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02-04-2012, 03:43 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Luin Gor Quote
I'm not a pro, so of course I would not be interested in a "Pro" lens, like for instance 600 / f4 weighing 5 kilos and 5 000 $.

As a non pro, I hope they will release a lens :

- hand heldable (at least for a few minutes), about 1,5 kilos or 2 maximum
- affordable (it depends on the budget of each Pentaxian), about 2 000 $ maximum
- image quality comparable to DA* 200 and DA* 300

I guess a 500 / f5.6 covering only the aps-c format (therefore smaller and lighter) might be compatible with these specifications...

I like a lot the 400 / 5.6 from Canon...
My vote goes to this speculation

02-04-2012, 05:36 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
A slower lens isn't a crippled one.

IMHO, fast lenses like 300/2.8 or 600/4 are a thing of the past. Not because they are expensive (they are). But because modern bodies with their ISO capabilities and SR simply don't need it to a degree that the burden to carry and handle them is justified. Sport events from a predetermined position using a tripod may reain the only exception. But those arevTV events with good light, so ...

Assuming the lens is tack sharp fully open, I consider F5.6 (or F5.4 if an AF TC requires it) to be the new sweet spot.
That is an extremely bold statement? I will remember that.
02-04-2012, 05:56 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Luin Gor Quote
I guess a 500 / f5.6 covering only the aps-c format (therefore smaller and lighter) might be compatible with these specifications...
It is, at least it is according to my price/weight model.

However, as long as image-circle << focal-length and image-circle < focal-length/Fstop, a further reduction of the image circle doesn't reduce cost anymore. So, APSC or FF doesn't make a difference and the lens will be FF anyway.
02-04-2012, 05:58 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by garyk Quote
That is an extremely bold statement? I will remember that.
To clarify, the statement was for 500mm+.

02-04-2012, 06:22 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
It's a green dot and that means DA and not DA*
True. Although right now I think it'd be "FA" anyway, and it could be a 'limited'.
02-04-2012, 07:45 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by garyk Quote
That is an extremely bold statement? I will remember that.
Bold? It is spot on.

I own an FA* 600/4 and at 7kg I haven't used it for years (my avatar is shot with it). When I use it I crank up the ISO (on a K-7), even in bright sunlight (I have read that wildlife photographers such as Franz Lanting do the same), and shoot at F:8 if I can.
Outdoor photographers needing long lenses will love the 560/5.6(?). I have read that many Canon and Nikon bird shooters switched from the 600/4 to the 500/4 for weight reasons even if they desperately needed the reach of the longer lens. This was in the film days when they shot at 100ISO. Now we have cropped sensors, SR and can shoot at astronomical ISO values compared to the film days with good results. Fast and long telephoto lenses aren't really worth the prohibitive cost and hassle anylonger.

In addition, such a lens will put Pentax in an unique position as no other manufacturer have a manageable and semi-affordable super telephoto lens in their line ups. The market for 600/4 lenses is extremely limited but many wants a long telephoto lens...

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 02-04-2012 at 07:52 AM.
02-04-2012, 07:52 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by ElJamoquio Quote
True. Although right now I think it'd be "FA" anyway, and it could be a 'limited'.
FA won't be designed any more since they aren't designed for digital.
If there will come a lens which are designed for FF image circle they would be called DFA and those lenses have a grey colour on the map.

And we are talking about the 550mm now, you really think it would be a limited lens?
02-04-2012, 07:56 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Bold? It is spot on.

I own an FA* 600/4 and at 7kg I haven't used it for years (my avatar is shot with it). When I use it I crank up the ISO (on a K-7), even in bright sunlight (I have read that wildlife photographers such as Franz Lanting do the same), and shoot at F:8 if I can.
Outdoor photographers needing long lenses will love the 560/5.6(?). I have read that many Canon and Nikon bird shooters switched from the 600/4 to the 500/4 for weight reasons even if they desperately needed the reach of the longer lens. This was in the film days when they shot at 100ISO. Now we have cropped sensors, SR and can shoot at astronomical ISO values compared to the film days with good results. Fast and long telephoto lenses aren't really worth the prohibitive cost and hassle anylonger.

In addition, such a lens will put Pentax in an unique position as no other manufacturer have a manageable and semi-affordable super telephoto lens in their line ups. The market for 600/4 lenses is extremely limited but many wants a long telephoto lens...
Thanks for the insight, makes sense

But don't you think it will be a slower aperture to reduce the cost of the lens, it's a DA after all?
I must say that i find it strange it's a DA to begin with, such a specialized lens can easily be a DA*.

