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03-02-2012, 07:33 AM   #241
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When you take a 50mm 1.4 on APSC and use it to take closeups, then you'll get eyes in focus, and the ears nose out of focus. That true... But then you're just using is WRONG. Take a few steps back and get the whole person in focus, front to back, but with a beautifull bokeh.

03-02-2012, 07:42 AM   #242
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From my perspective, shooting my Nokton 58/1.4 @ 1.4 is narrow enough DOF on my APS-C, but most fast lenses (Nokton included) do not perform their best at max aperture. I'd much rather shoot my fast lenses stopped down a stop or two on a full frame and get similar bokeh with much better lens performance (potential vignetting and edge performance aside, but of course those are lessened by already stopping down).

Last edited by jeffshaddix; 03-02-2012 at 07:49 AM.
03-02-2012, 08:47 AM - 1 Like   #243
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So... 17 pages on this latest (or echoed) rumor in a few weeks. All I can say is, I will be very happy for my fellow Pentaxians who pine for a full-frame camera should Pentax actually bring one out. And I'll point out that while it was clearly impossible for Pentax to do this under Hoya ownership, Ricoh actually has the resources to make it happen. But... if it does happen, why do I suspect it will be a mirrorless device? Can the traditionalists handle that?

Meanwhile, it's all a moot point for me. I'm thrilled with the image quality provided by my APS-C cameras and am long past the point where I'll spend anything approaching $2000 for a camera body any more. I waited until I got my K-5 body new for under $1000, including tax, an extra Pentax OEM battery and the extended warranty from Pentax. Plus I have all of those DA Limiteds.

But I extend my support for all those who want a full-frame camera from Pentax.
03-02-2012, 09:02 AM   #244
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QuoteOriginally posted by Biro Quote
So... 17 pages on this latest (or echoed) rumor in a few weeks. All I can say is, I will be very happy for my fellow Pentaxians who pine for a full-frame camera should Pentax actually bring one out. And I'll point out that while it was clearly impossible for Pentax to do this under Hoya ownership, Ricoh actually has the resources to make it happen. But... if it does happen, why do I suspect it will be a mirrorless device? Can the traditionalists handle that?

Meanwhile, it's all a moot point for me. I'm thrilled with the image quality provided by my APS-C cameras and am long past the point where I'll spend anything approaching $2000 for a camera body any more. I waited until I got my K-5 body new for under $1000, including tax, an extra Pentax OEM battery and the extended warranty from Pentax. Plus I have all of those DA Limiteds.

But I extend my support for all those who want a full-frame camera from Pentax.
Same goes for me. I'm extremely happy with my K5 and the images it delivers. I want Pentax to bring out a succesfull FF body badly though. Eventhough I'm not going to buy it. I want it, because it's good for the brand.

I think there are some nice things for Pentax in future. Mr. Kondo, Ricoh's president, has been a Pentaxian for some years. That can't be bad, can it?

03-02-2012, 09:09 AM   #245
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QuoteOriginally posted by Asahiflex Quote


Of course, it's definitely a good camera (I wouldn't mind owning it!). But really, the MkIII is the camera the MkII should have been. I think current MkII shooters don't have a compelling reason to upgrade to the MkIII.
I think it really depends on the sensor performance, which I haven't really seen yet.
03-02-2012, 09:10 AM   #246
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Yep, the 5D mkIII leaves more hope for Pentax to get into the FF market IMHO. How does Canon think they can price it higher than the D800? Of course, we have yet to see actual market prices. But seriously, I'd buy the D800 leaps and bounds ahead of that new 5d...

Wow. Come on Pentax, get in the game – you can show these people how it's done!
03-02-2012, 09:13 AM   #247
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Yeah, I think the $500 bonus you get when you buy the D800 will help pay for a lens switcheroo...
03-02-2012, 09:17 AM   #248
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ubuntu_user Quote
How does Canon think they can price it higher than the D800?
The D800 was designed to be a game changer, apparently Canon didn't get the memo.

