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JinDesu · 03-22-2012, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

LOL! Erm... I mean: Shame! Shame!

Seriously, does Porsche sell the 911 in America under a different name?!? That would be extremely silly.

Well, we do pronounce Porsche different from over in Europe.

Docrwm · 03-22-2012, 02:07 PM

Originally posted by JinDesu

Well, we do pronounce Porsche different from over in Europe.

SOME of us do so but not all of us. Also, the 911 predates the event.

Kunzite · 03-22-2012, 02:11 PM

thibs: Aren't you getting too personal, here?
"Pentax K-z" doesn't equal "11th september". There are good reasons to believe an US car name literally "11th september" or a camera called "Konzentrationslager fur Zivilpersonen" is intentional, while K-z a coincidence (maybe some Japanese manager though it sounds like "kaze" and that's nice - without realizing that in a certain country it could make people remember terrible events from the past).
Should Porsche rename its 911, because some Americans are feeling bad about it? Well, they didn't; they made in fact a new 911 - happy bashing (you're also inviting to insult anyone who won't agree that a Porsche 911 doesn't have anything, but anything to do with terrorist attacks).

And if indeed we'll find out the new Pentax DSLR is not called "K-z", all this bashing and the insults will be for nothing. Let's keep our cool for what might be a non-issue.

P.S. Quicksand was quicker

Jean Poitiers · 03-22-2012, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

... Anybody with half a brain can separate the car from that terrible event.

"Yes" ... because the specific car has existed since the early sixties and long before that terrible event which happened on one horrific day over ten years ago ...

"No" ... because that other horrible event happened in the forties and lasted for several years in a very formalized manner ...

Today, it would be easy for Pentax to avoid (another) embrassing and/or inappropriate future product name ...

gazonk · 03-22-2012, 02:22 PM

Originally posted by Kunzite

There are good reasons to believe an US car name literally "11th september" or a camera called "Konzentrationslager fur Zivilpersonen" is intentional, while K-z a coincidence (maybe some Japanese manager though it sounds like "kaze" and that's nice - without realizing that in a certain country it could make people remember terrible events from the past).

Of course it's not intentional, but so wasn't Honda Fitta either, but fortunately they discovered that it means "the c*nt" in Norwegian and Swedish before trying to market it in Scandinavia

Jan67 · 03-22-2012, 02:23 PM

Originally posted by Quicksand

Of course, there's a German car company that already does.

Yes, it's a big shame that Porsche named this car 911 in 1968. They should know, what happens 33 years later...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/af/Classic911.jpg/220px-Classic911.jpg

I just wonder, who made this blurred page with K-z. If this was a Pentax viral game, then they should thank all of us to stop it in time.

Mistral75 · 03-22-2012, 02:25 PM

Originally posted by gazonk

Of course it's not intentional, but so wasn't Honda Fitta either, but fortunately they discovered that it means "the c*nt" in Norwegian and Swedish before trying to market it in Scandinavia

We had the same case with Toyota MR2 here in France. In French "MR2" has almost the same pronunciation as "merde" which means sh*t. The car was therefore named MR in France

.

Clavius · 03-22-2012, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by John Poitiers

"Yes" ... because the specific car has existed since the early sixties and long before that terrible event which happened on one horrific day over ten years ago ...

...The car was re-introduced again AFTER that event... They could have chosen a different name for that new issue, but didn't. Because the car has 0 to do with that horrific event.

Originally posted by John Poitiers

Today, it would be easy for Pentax to avoid (another) embrassing and/or inappropriate future product name ...

It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII.

Kunzite · 03-22-2012, 02:29 PM

Well, the K-01 was not renamed for the Romanian market... as if I'd care. I'm perfectly able to make the difference between a camera and... erm... gentlemen's parts.

Jan67 · 03-22-2012, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

...It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII.

Clavius, I fully respect your opinion. But you are only one person. German speaking countries have almost 100 million people, it's almost 1/3 of the USA population.
We can discuss forever how much is K-z good or bad. But only a marketing idiot chooses such name voluntarily.

Jean Poitiers · 03-22-2012, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

...The car was re-introduced again AFTER that event... They could have chosen a different name for that new issue, but didn't. Because the car has 0 to do with that horrific event.

Get real ... you would abandon the trademark name of "911" that previously existed ?! ... 0 logic here.

