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09-18-2011, 10:32 AM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You cannot have k-mount mirrorless in a smaller body than a K-r. The k-mount is an SLR mount. The option exists for an adapter, but it will add substantial bulk and cost.

This is an announcement of a new mount.
You sure, the Km and the Kx are smaller than the Kr


ps. over a new mount.
The K-mount is designed for 135formatt lenses not for APS-C.
If they will take the plunge to make a mount for APS-C they could go smaller with their DSLR and their lenses, they can also make their lenses faster.
DA*16-50 f/2 & DA*50-135 f/2 and f/1.2 and f1 primes sounds good to my ears ^^

09-18-2011, 10:36 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You cannot have k-mount mirrorless in a smaller body. . . The option exists for an adapter, but it will add substantial bulk and cost.
I also don't see why not. However, I prefer (need) a camera that is big enough for both my hands to hold it firmly; and then there needs to be enough room for the great external buttons/wheels we rely on so much. There is a point where a camera gets so small that the hands/fingers are too close and interfer with each other as well as with my face too! Lighter plus less noise and movement (from mirror) . . . that would enough; and then keep the Q (or whatever) for a compact with interchangeable lenses.
09-18-2011, 11:12 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You want to mount a DA*300/2.8 on a collapsible mount?
What's the point of mounting a non-existing lens on a non-existing camera?

By the way, ever heard of tripod collars on a lens?
09-18-2011, 11:54 AM   #49
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Interesting, this article seems to confirm the tidbit of information I received in July....

What I wrote:
QuoteQuote:
So I heard today there is a large sensor K-mount mirrorless camera still in the works. The information comes around 3 steps down the information chain from Pentax. As I had a hard time believing it myself I'll just say it's a baseless rumor at this point.

- It will be announced next spring. Fall looks to be a dead horse for all of the camera companies due to the natural disaster.

- It will use the K-mount and somehow be only slightly thicker than the Sony NEX system.

- The existing k-mount lenses will work in a fashion. Newer lenses designed specifically for the camera will have the back element as close to the sensor as possible or use other tricks to make them extremely compact.
What we see right now is Pentax/Hoya, but I'm looking forward to seeing what Pentax/Ricoh can do in the future.

09-18-2011, 11:59 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
I hope Pentax approach their serious mirrorless plans very carefully.

I've had a NEX-5 for about 6 months now and I still have very mixed feelings about it. It is unusable for birding. It is unusable in bright light, even with a loupe. The menu system and associated camera controls are a big usability fail. The non-standard hotshoe is just a dumb idea. Etc. The nicest things about it are the ability to use the tiltable rear display as a waist-level finder, and the generally good IQ.

Doing mirrorless isn't a panacea for anything. It is possible to do mirrorless poorly, so if Pentax go down this path I hope they study what everyone else is doing very carefully, and learn what works and what doesn't.
Well put.


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09-18-2011, 12:01 PM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by UdonUdon Quote
Does this mean we won't be hearing "what's a Pentax?" as much in the future?


I'd say that's Ricoh's intent, yes.

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09-18-2011, 12:06 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Well I hope there will be something new and big. Mirrorless with adapting current K-mount lenses with an adapter would work great.

Problem with all those big sensor mirrorless camera's is heating of the sensor and draining of battery. Both make them useless for professional work.

How big is that sensor?
I don't believe its possible to cool a large sensor very easily when its mounted for SR. Thats probably why Sony mounted the NEX sensor solidly to the back of the camera - i.e. better heat transfer

It wouldn't bother me at all to eliminate SR for a compact APS sensor camera as a compromise for better heat transfer and may be more inexpensive

QuoteOriginally posted by russell2pi Quote
I was sold on mirrorless for some time but thankfully lack of funds blocked me from acting upon it. (Still yet to find an option with IBIS, quality EVF and good lens selection.)

What drew me to mirrorless was the fact that size and styling were similar to the film SLRs to which I am accustomed (Olympus OM series). Really, there is no reason why DSLRs could not follow the same form factor, AND offer a 35-mm sensor rather than a small APS-C or a tiny 4/3 sensor. It really makes zero sense why the mirrorless / EVF design needs to be profferred as the sole solution to DSLR fugly factor. There is no reason why a DLSR could not be built to the same vintage style and size as we have grown accustomed to, while still offering the advatanges of an optical viewfinder, phase AF and superior sensor size. All it would take is the courage to eschew the the rounded edges, pentaprism snout and hand grip.

I suppose it's more profitable instead to let the X-100s etc become the norm and then come out with the latest new innovation, the "reflex digital camera"!

In fact, further to this, I really can't understand why these fancy new cameras still can't offer the size and brightness of viewfinder image I can get from a used film SLR available for pocket change.
There is one advantage of being late into the mirrorless market, one gets to learn from the early mistakes of other mfrs. I'll definitely wait after this announcement to see what Pentax/Ricoh come up with.

QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
I hope Pentax approach their serious mirrorless plans very carefully.

I've had a NEX-5 for about 6 months now and I still have very mixed feelings about it. It is unusable for birding. It is unusable in bright light, even with a loupe. The menu system and associated camera controls are a big usability fail. The non-standard hotshoe is just a dumb idea. Etc. The nicest things about it are the ability to use the tiltable rear display as a waist-level finder, and the generally good IQ.