03-02-2012, 09:24 AM   #249
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QuoteOriginally posted by maxfield_photo Quote
The D800 was designed to be a game changer, apparently Canon didn't get the memo.
Yeah, I guess... I would think that the D800 may pull some Canon fans away? ...especially after they are let down by the new 5d!
03-02-2012, 10:39 AM   #250
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
All right, I'll ask again: where is that downwards spiral?
5DII is dropping $300 next week apparently . MSRP of the 5D3 is not what it will stay at for long. either the 5D2 will be totally discontinued and the drop is to clear it (and keeping the 5D3 higher is a way of holding the 5D2 price a bit) or the 5D2 will stay as the value proposition (and by fall then the 5D3 will drop to $3000 after launch (if like the D800 it sells at predicted rates without a drop they will hold the price)
Remember all these FF models are MIJ with higher cost of production as well, and as soon as production moves so will price.
As long as they can sell everything at the asking price nikon and canon will hold the price....until they are ready to change the market Or someone else comes in and provides competition
Depending on Sony's price on the rumoured 3 models that may be the game changer. Pentax cannot go in currently at cnikon prices they need to represent value in the market until they are more established in it. If canikon keep prices at 3-3500 then Pentax can come in at 2400 with the right model.
If you think FF (which is only in second generation at nikon) will not move down in price and squeeze from above you are sadly mistaken (lack of competition in the market is all that allows it to hold at the moment)
03-02-2012, 10:52 AM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
5DII is dropping $300 next week apparently . MSRP of the 5D3 is not what it will stay at for long. either the 5D2 will be totally discontinued and the drop is to clear it (and keeping the 5D3 higher is a way of holding the 5D2 price a bit) or the 5D2 will stay as the value proposition (and by fall then the 5D3 will drop to $3000 after launch (if like the D800 it sells at predicted rates without a drop they will hold the price)
Remember all these FF models are MIJ with higher cost of production as well, and as soon as production moves so will price.
As long as they can sell everything at the asking price nikon and canon will hold the price....until they are ready to change the market Or someone else comes in and provides competition
Depending on Sony's price on the rumoured 3 models that may be the game changer. Pentax cannot go in currently at cnikon prices they need to represent value in the market until they are more established in it. If canikon keep prices at 3-3500 then Pentax can come in at 2400 with the right model.
If you think FF (which is only in second generation at nikon) will not move down in price and squeeze from above you are sadly mistaken (lack of competition in the market is all that allows it to hold at the moment)
I'll believe it when I see it. As for Sony, I think the NEX 7 is a really fasciniting camera with no lenses. I'm just not sure they are game changers yet. Maybe one day. Maybe one day FF cameras will be $1500. I don't think that's in the next 2-3 years. I'd watch and see what Fuji does instead of Sony.
03-02-2012, 11:40 AM - 1 Like   #252
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QuoteOriginally posted by stanleyk Quote
I'll believe it when I see it. As for Sony, I think the NEX 7 is a really fasciniting camera with no lenses. I'm just not sure they are game changers yet. Maybe one day. Maybe one day FF cameras will be $1500. I don't think that's in the next 2-3 years. I'd watch and see what Fuji does instead of Sony.
According to Thom Hogan the D700 will drop to 2199 and Nikon will remove the MAP agreement fromit (freeing dealers to sell at lower prices) so 1999 is pretty much a given within a couple of months of that (if as it is rumoured it's staying in production)
Canon will drop the price of the 5 D2 next week by $300 (so 2199) and if they drop their MAP and keep it in production to rival Nikon then you have 2 cameras that will hit $2000 pretty fast. then cameras like the 7D (due for replacement have to change to compete - Canon now has the apsH sensor freed up from the high end so I wouldn't be surprised to see 7DmkII as apsH
Not too mention D400 when it comes will need to be something special to counter the D700 drop

In this environment where does Pentax go with a K5 replacement at 24MP and a launch price of $1500?

Focus on mid and low end apsc bodies???? oh yeah mirrorless is creeping up on that market. If Pentax isn't already into serious development of a FF i'd be very surprised. As for it's retail at launch well if they wanted to launch at 25-2700 they've missed the boat or will need a game changing product. there is lot's of cool stuff they could do but I doubt they will be able to hit with AF and Flash and Video systems to rival a D800 and still offer something unique so a lower price with something unique and improvements in those areas but not at this point to class leading levels (they just don't have the engineering depth currently to support that)
03-02-2012, 12:10 PM   #253
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
In this environment where does Pentax go with a K5 replacement at 24MP and a launch price of $1500?
You make it sound as though anyone willing to pay this price for a camera would automatically go for a "full frame". I believe that is a fallacy: I, for one, wouldn't. At least, not just for the sensor size's sake. And I'm fairly certain that at equal price, an APS-C camera would be better specified than a "full frame".
03-02-2012, 12:16 PM   #254
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QuoteOriginally posted by RBellavance Quote
You make it sound as though anyone willing to pay this price for a camera would automatically go for a "full frame". I believe that is a fallacy: I, for one, wouldn't. At least, not just for the sensor size's sake. And I'm fairly certain that at equal price, an APS-C camera would be better specified than a "full frame".
It doesn't have to be everyone. If the K5 replacement loses 25% of it's volume to a FF it's a big problem.
The other thing is attracting new users. with a selection of FF starting at a low price canikon have a huge edge even with people deciding on the apsC camera to buy. they already hafve an edge this just amplifies it. Like it or not the enthusiast end of the market will head into FF territory and it will become less viable for an enthusiast apsc model. not this year specifically but over the next few most definitely
03-02-2012, 12:19 PM   #255
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
Like it or not the enthusiast end of the market will head into FF territory and it will become less viable for an enthusiast apsc model. not this year specifically but over the next few most definitely
Do you mean the people with enthusiasts or cameras. If you mean actual people, then its already happening. Alot of people

Last edited by the swede; 03-02-2012 at 12:25 PM.
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