Of course, anyone can seperate the car from the terrorist attack ... but one can easily avoid any future controversy. "KZ" or "K-Z" in Germany would be obscene, period.

**monochrome** · 03-22-2012, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by thibs

A little reminder to some. There's a company (now almost forgotten) in computer industry named VIA.
Years ago, VIA added its own chipset for AMD Athlon CPUs which was the first to support 133 SDRAM.
Named chosen was KZ133. Fuss in the forum later, it was renamed KX133.

I didn't know about the acronym at that time. But I understand the motives behind German people reactions.
I also understand why some might find that unimportant. But not respecting those german reactions is IMO stupidity not even counting the 'a**hole' name calling.

It is true that some day, we'll have to let things ago somewhat. But in these very days, this more important than ever. Being in the US or in the Europe, people really forget what happened. Tolerance is less and less part of our lives. And this stinks badly.

Huh - never knew about the LZ133. VIA Systems' offices (were until last year) three floors below mine in our building.

Jean Poitiers · 03-22-2012, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by Clavius

... It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII.

Yes, it is a camera and has 0 to do with the historical "KZ"s ... but, it's just plain stupid from a marketing standpoint ... and culturally insensitive ... and that's where I would submit that you are wrong.

Docrwm · 03-22-2012, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by John Poitiers

Yes, it has 0 to do with the historical "KZ"s ... it's just plain stupid from a marketing standpoint ... and culturally insensitive ... and that's where I would submit that you are wrong.

That's where I think the focus here has been wrong. I'm actually more concerned about offending people in ISRAEL than in Germany on this issue. There aren't as many but they have more right to be "culturally" offended, don't you think?

ElJamoquio · 03-22-2012, 02:48 PM

Originally posted by Na Horuk

I don't think anyone is claiming that Pentax wants to say anything bad with its model name, but fact is that a name of a product has a huge influence on whether people will buy it or not. There are plenty of examples of this happening, particularly in the car industry

Like what? Admittedly, my memory seems to be getting poorer, but I can't recall an instance in the car industry of this occurring.

03-22-2012, 02:17 PM	#124
Jean Poitiers Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Lost in translation ... Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 18,076	Half-brainners ... Originally posted by Clavius ... Anybody with half a brain can separate the car from that terrible event. "Yes" ... because the specific car has existed since the early sixties and long before that terrible event which happened on one horrific day over ten years ago ... "No" ... because that other horrible event happened in the forties and lasted for several years in a very formalized manner ... Today, it would be easy for Pentax to avoid (another) embrassing and/or inappropriate future product name ...

03-22-2012, 02:36 PM	#131
Jean Poitiers Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Lost in translation ... Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 18,076	No brainner ... or maybe no brain Originally posted by Clavius ...The car was re-introduced again AFTER that event... They could have chosen a different name for that new issue, but didn't. Because the car has 0 to do with that horrific event. Get real ... you would abandon the trademark name of "911" that previously existed ?! ... 0 logic here. Of course, anyone can seperate the car from the terrorist attack ... but one can easily avoid any future controversy. "KZ" or "K-Z" in Germany would be obscene, period. Last edited by Jean Poitiers; 03-23-2012 at 04:40 AM.

03-22-2012, 02:40 PM	#133
Jean Poitiers Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Lost in translation ... Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 18,076	You're right ... and wrong, too Originally posted by Clavius ... It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII. Yes, it is a camera and has 0 to do with the historical "KZ"s ... but, it's just plain stupid from a marketing standpoint ... and culturally insensitive ... and that's where I would submit that you are wrong.

03-22-2012, 02:02 PM	#121
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	Originally posted by Clavius LOL! Erm... I mean: Shame! Shame! Seriously, does Porsche sell the 911 in America under a different name?!? That would be extremely silly. Well, we do pronounce Porsche different from over in Europe.

03-22-2012, 02:07 PM	#122
Docrwm Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Somewhere in the Southern US Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,285	Originally posted by JinDesu Well, we do pronounce Porsche different from over in Europe. SOME of us do so but not all of us. Also, the 911 predates the event.

