itself, how much more is needed if you take away the AA filter and deal with the moire on the processing side? I will be happy to see the AA filter removed. It is possible that Pentax does something like Fuji and changes the color filter to reduce moire.

I would not be apposed to a slightly larger K-3 if it had a larger VF, 2 card slots, & 2 image processors.
06-06-2012, 02:28 PM   #596
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
You bought the wrong processor. AMD has been helplessly left behind for 6 years now.
It's all about the price and I can get those AMD processors for very cheap. The Phenom II Black 1100T aind no slow processor, but it is true that for more speed I should leave AMD and spend money.
06-06-2012, 03:15 PM   #597
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when you do post-processing/picture editing, the cache+clock frequency is what counts ... however, if you start several batch jobs that convert raw to jpeg its the amount of cores that counts. Thats why I chose core mhz over amount of cores (my batch jobs run in my coffe breaks ;-)

Last edited by infoomatic; 06-06-2012 at 03:16 PM. Reason: err..
06-06-2012, 10:11 PM   #598
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
It's all about the price and I can get those AMD processors for very cheap. The Phenom II Black 1100T aind no slow processor, but it is true that for more speed I should leave AMD and spend money.
The thing is, even the modestly priced Intel models have been faster than the high end AMD models since around 2007. At least with the measures we use at work. We have racks of almost 100 linux servers. When Opteron came, it was a relief to gradually replace our Pentium 4 dogs with them, but since Core 2, the game changed completely. I can't keep up with the AMD nomenclature any more, but each time we test one of them, it's the same thing, they're slower than even a couple of year old mac laptops.

But I've read that the Phenom II Black 1100 is almost closing the gap, so maybe we should test again.

Btw. are you using a 64 bit OS?
06-06-2012, 11:11 PM   #599
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
Pixel density of the 24MP APS-C is higher than the 36MP D800, so it should be easier, but it is my understanding that it puts a bigger load on the camera's image processor. We might see a K-3 with either 2 image processors or a newer, faster single processor. How this would affect things like battery life and frames per-second, I have no idea. 14-bit/24MP is going to take a lot of processing power by itself, how much more is needed if you take away the AA filter and deal with the moire on the processing side? I will be happy to see the AA filter removed. It is possible that Pentax does something like Fuji and changes the color filter to reduce moire. I would not be apposed to a slightly larger K-3 if it had a larger VF, 2 card slots, & 2 image processors.
I would also agree to a slightly larger K-3 if it can accommodate 2 dedicated processors for an AA-filterless approach. I just hope it won't be K20D-large, though.

From the way things look, they could fit a Prime M and a Prime II with the latter dedicated for AF.... though that would probably make the cam just a little smaller than a Canon 7D (which is huge, by the way)

btw, I remember Toshiba making an awesome image proc some time ago...
06-06-2012, 11:34 PM   #600
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I use Phenom II X2 565 and SSD hard drive with XP SP3 - I don't see any problem with software and RAW files.
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