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11-21-2007, 06:11 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by mutley Quote
They know how important, and commented upon this is. They see how quickly the D300, D200, 40D, 30D focus, and their low light advantages, as well as how well their focus tracking works.

Component cost would be similar, so cost is not the issue. It is simply a matter of designing it correctly, and not accepting the results until they are as good or better. Doesn't matter what their "focus" is. They have to make AF anyway, so why not just make it on the same level as the ones people do feel are better.

They wouldn't release the K20D until they physically were sure the new design is comparable. Most of those cameras are available where Pentax can buy them for testing purposes to make sure the K20D focuses at those levels. What's the point of accepting less, so they won't. Right?
Why do I get the feeling that whatever Pentax will release next year, you will not be happy?

D300 is not available to buy and if it were, as 40D, and that the tests were to prove that Pentax's AF is still behind N and C, they wouldn't have enough time to change anything if they want to release the camera anytime in 2008.

As you said, cost is not the issue, design is. So it's not about tweaking one or two pieces of electronics, it's about getting the whole system right from the start. It's called "know-how" and doesn't come for free. You have to accumulate it over the years or buy it from others (patents, hiring people...).

So maybe K20D is on par with D300 and 40D's AF or maybe it isn't, but it's already too late to change it now.

So at the end of january (let's say at the end of june to be on the safe side ) we'll still have two choices:

1/ If K20 doesn't deliver in the departments we want, don't buy it and wait for K30...
2/ Buy directly a 40D or D300 and be happy (?)

Don't forget, before the 40D there was the 30D, 20D, 10D, D60, D30, that's 5 AF generations, not counting the 20D-30D upgrade, Pentax has 2 generations (*istD, K10) in this segment with the same AF system.

I wish them to be able to make the big leap in all departments (I pledge to buy two K20D if they manage that, just to help them on ), but I might end up passing on the K20 and continue using my K10 if they don't.

11-21-2007, 07:21 AM   #32
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Man, this sounds like a Canon thread when the 40D came out and nobody was impressed.

The new K10D replacement is a spectacular machine that will give everything a run for its money hands down. It'll be worth your bees and honey and you'll lust for it.

In the respect of AF speed, you won't have to worry too much about that and heck, they've even included a new feature with respect to AF the others wont give you.

Remember this and hold it close to your hearts because I don't just lie out my rear.

Pentax will bring to the market a product that will have more whiz bang features then any other camera before it and even after it next year. Pentax has done everything in their power thanks to help from Hoya and have sat down to make something ridiculously amazing to show us they have listened to our cries. If you feel the need to discredit these facts, I'll take my time to discredit you since based on the facts that I have, and many of the other people "in the know" have been disclosed it's nothing short of amazing, stunning, brilliant. Pentax has been on a roll here in the last 6 months getting factories ready and will have a substantial product to sell you come next year. This new line of cameras will be out faster than any other manufacturer produces a new line and it's because the user base has far surpassed anything Pentax could have dreamed of and a little secret behind the scenes has proved it since in the last month alone Pentax K10D's and K100's have been selling at a rate of 5:1 more than expected and being another huge sales boost. Pentax is excited to the point of bursting and you won't find any of the information "leaked" to be overly valid, hence why Ben chimed in to tell us to stop speculating because it just causes doubt when the information wasn't exciting nor was all of it correct. Sit back and relax folks, your K10D's and K100's work just fine and nobody needs a new camera right now, heck my K10D is half dead at 60,000 actuations and I really don't care right now for a new body, I'm saving for the badness that is the K20D, even though I could afford a D300 and the Nikon system or even a 5D and the Canon system.

Ben really knows whats in store folks and his career is built on his talents and the equipment he trusts. Soon people will be begging him to take pictures with the new Pentax camera due out and the fashion world will forget the Hassleblads!
11-21-2007, 07:45 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
Man, this sounds like a Canon thread when the 40D came out and nobody was impressed.

The new K10D replacement is a spectacular machine that will give everything a run for its money hands down. It'll be worth your bees and honey and you'll lust for it.

In the respect of AF speed, you won't have to worry too much about that and heck, they've even included a new feature with respect to AF the others wont give you.

Remember this and hold it close to your hearts because I don't just lie out my rear.

