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12-19-2007, 10:10 AM   #16
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JMS, Who is talking about mode dial?
I too briefly played around with a used Super A years back. The camera operates exactly like the ME, ME Super, MV, MG in aperture priority. Where it differs is that in addition it offered shutter priority AE and programme AE, but it could only do so only with an A-lens, which allows stepless aperture control by the camera.

With today's cameras, aperture control is managed via the camera body. So even if you did use Av mode, the aperture is dialled in on camera and no longer on the lens.

12-19-2007, 02:26 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote
JMS, Who is talking about mode dial?
I too briefly played around with a used Super A years back. The camera operates exactly like the ME, ME Super, MV, MG in aperture priority. Where it differs is that in addition it offered shutter priority AE and programme AE, but it could only do so only with an A-lens, which allows stepless aperture control by the camera.

With today's cameras, aperture control is managed via the camera body. So even if you did use Av mode, the aperture is dialled in on camera and no longer on the lens.
The point of the metering tab reader is this:

It will allow open-aperture metering with K- and M-series lenses.
12-19-2007, 04:29 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote
Seriously, you should be asking this question 25 years ago. If you know the rationale why Pentax introduced the A series lenses back when the Pentax Super A (aka Super Program) and Pentax Program A (aka Program Plus) SLR cameras were introduced, you will have figured out why use of M42, K and M series lenses requires the pressing of the AE-L button to determine a stop down meter reading on the current DSLR cameras.

If you compare Nikon for example, you can mount an AIS manual lens on a D70/D50/D80/D40 but there is no exposure readout. Only the more expensive D200 allows that. As for Canon, they completely abandoned their breech-lock FD lenses when they went AF. So count your blessings the Pentax legacy lenses can be used and you can get an exposure reading, albeit in M mode.
I should not be asking this question 25 years ago because to my knowledge it worked fine until some years ago (until the MZ30/50/60 someone said earlier in this thread). oh well 10 years then but who cares . Anyway I know why I have to press that little button but not why pentax insists on having me do it.

So in practice (and I'm going to get lynched for this) not Pentax but Nikon has the best backward compatibility? If you can meter properly with AIS lenses on a D200, Nikon goes back a year or so more with full compatibility... I have no idea how well the D200 goes together with old lenses, do they meter properly without having to do a lot of extra mumbojumbo?

Let's see if we don't get a lot of replies on that last statement
12-19-2007, 05:03 PM   #19
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Nobody is going to lynch you

With the D200 to use older non-CPU manual lenses you'd have to:
Select the Shooting Menu > Select Non-CPU lens data > Set the Focal Length >Set the Maximum Aperture

There is another way using the Custom Menu but it involves more steps. With non-CPU lenses you cannot shoot in shutter priority or programme exposure mode. That is similar to the situation with the M42, K and M series lenses.

Bottom line is nobody can stop you from using you old Pentax lens just that you have to live with the limited functionality. Except that I would hardly call them "problems".


Last edited by creampuff; 12-19-2007 at 05:11 PM. Reason: typo
12-20-2007, 02:35 AM   #20
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AIS lenses are equivalent more or less to A lenses ?

If that the case, I fail to see where Nikon provides anything more than Pentax.
12-20-2007, 03:24 AM   #21
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-Creampuff-
I almost exclusively shoot in fully manual mode (only very rarely in aperture priority), and I know that -K -M and M42 lenses don't have the electronics needed to shoot shutter priority so I just looking for a functional fully manual mode. If getting it (on any given brand) involves pre setting something in a menu it's not a big problem.

Configuring the camera before shooting with a lens I don't see as much of a problem, just that extra work that you have to do for every single shoot. To keep the mechanism for 15 years after the A lenses were introduced and the just drop it for no specific reason I think is a little displeasing.

-thibs-
I don't know if AIS lenses are the equivalent of A lenses, but if they are that would only give Nikon one or two years more compatibility. (AIS introduced 1981, A introduced 1982-83). In practice not worth much
12-20-2007, 03:41 AM   #22
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There is slowly but surely a resurgence of interest back towards manual focus lenses (Voigtlander, Cosina, Zeiss) in part because:

- retro is in!
- AF lenses have their focusing issues
- the build quality of MF lenses (they don't make 'em like they used to)
- more people want total control of their focusing
- more people are into macro
- MF lenses can offer better value

However the companies know that with the exception of focusing, consumers will want to expect to have auto exposure for all exposure modes, so A-type lenses are the way to go.
12-20-2007, 07:56 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote
There is slowly but surely a resurgence of interest back towards manual focus lenses (Voigtlander, Cosina, Zeiss) in part because:

- retro is in!
- AF lenses have their focusing issues
- the build quality of MF lenses (they don't make 'em like they used to)
- more people want total control of their focusing
- more people are into macro
- MF lenses can offer better value

However the companies know that with the exception of focusing, consumers will want to expect to have auto exposure for all exposure modes, so A-type lenses are the way to go.
You forgot:
- Patents protecting those mounts expired recently (P-KA, electrical F-mount).

12-21-2007, 09:59 AM   #24
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there is a very simple set of possible solutions to the issue of K mount lenses on pentax cameras.

I will speak of controls using the K10D as the example because that is what I own.

Use K mount with P-TTL

solution 1.

Press the green button, and do not change shutter speed to suit light as it now does, but simply calculate change in light (F stops) to calibrate P-TTL

solution 2

Allow entry of max and min apature like you do for shutter speed, and ideally have a small database ~5 lenses, that you input to match your K mount kit. leave the lens in min apature and then let the camera control the apature just like it does now on KA lenses. The only differece is that the actuating lever motion needs to be re-scalled. KA and newer lenses the apature area was linear with motion, with K mount, it is diameter that is linear with motion, but this is just software.

Note solution 2 would allow for full automatic functions.

Both these have been reported to Pentax as useful software upgrades. See my "all I want for Christmas is.... thread
12-21-2007, 11:05 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
You forgot:
- Patents protecting those mounts expired recently (P-KA, electrical F-mount).
Well, I see pentax moving beyond all the Pre- auto focus lenses. All ready the auto zoom flashes don't zoom because they don't know what the focal length of the pre F series lenses are,
and if the add auto calibration for DA* SDMs and ultimately (my guess is in a few years) drop
the 'screw drive' support in the bodies, the will make life a little miserable for all pre-SDM lenses
while not exactly 'not supporting them'
12-22-2007, 04:10 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by rvannatta Quote
Well, I see pentax moving beyond all the Pre- auto focus lenses. All ready the auto zoom flashes don't zoom because they don't know what the focal length of the pre F series lenses are
Well, as those lenses never sent any focal length information, what exactly is the problem ?
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