02-04-2012, 08:03 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
Thanks for the insight, makes sense

But don't you think it will be a slower aperture to reduce the cost of the lens, it's a DA after all?
I must say that i find it strange it's a DA to begin with, such a specialized lens can easily be a DA*.
Slower than F:5.6 will make focusing difficult and hence is unlikely. A maximum aperture of 5.6 makes the lens easier to construct; it may not need the level of exotic glass that faster lenses may need. Hence the non star designation. There are many great non-star Pentax lenses..
02-04-2012, 08:08 AM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Bold? It is spot on.

I own an FA* 600/4 and at 7kg I haven't used it for years (my avatar is shot with it). When I use it I crank up the ISO (on a K-7), even in bright sunlight (I have read that wildlife photographers such as Franz Lanting do the same), and shoot at F:8 if I can.
Outdoor photographers needing long lenses will love the 560/5.6(?). I have read that many Canon and Nikon bird shooters switched from the 600/4 to the 500/4 for weight reasons even if they desperately needed the reach of the longer lens. This was in the film days when they shot at 100ISO. Now we have cropped sensors, SR and can shoot at astronomical ISO values compared to the film days with good results. Fast and long telephoto lenses aren't really worth the prohibitive cost and hassle anylonger.

In addition, such a lens will put Pentax in an unique position as no other manufacturer have a manageable and semi-affordable super telephoto lens in their line ups. The market for 600/4 lenses is extremely limited but many wants a long telephoto lens...
Hummm ok. I am just an observer here now mostly. So as I disagree with you on several points. It will be interesting to see how this unfolds.
I am personally hopping for the best.
Good luck with your new purchase. When it arrives.
02-04-2012, 08:18 AM - 1 Like   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Bold? It is spot on.

I own an FA* 600/4 and at 7kg I haven't used it for years (my avatar is shot with it). When I use it I crank up the ISO (on a K-7), even in bright sunlight (I have read that wildlife photographers such as Franz Lanting do the same), and shoot at F:8 if I can.
I have the A*600/5.6 and do the same thing.....shooting at f11 or f13. With my A*1200 I'll shoot around f18 if it is bright enough. There can be a problem with DOV at these focal lengths so I typically do so in hopes of getting both a sharper shot overall, but more specifically, trying to increase the dov on the subject. Not many want bird shot where only half the head is in focus. I'm not sure how much of a difference it makes (sounds like a good reason for me to take some test shots)

If anything, a 550mm at f5.6 might be more usable than a 550mm at f4 due to the lower weight, provided it's sharp wide open.

Here is 600mm, f13 and ISO 3200 on the K5

02-04-2012, 11:14 AM   #42
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Ouch, talk about a razor thin DOF ...

Which also means you lose resolution on such an aperture value on an APS-C sensor. A pity
02-04-2012, 11:28 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by garyk Quote
Hummm ok. I am just an observer here now mostly. So as I disagree with you on several points. It will be interesting to see how this unfolds.
I am personally hopping for the best.
Good luck with your new purchase. When it arrives.
I know you shoot in low light most of the time Gary. In my experience, as long as I have direct sunlight, the speed of the lens doesn't bother me much. I like my 500mm with the Kenko 1.5X teleconverter in direct light.

On a side note, I am curious to see if the "contrast detect autofocus" in the K-01 works better than the Safox IX. I saw around here that Falk Lumo developed something similar in 2008. I'm wondering if Pentax picked up on it.
02-04-2012, 11:32 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by SteveM Quote
I have the A*600/5.6 and do the same thing.....shooting at f11 or f13. With my A*1200 I'll shoot around f18 if it is bright enough. There can be a problem with DOV at these focal lengths so I typically do so in hopes of getting both a sharper shot overall, but more specifically, trying to increase the dov on the subject. Not many want bird shot where only half the head is in focus. I'm not sure how much of a difference it makes (sounds like a good reason for me to take some test shots)

If anything, a 550mm at f5.6 might be more usable than a 550mm at f4 due to the lower weight, provided it's sharp wide open.

Here is 600mm, f13 and ISO 3200 on the K5
I don't see any noise at all. My senses are pretty good at seeing noise in photos and I think that is something I learned to spot. I see noisy photos on flickr all of the time.
02-04-2012, 11:38 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
Thanks for the insight, makes sense

But don't you think it will be a slower aperture to reduce the cost of the lens, it's a DA after all?
I must say that i find it strange it's a DA to begin with, such a specialized lens can easily be a DA*.
Our 200 and 300mm DA*'s started off on the 2006 roadmap as DFA's with no star designation. I think you'll see a star get attached to the 550 when it's released.
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