Pentax will bring to the market a product that will have more whiz bang features then any other camera before it and even after it next year. Pentax has done everything in their power thanks to help from Hoya and have sat down to make something ridiculously amazing to show us they have listened to our cries. If you feel the need to discredit these facts, I'll take my time to discredit you since based on the facts that I have, and many of the other people "in the know" have been disclosed it's nothing short of amazing, stunning, brilliant. Pentax has been on a roll here in the last 6 months getting factories ready and will have a substantial product to sell you come next year. This new line of cameras will be out faster than any other manufacturer produces a new line and it's because the user base has far surpassed anything Pentax could have dreamed of and a little secret behind the scenes has proved it since in the last month alone Pentax K10D's and K100's have been selling at a rate of 5:1 more than expected and being another huge sales boost. Pentax is excited to the point of bursting and you won't find any of the information "leaked" to be overly valid, hence why Ben chimed in to tell us to stop speculating because it just causes doubt when the information wasn't exciting nor was all of it correct. Sit back and relax folks, your K10D's and K100's work just fine and nobody needs a new camera right now, heck my K10D is half dead at 60,000 actuations and I really don't care right now for a new body, I'm saving for the badness that is the K20D, even though I could afford a D300 and the Nikon system or even a 5D and the Canon system.

Ben really knows whats in store folks and his career is built on his talents and the equipment he trusts. Soon people will be begging him to take pictures with the new Pentax camera due out and the fashion world will forget the Hassleblads!
Got my favorite chair and my bowl of popcorn.......
Anyways thanks for the pep talk...got me quite curious. Did they do an on-chip pixel by pixel ND filter like I asked for?????
11-21-2007, 07:47 AM   #34
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Please tell me that it has a flash system as fast as the one of the Nikon D50... or please tell me that it is even better.

11-21-2007, 09:44 AM   #35
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The only speculation that I am interested in is what will be the sell off prices for the K10 come Jan when the new wunderplastik comes out with all it's must have gimics......

perhaps at last I can get my hands on a k10 since it seems to be the best DSLR in what is a mediocre bunch..... here in the UK we are obliged to pay twice the US price and the grip is a staggering 100!!!!...yes, thats right, 220 USD!!!

Roll on January
11-21-2007, 10:33 AM   #36
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Chris

I do love your enthusiasm. I used to work for a camera shop here in Okla. What most people do not know is that if you were not so convinced that the new product offering will be that good it would be easy for you to jump ship to another brand and as I know most companies offer their products to sales employees and a big discount from dealer net. When I decided to jump ship from canon back to Pentax I felt like their future offerings would serve me better and at less cost. I do alot of freelance work here in Oklahoma and my K10D with a istD as a back up has served me very well.

I just wonder what all the talk would have been like if we had the internet and all of these forums back in the early 80's when the LX was first released---talk about a milestone! By the way, for those that are not old enough to remember--back in the late sixties and early seventies Pentax produced more cameras than nikon & canon together.

Good shooting, Kent
11-21-2007, 11:30 AM   #37
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Canons prices are taking a freefall hammering down here, even the 40D's gone down by about NZD$600. Biggest drop is the 5D, cheapest is just over 3k lol, over the last couple of months they were going for around 5K body only, Nikons are the same. Pentax got the competition spooked or just a early christmas?
11-21-2007, 11:57 AM   #38
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Chris,

Your enthusiasm is most welcome.
If what you say are true were are indeed in for a real treat
My only two remaining questions:
- Will it have a build in hand warming feature for guys like me frequently working in the below -20C temperature ranges... really hate to wear thick glowes when doing photography
- Will it serve me that nice freshly brewed custom roasted mexican coffee I adore, when out early to shoot pre sunrise shots

Thanks for spreading a little (Ok a lot) possitive attitude and enthusiasm, guess we could all learn from that.

QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
Man, this sounds like a Canon thread when the 40D came out and nobody was impressed.

The new K10D replacement is a spectacular machine that will give everything a run for its money hands down. It'll be worth your bees and honey and you'll lust for it.

In the respect of AF speed, you won't have to worry too much about that and heck, they've even included a new feature with respect to AF the others wont give you.

Remember this and hold it close to your hearts because I don't just lie out my rear.

