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yeatzee · 01-05-2012, 07:04 PM

Originally posted by mika.

Here's another. This is not high art. But the photographic quality of the pic is undeniably there. You'll never get anything like that from an APS-C sensor.

im not following..... why because its in B&W and grainy with shallow DOF? What is "The photographic quality" you seek? These three things? If so, film is your answer!

bobmaxja · 01-05-2012, 07:09 PM

Wow
MIka
I understand you dont see good photo, I dont see any you are showing are what I like. THat where the problem is. Your universe is not the one for many of us

JinDesu · 01-05-2012, 07:09 PM

Originally posted by mika.

You can't. Because of the crop factor, it's impossible with an APS-C sensor.

Oh gosh, only full frame? Why do you want full frame if the 645d out there does things your full frame can't /troll?

edit - what, there's no spoiler tags?

mika. · 01-05-2012, 07:12 PM

Originally posted by DeadJohn

Part of me finds this entertaining. Another part wants to cry.

mika, you seem to be judging photos primarily by their depth of field. More bokeh = more art to you.

Yes, "bokeh" has a lot to do with it. The APS-C sensor decompresses or expands the "bokeh", for lack of a better word, and thereby most always destroys the photographic quality of the photo.

mika. · 01-05-2012, 07:21 PM

Originally posted by yeatzee

im not following..... why because its in B&W and grainy with shallow DOF? What is "The photographic quality" you seek?

No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave. I can't believe there isn't one person here that understand what I'm trying to get at. Anyway, I'm sick of this. It's obvious I'm not getting through.

JohnBee · 01-05-2012, 07:21 PM

Originally posted by mika.

You can't. Because of the crop factor, it's impossible with an APS-C sensor.

Hmmm...

I hate to be the barer of bad news, but I'm fairly confident that every example you've posted to date can be replicated with an APS-C camera. The problem(I believe) is that you most likely don't feel that FF output can be replicated by a focal length, aperture and working distance formula. However as a fan of vintage lenses, I can assure you that its possible. Having said that I'd be more than happy to post some examples for you(if you want). Otherwise, just pretend I never posted this and carry on with your discussion.

yeatzee · 01-05-2012, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by mika.

No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave. I can't believe there isn't one person here that understand what I'm trying to get at. Anyway, I'm sick of this. It's obvious I'm not getting through.

First and foremost...

Quote:

Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about

Quote:

What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave

dont you need shallow DOF to see how the out of focus areas behave?

second: post an image which supports your arguement without shallow DOF

JohnBee · 01-05-2012, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by mika.

No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave.

You mean like this:

aleonx3 · 01-05-2012, 07:45 PM

I am "wow"ed by this claim... that nothing can compare to the pictures coming from the FF cameras. Obviously we see things differently... but that statement is pretty bold without any real substantiation IMHO.

Wait, that is not brand specific, I am sure those 7D, D300s or D7k users out there may have different opinions as well. What about those 645D users?

drougge · 01-05-2012, 07:52 PM

Another fun thing: His first example photo is not from a full frame camera. (It's taken with a Leica M8.)

sjwaldron · 01-05-2012, 07:54 PM

Originally posted by JinDesu

Oh gosh, only full frame? Why do you want full frame if the 645d out there does things your full frame can't /troll?

*flickr image*

edit - what, there's no spoiler tags?

While I'm not against examining the nose hairs of your friend, maybe you should use a link to a smaller version of that photo...

JinDesu · 01-05-2012, 08:02 PM

Originally posted by sjwaldron

While I'm not against examining the nose hairs of your friend, maybe you should use a link to a smaller version of that photo...

Yeah but then it isn't as fun

sjwaldron · 01-05-2012, 08:06 PM

Originally posted by JinDesu

Yeah but then it isn't as fun

I guess it's alright once the photo cached.

Captmatt · 01-05-2012, 08:14 PM

I've had the K5 for a while now and have not had a single problem operating in the cold of Alaska. Just curious what the problems are that plaque the K5, since I haven't had any. Thanks.

Parallax · 01-05-2012, 08:25 PM

Originally posted by mika.

It will take you 90% there. You can laugh like a dumb hyena all you want, the results are what they are. Garbage. This is not an attack on Pentax. This is an attack on the APS-C marketing scam.

Ah, yes. The old "It's not the photographer, it's the camera" argument. Everybody knows skill is not a factor in taking great photos.

01-05-2012, 07:21 PM	#141
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Originally posted by mika. You can't. Because of the crop factor, it's impossible with an APS-C sensor. Hmmm... I hate to be the barer of bad news, but I'm fairly confident that every example you've posted to date can be replicated with an APS-C camera. The problem(I believe) is that you most likely don't feel that FF output can be replicated by a focal length, aperture and working distance formula. However as a fan of vintage lenses, I can assure you that its possible. Having said that I'd be more than happy to post some examples for you(if you want). Otherwise, just pretend I never posted this and carry on with your discussion. Last edited by JohnBee; 01-05-2012 at 09:03 PM.