Doing mirrorless isn't a panacea for anything. It is possible to do mirrorless poorly, so if Pentax go down this path I hope they study what everyone else is doing very carefully, and learn what works and what doesn't.
Yes, totally agree

QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
Some comments on some comments:

* I only quoted an excerpt, to entice y'all to READ THE WHOLE THANG!
* "A new mirrorless camera will be developed..." doesn't preclude GXR mountors.
* It also doesn't preclude bodies with existing mounts and adapters.
* I'll forgive the article's translation clumsiness. I've seen worse.
* Ricoh seems to clearly consider cameras an important business.
* I interpret "being on par" as "Ricoh will eat Canon's lunch".
* Photography is in a transformative era. Expect surprising news.
Guys don't like to ask for directions when lost, and don't "READ THE WHOLE THANG!"

I know that Ricoh's announcement doesn't preclude GXR modules, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of market excitement or buzz over the GXR concept - or am i mistaken on that. Of course there is no reason for Ricoh not to keep more than once compact concept going until they find the breakthru item.

There was a follow-post to your by someone who read the "WHOLE THANG", to the effect that Ricoh wants to "close the gap" with Canonikon. I think this is great news and i don't think it has to be that expensive for them to do so. They need to fix some problems with PTTL flash, SDM, and issue a coupla long lenses for the wildlife photograhers and Pentax is back in business in a big way. These are all write-off costs.

Canon and Nikon do have one system weakness in common, i think. They are relying on these big heavy lenses with the lens shake reduction. After hiking into a remote ocean beach this last weekend, which included a scramble down a relatively steep bluff, I'm more convinced than ever that big and heavy are not attractive selling points for anyone but road side shooters. They'll buy them if thats all there is, but Pentax hopefully will offer an alternative.

Anyone who leaves Pentax now is leaving before the party starts.

Last edited by philbaum; 09-18-2011 at 12:22 PM.
09-18-2011, 12:12 PM   #53
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FF

QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
...

"Bringing on par", if, again, we can believe the translation, could mean several things, such as matching the quality of the other manufacturers (I don't believe there's much, if anything, in that), matching the features offered by the others (ditto), matching the range of lenses offered for the existing camera model range, or matching the full extent of the range of cameras offered.

I'm sure I don't need to expand on that last one for a lot of people who follow this Forum.

....

Nope!

But feel free to anyway. It's been at least a week since we had one of those threads.


.
.

09-18-2011, 12:35 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
I'd say that's Ricoh's intent, yes.

.
I still dont see any clear interest in the two labels Ricoh and Pentax coexiting in the photo business for the better of both : unless product lines are well enough differentiated, and Ricoh keeps it's existing "niche" playground... otherwise, this sounds to me quite uncoherent with the target to put Pentax at CaNikon's level...
09-18-2011, 12:46 PM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
Guys don't like to ask for directions when lost, and don't "READ THE WHOLE THANG!"

I know that Ricoh's announcement doesn't preclude GXR modules, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of market excitement or buzz over the GXR concept - or am i mistaken on that. Of course there is no reason for Ricoh not to keep more than once compact concept going until they find the breakthru item.

There was a follow-post to your by someone who read the "WHOLE THANG", to the effect that Ricoh wants to "close the gap" with Canonikon. I think this is great news and i don't think it has to be that expensive for them to do so. They need to fix some problems with PTTL flash, SDM, and issue a coupla long lenses for the wildlife photograhers and Pentax is back in business in a big way. These are all write-off costs.

Canon and Nikon do have one system weakness in common, i think. They are relying on these big heavy lenses with the lens shake reduction. After hiking into a remote ocean beach this last weekend, which included a scramble down a relatively steep bluff, I'm more convinced than ever that big and heavy are not attractive selling points for anyone but road side shooters. They'll buy them if thats all there is, but Pentax hopefully will offer an alternative.

Anyone who leaves Pentax now is leaving before the party starts.
I totaly agree to that, the best information is here : Ricoh have real ambitions for Pentax.
09-18-2011, 12:49 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote

Anyone who leaves Pentax now is leaving before the party starts.
Well put!
09-18-2011, 12:55 PM   #57
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There is something like taking too much hay on your fork, to use a Dutch proverb.

If this new CSC comes with a new lens mount i doubt it will work, i just don't see them supporting 4 different lens mounts, i already find 3 much for such a small company. Canon and nikon only have 1 mount and the rest mostly have 2.
If this new CSC will be something like the other cameras on the market, then i hope it have some unique selling points because the market doesn't seem so big to me and with Nikon pentax must compete against 5 others. I think the Q will have more success because it's so different from the rest.
Good luck i say...
09-18-2011, 01:45 PM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
I still don't see any clear interest in the two labels Ricoh and Pentax coexisting in the photo business for the better of both : unless product lines are well enough differentiated, and Ricoh keeps it's existing "niche" playground... otherwise, this sounds to me quite incoherent with the target to put Pentax at CaNikon's level...
That is precisely their point:

"Ricoh will offer characteristic compact cameras under its own label, while trying to bring the Pentax brand on par with Nikon Corp. and Canon Inc. in interchangeable-lens cameras (...)"

I presume "characteristic" is a poor translation for "specific", "niche", "special", etc.
09-18-2011, 02:27 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by bluespearbone Quote
Mirrorless that accepts the DA 40mm? Cannot say am averse to the pocketable notion.
Try an MFT camera with a K adapter. Olympus and Panasonic have been giving us this option for years.

QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
Hmm... "will develop" is actually a little disappointing for those of us that were hoping for a large sensor pentax milc already this fall.
All that R&D effort instead went into the Q.

QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
I absolutely adore my K5 and K20D. Consider me a fanboy. But MILC is going to be Pentax' way, then I'll be forced to switch to a system that's more pro.
Will the fact Pentax makes products you don't want immediately turn all the Pentax products you do like to cheese?
09-18-2011, 02:31 PM   #60
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Be interesting to see if it adopts the same "price high, sell few" approach. I'm thinking yes.
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