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02-03-2012, 02:44 PM   #46
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This whole thing reminds me of all the tech journalists who wrote off the iPad as "just a big iPod touch" and "not a real computer".

I'm not saying the K-01 is going to be the massive smash that the iPad is, but I think it's positioned to sell quite well.

02-04-2012, 05:13 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by drougge Quote
As you meant the question I think so (but it's not a market I follow), but as stated, no. There are various medium format rangefinders, a few large format rangefinders and of course normal large format cameras. All without mirror, many with interchangeable lenses, and certainly bigger than the K-01.
Thanks. Is there a word normally used for the kind of cameras I mean? Mirrorless, through-the-lens, interchangeable lens cameras.

Since asking the question it also occurred to me that neither the largest nor the smallest is a gimmick. The Q arguably delivers the best image quality in a truly pocketable camera (I consider MFT too large for pockets). The K-01 will hopefully deliver the best image quality for any mirrorless TTL ILC, and also have the widest range of native lenses.
02-04-2012, 06:29 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by Brangdon Quote
The K-01 will hopefully deliver the best image quality for any mirrorless TTL ILC, and also have the widest range of native lenses.
It will hopefully be close to the best in IQ, but I think Sony NEX7 will beat it, at least on base ISO. Ricoh M-module might do it too.

The wide range of native lenses might be sacrificed by usability, as AF might be very slow on many K-mount lenses. And screw-drive lenses is not the best for those looking for AF in video. For K-01 to be reasonably successful I think Pentax need to design a new kit zoom with silent AF and smallest possible size, maybe something like Panansonic X kit-lens.
02-04-2012, 07:11 AM   #49
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Honestly I don't think this camera was designed or intended for people like most of us. Its a less intimidating step up than a dslr for people that use point and shoot cameras and it functions like one. It could possibly fall into the niche of "this is the best point and shoot you can get", not "this is the new alternative to the dslr". I could see it being coined as a point and shoot that can take pictures like a dslr.

I can also see it appealing to some here that have 3 or more bodies. If you have the money to throw around a thousand dollars for a new body willy nilly, and get the latest greatest thing, well this is the smallest of the lineup to add to your collection. When they come out with a full frame you can get that too (not putting down the full frame idea, I would love one). With a full frame, a few apsc bodies, and the k-01 you can have the full range of sizes of k mount cameras. Honestly if 1000$ isn't a lot of money to you, it is in the realm of the smallest dslr like camera, right (with aps-c etc)?

Pentax is obviously going for the wealthy, trendy crowd with this one too and while that is a big gamble, it could work. The influx of money could go toward full frame development for the rest of us. It has a retro mixed with cheap plastic dollar store toy slr camera look that could appeal to that crowd. just look at marc newson's web page and look at the stuff he has designed.
Marc Newson Ltd
I'm not into the esoteric, I'm too rich for my own good and I need something special looking kind of look but this could appeal to that crowd, and they are a crowd with money to spend.
Here is a mark newson chair that cost 10,000$ new, and is selling for 5600$ used.
Marc Newson Gluon Lounge Chair & Ottoman in Orange Ultra Suede for ...
If you are the kind of person that spends 10k on a chair, then the looks of this camera might appeal to you. It looks special (special needs) and you need something different that nobody else has so you can be special too.

Off topic but seeing a little about marc newson, it reminds me of the southpark episode where they keep calling john edwards (the psychic) a douche and he keeps freaking out yelling he is not a douche. In the end, aliens come down to earth and give him the biggest douche in the universe award winning out against a real giant douche creature. Of course quite a few people buy into john edwards. Regardless, look around and see what anything that he has designed sells for. The "I have more money than I could every know what to do with and I spend 10k on a chair" crowd are not exactly a bad crowd to have buying your expensive electronics.

All kidding aside about mark newson and what a douche he is, like others have said, this camera seems to be more targeted at new markets, and less at the typical pentax dslr user (though for what it is it seems a very capable camera functionally at least). If it brings a lot of money to to pentax and makes them stronger, it could be very good for us perhaps in the form of a full frame dslr and or a better cheaper, aps-c dslr. I'm really hoping this trend of a k-5 sensor camera for 700$ continues into whatever they are are planning for a k-r replacement. Who knows. Maybe if the full frame is the k-5 replacement, then a redesigned, cheaper k-5 like camera might be the k-r replacement? Of course, like most, my wishful thinking follows along the lines of what I would like to buy (a cheaper k-5 like camera or if I could ever afford it, a full frame dslr).

Almost forgot. I can not have a post about marc newson that only says the word douche 5 times (douche, douche, douche, douche, douche). Thats better (Hopefully everyone can take it as a joke and not get all offended and argumentative).

02-04-2012, 07:47 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fogel70 Quote
It will hopefully be close to the best in IQ, but I think Sony NEX7 will beat it, at least on base ISO. Ricoh M-module might do it too.