01-05-2012, 07:36 PM	#143
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Originally posted by mika. No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave. You mean like this: Last edited by JohnBee; 01-06-2012 at 07:17 PM.

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01-05-2012, 07:04 PM	#136
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675	Originally posted by mika. Here's another. This is not high art. But the photographic quality of the pic is undeniably there. You'll never get anything like that from an APS-C sensor. im not following..... why because its in B&W and grainy with shallow DOF? What is "The photographic quality" you seek? These three things? If so, film is your answer!

01-05-2012, 07:09 PM	#137
bobmaxja Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Laval, Quebec Canada Posts: 2,171	Wow MIka I understand you dont see good photo, I dont see any you are showing are what I like. THat where the problem is. Your universe is not the one for many of us

01-05-2012, 07:09 PM	#138
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	Originally posted by mika. You can't. Because of the crop factor, it's impossible with an APS-C sensor. Oh gosh, only full frame? Why do you want full frame if the 645d out there does things your full frame can't /troll? edit - what, there's no spoiler tags?

01-05-2012, 07:12 PM	#139
mika. Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Canada Photos: Albums Posts: 161	Originally posted by DeadJohn Part of me finds this entertaining. Another part wants to cry. mika, you seem to be judging photos primarily by their depth of field. More bokeh = more art to you. Yes, "bokeh" has a lot to do with it. The APS-C sensor decompresses or expands the "bokeh", for lack of a better word, and thereby most always destroys the photographic quality of the photo.

01-05-2012, 07:21 PM	#140
mika. Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Canada Photos: Albums Posts: 161	Originally posted by yeatzee im not following..... why because its in B&W and grainy with shallow DOF? What is "The photographic quality" you seek? No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave. I can't believe there isn't one person here that understand what I'm trying to get at. Anyway, I'm sick of this. It's obvious I'm not getting through.

01-05-2012, 07:30 PM	#142
yeatzee Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Temecula Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,675	Originally posted by mika. No, no, no! Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave. I can't believe there isn't one person here that understand what I'm trying to get at. Anyway, I'm sick of this. It's obvious I'm not getting through. First and foremost... Quote: Shallow DOF is not what I'm talking about Quote: What I'm talking about is how the areas that are out of focus behave dont you need shallow DOF to see how the out of focus areas behave? second: post an image which supports your arguement without shallow DOF

01-05-2012, 07:45 PM	#144
aleonx3 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brampton, Ontario Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,996	I am "wow"ed by this claim... that nothing can compare to the pictures coming from the FF cameras. Obviously we see things differently... but that statement is pretty bold without any real substantiation IMHO. Wait, that is not brand specific, I am sure those 7D, D300s or D7k users out there may have different opinions as well. What about those 645D users?

01-05-2012, 07:52 PM	#145
drougge Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Malmö Photos: Gallery Posts: 787	Another fun thing: His first example photo is not from a full frame camera. (It's taken with a Leica M8.)

01-05-2012, 07:54 PM	#146
sjwaldron Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,235	Originally posted by JinDesu Oh gosh, only full frame? Why do you want full frame if the 645d out there does things your full frame can't /troll? flickr image edit - what, there's no spoiler tags? While I'm not against examining the nose hairs of your friend, maybe you should use a link to a smaller version of that photo...

01-05-2012, 08:02 PM	#147
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	Originally posted by sjwaldron While I'm not against examining the nose hairs of your friend, maybe you should use a link to a smaller version of that photo... Yeah but then it isn't as fun

01-05-2012, 08:06 PM	#148
sjwaldron Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,235	Originally posted by JinDesu Yeah but then it isn't as fun I guess it's alright once the photo cached.

01-05-2012, 08:14 PM	#149
Captmatt Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Homer, Alaska Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 101	I've had the K5 for a while now and have not had a single problem operating in the cold of Alaska. Just curious what the problems are that plaque the K5, since I haven't had any. Thanks.

01-05-2012, 08:25 PM	#150
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,333	Originally posted by mika. It will take you 90% there. You can laugh like a dumb hyena all you want, the results are what they are. Garbage. This is not an attack on Pentax. This is an attack on the APS-C marketing scam. Ah, yes. The old "It's not the photographer, it's the camera" argument. Everybody knows skill is not a factor in taking great photos.

*RUMORS, careful!*Good news and bad news (K5 going, something else coming)

Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!

RUMORS, careful!Good news and bad news (K5 going, something else coming)