Pentax will bring to the market a product that will have more whiz bang features then any other camera before it and even after it next year. Pentax has done everything in their power thanks to help from Hoya and have sat down to make something ridiculously amazing to show us they have listened to our cries. If you feel the need to discredit these facts, I'll take my time to discredit you since based on the facts that I have, and many of the other people "in the know" have been disclosed it's nothing short of amazing, stunning, brilliant. Pentax has been on a roll here in the last 6 months getting factories ready and will have a substantial product to sell you come next year. This new line of cameras will be out faster than any other manufacturer produces a new line and it's because the user base has far surpassed anything Pentax could have dreamed of and a little secret behind the scenes has proved it since in the last month alone Pentax K10D's and K100's have been selling at a rate of 5:1 more than expected and being another huge sales boost. Pentax is excited to the point of bursting and you won't find any of the information "leaked" to be overly valid, hence why Ben chimed in to tell us to stop speculating because it just causes doubt when the information wasn't exciting nor was all of it correct. Sit back and relax folks, your K10D's and K100's work just fine and nobody needs a new camera right now, heck my K10D is half dead at 60,000 actuations and I really don't care right now for a new body, I'm saving for the badness that is the K20D, even though I could afford a D300 and the Nikon system or even a 5D and the Canon system.

Ben really knows whats in store folks and his career is built on his talents and the equipment he trusts. Soon people will be begging him to take pictures with the new Pentax camera due out and the fashion world will forget the Hassleblads!


11-21-2007, 03:13 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by FotoPete Quote
So um...does that mean all Pentax Lenses will not only have an all encompasing SR solution (front,back,left,right,rotational)..

...but Tilt-Shift as well???

no--it means if you drop it on the ground, it explodes breaking the ground.
11-21-2007, 04:50 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
In the respect of AF speed, you won't have to worry too much about that and heck, they've even included a new feature with respect to AF the others wont give you.
Thanks for the reassurance. I will in all likelihood give the new offerings a decent go before I consider anything else.

QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
Remember this and hold it close to your hearts because I don't just lie out my rear.
How about out your front?

QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
it's nothing short of amazing, stunning, brilliant.
Boy, you have to be right now don't you!

QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
This new line of cameras will be out faster than any other manufacturer produces a new line
Again, very reassuring. I'm hoping to have one by winter, if I can afford it.

QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
Sit back and relax folks
NO! Where's the fun in that? I really enjoy the speculation threads, they're fun and frivolous.
11-21-2007, 05:03 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
The new K10D replacement is a spectacular machine that will give everything a run for its money hands down. It'll be worth your bees and honey and you'll lust for it....t's nothing short of amazing, stunning, brilliant.
Now, I am so hyped up and have such high expectations that I would be very disappointed if I am not "amazed" and "stunned" when the real specs come out!

QuoteQuote:
Soon people will be begging him to take pictures with the new Pentax camera due out and the fashion world will forget the Hassleblads!
... and the 645D?
11-21-2007, 06:09 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
Now, I am so hyped up and have such high expectations that I would be very disappointed if I am not "amazed" and "stunned" when the real specs come out!



... and the 645D?
Maybe it will come with a coin slot on it, so the eager throngs who want to see it will have to put a coin in the slot to see it. That way the buyers can make a little cash to pay for the cost of the extra buttons that are on it (which they said they wanted, but never used).
11-22-2007, 04:26 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by regken Quote
Not as nice as the Nikon D300
How can you say that when the whole specification list is not released yet and the performance is not tested against the D300? Do you have some special inside information about the K20D that I have not?
11-22-2007, 04:29 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
I hope you are right. There is nothing ground breaking in the leaked K20D and K200D info so far, assuming that they are reasonably accurate.
The new sensor is groundbreaking, but you can't tell that from "14Mp CMOS APS-C".
The images will show it...
11-22-2007, 07:10 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by RMabo Quote
How can you say that when the whole specification list is not released yet and the performance is not tested against the D300? Do you have some special inside information about the K20D that I have not?
Hi Roland,
Just speculation on my part from what I think Pentax is trying to do. It seems to me the price point will be a little under the Canon 40D and if it is it will be close to impossible for Pentax to match the Nikon D300. That being said, I must admit the enthusiasm being expressed by Chris and Ben is making me doubt my assessment a little. If it does come in with D300 type specs and IQ, and is priced around the 40D level, Ben's claim that it will set the standard for APS-C type cameras could be called pessimistic.

I just can't see Pentax coming out at a higher price than $1,200 to $1,300 because that is their market. If that is right and it matches D300 specs we will all be standing in line waiting for one. And waiting and waiting because the demand would be extraordinary.

After following the DSLR market for 1 1/2 years I put a deposit on my K10D before it was officially announced and got it at the end of last November. It was a great buy then and at present pricing it's an absolute steal. A K20D with close to D300 specs, the size of a K10D, and the price of a 40D would be a back ordered item for a year.

Regards,

Ken
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