The wide range of native lenses might be sacrificed by usability, as AF might be very slow on many K-mount lenses. And screw-drive lenses is not the best for those looking for AF in video. For K-01 to be reasonably successful I think Pentax need to design a new kit zoom with silent AF and smallest possible size, maybe something like Panansonic X kit-lens.
Now that autofocus and point and shoot customer base is mentioned. I've considered a thought. Expecting the target market of the K-01 to be these people... there are a couple of things that Pentax better get right if it is to be a successful gamble for Pentax. I suspect that is Autofocus and the P button. These point and shoot no VF using trendy customer base do not want to become bogged down learning about their camera's quirks in order to get it to focus appropriately or take a good picture... They don't want to learn about exposure, iso, shutter speed etc. they just want it to focus every time and take a good picture indoors without looking blurry. I hope Pentax learned from the K-5 release and has fixed its focusing issues and I also hope that the P mode takes advantage of the K5 sensor dynamic range and to take crisp blur free pictures in dark environments while being hand held a foot away from your face... think Ipad... people are willing to pay an arm and a leg for it not just because of design. It generally has almost ZERO compatibility issues and just works. It's customer base has come to love that even if it limits their options.

That P button better be magic!
02-04-2012, 08:49 AM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by Brangdon Quote
Thanks. Is there a word normally used for the kind of cameras I mean? Mirrorless, through-the-lens, interchangeable lens cameras.
Not that I know, no. "Digital MILC" is probably clear enough, and has the benefit of sounding stupid too. (It technically applies to large format with a digital back, but so does your longer description. Yours also applies for large format with film, mine also applies to digital Leica, but I don't think anyone will be confused in practice. MILC seems to be used only for digital cameras with live view, as far as I've seen. But it sounds stupider with the digital prefix, and I'm all about the stupid.)
02-04-2012, 09:07 AM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mister Horrible Quote
In order for it to be a "hit" people have to buy it, not just comment on it.

And quite frankly, I'm confused at who they are marketing to: point & shoot upgraders who happen to have old k-glass?
Indeed. The point everyone seems to miss is that the average consumer doesn't buy 'a mirrorless camera'. They just buy a camera. The fact that it doesn't have a mirror is totally lost on the average retail customer. What matters to them is how big it is and whether the salesman says it's good. With that in mind, the K-01 will be a flop because this sort of customer will buy a NEX, PEN or G. They don't care about legacy glass.
02-04-2012, 09:42 AM   #53
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You're right... the legacy glass probably won't matter initially... that's where its quirky looks come in. They'll meander on over to Pentax to see what that quirky looking camera looks like (as long as it's available to look at) and Pentax's build quality generally is much better than the plastic offerings from other retailers. It always feels solid... Interest from outside the established Pentax community will IMO be much greater just from looks alone. I'm also confident it will take great pictures with the K5 sensor. I just hope there are not QC focusing issues and that the P mode is VERY user friendly... the point and shoot customer base wants it easy and familiar.

02-04-2012, 05:39 PM   #54
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How many folks currently using point and shoots including camera phones have actually used a viewfinder? On this forum we all ask for a viewfinder because we have cut our teeth on cameras with viewfinders., but much of the market out there doesn't use them and have never used them. The K01 just happens to be a well featured point and shoot interchangeable lens camera that offers a signifiant upgrade while using a simplified set of outside tools to help people to take pictures.
02-04-2012, 06:12 PM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fogel70 Quote
And screw-drive lenses is not the best for those looking for AF in video. For K-01 to be reasonably successful I think Pentax need to design a new kit zoom with silent AF and smallest possible size, maybe something like Panansonic X kit-lens.
I couldn't agree more. Newcomers to ILCs want something that feels sophisticated. While traditional, Pentax's screw drive sounds Victorian compared to competitors' near-silent offerings. BUT, please keep the screw drive in there regardless. It's not a real camera if it doesn't have a built-in motor!
02-04-2012, 06:14 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
I couldn't agree more. Newcomers to ILCs want something that feels sophisticated. While traditional, Pentax's screw drive sounds Victorian compared to competitors' near-silent offerings. BUT, please keep the screw drive in there regardless. It's not a real camera if it doesn't have a built-in motor!
The irony of this post is sublime.
02-04-2012, 08:14 PM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
The irony of this post is sublime.
Depends on what decade you are from.
02-04-2012, 09:33 PM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
The irony of this post is sublime.
Why? What's wrong with preferring a product that can cater for both newcomers' preferences as well as the needs of existing owners of older K auto glass?

Take off your blinkers. :ugh:
02-04-2012, 09:59 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
Why? What's wrong with preferring a product that can cater for both newcomers' preferences as well as the needs of existing owners of older K auto glass?

Take off your blinkers. :ugh:
You criticize the damned noisy screw drive - but damn you Pentax, don't dare take it out!!
02-04-2012, 11:24 PM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
You criticize the damned noisy screw drive - but damn you Pentax, don't dare take it out!!
Well, it IS noisy! I've had people look at me when my 55-300 has been hunting back and forth as if I'm using something powered by steam!

Don't take it away, because it's useful.

But a new user in shop comparing products will certainly feel the Pentax is less sophisticated if all the competition have silent motors in their kit lens and Pentax uses the screw.
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