03-22-2012, 02:11 PM	#123
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	thibs: Aren't you getting too personal, here? "Pentax K-z" doesn't equal "11th september". There are good reasons to believe an US car name literally "11th september" or a camera called "Konzentrationslager fur Zivilpersonen" is intentional, while K-z a coincidence (maybe some Japanese manager though it sounds like "kaze" and that's nice - without realizing that in a certain country it could make people remember terrible events from the past). Should Porsche rename its 911, because some Americans are feeling bad about it? Well, they didn't; they made in fact a new 911 - happy bashing (you're also inviting to insult anyone who won't agree that a Porsche 911 doesn't have anything, but anything to do with terrorist attacks). And if indeed we'll find out the new Pentax DSLR is not called "K-z", all this bashing and the insults will be for nothing. Let's keep our cool for what might be a non-issue. P.S. Quicksand was quicker

03-22-2012, 02:22 PM	#125
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Originally posted by Kunzite There are good reasons to believe an US car name literally "11th september" or a camera called "Konzentrationslager fur Zivilpersonen" is intentional, while K-z a coincidence (maybe some Japanese manager though it sounds like "kaze" and that's nice - without realizing that in a certain country it could make people remember terrible events from the past). Of course it's not intentional, but so wasn't Honda Fitta either, but fortunately they discovered that it means "the c*nt" in Norwegian and Swedish before trying to market it in Scandinavia

03-22-2012, 02:23 PM	#126
Jan67 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Prague Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 84	Originally posted by Quicksand Of course, there's a German car company that already does. Yes, it's a big shame that Porsche named this car 911 in 1968. They should know, what happens 33 years later... http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/af/Classic911.jpg/220px-Classic911.jpg I just wonder, who made this blurred page with K-z. If this was a Pentax viral game, then they should thank all of us to stop it in time.

03-22-2012, 02:25 PM	#127
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527	Originally posted by gazonk Of course it's not intentional, but so wasn't Honda Fitta either, but fortunately they discovered that it means "the cnt" in Norwegian and Swedish before trying to market it in Scandinavia We had the same case with Toyota MR2 here in France. In French "MR2" has almost the same pronunciation as "merde" which means sht. The car was therefore named MR in France .

03-22-2012, 02:27 PM	#128
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Originally posted by John Poitiers "Yes" ... because the specific car has existed since the early sixties and long before that terrible event which happened on one horrific day over ten years ago ... ...The car was re-introduced again AFTER that event... They could have chosen a different name for that new issue, but didn't. Because the car has 0 to do with that horrific event. Originally posted by John Poitiers Today, it would be easy for Pentax to avoid (another) embrassing and/or inappropriate future product name ... It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII.

03-22-2012, 02:29 PM	#129
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Well, the K-01 was not renamed for the Romanian market... as if I'd care. I'm perfectly able to make the difference between a camera and... erm... gentlemen's parts.

03-22-2012, 02:36 PM	#130
Jan67 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Prague Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 84	Originally posted by Clavius ...It's not a embarrassing and/or inappropriate name, because it has 0 to do with the camps in WWII. Clavius, I fully respect your opinion. But you are only one person. German speaking countries have almost 100 million people, it's almost 1/3 of the USA population. We can discuss forever how much is K-z good or bad. But only a marketing idiot chooses such name voluntarily.

03-22-2012, 02:36 PM	#132
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by thibs A little reminder to some. There's a company (now almost forgotten) in computer industry named VIA. Years ago, VIA added its own chipset for AMD Athlon CPUs which was the first to support 133 SDRAM. Named chosen was KZ133. Fuss in the forum later, it was renamed KX133. I didn't know about the acronym at that time. But I understand the motives behind German people reactions. I also understand why some might find that unimportant. But not respecting those german reactions is IMO stupidity not even counting the 'a**hole' name calling. It is true that some day, we'll have to let things ago somewhat. But in these very days, this more important than ever. Being in the US or in the Europe, people really forget what happened. Tolerance is less and less part of our lives. And this stinks badly. Huh - never knew about the LZ133. VIA Systems' offices (were until last year) three floors below mine in our building.

03-22-2012, 02:42 PM	#134
Docrwm Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Somewhere in the Southern US Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,285	Originally posted by John Poitiers Yes, it has 0 to do with the historical "KZ"s ... it's just plain stupid from a marketing standpoint ... and culturally insensitive ... and that's where I would submit that you are wrong. That's where I think the focus here has been wrong. I'm actually more concerned about offending people in ISRAEL than in Germany on this issue. There aren't as many but they have more right to be "culturally" offended, don't you think?

03-22-2012, 02:48 PM	#135
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by Na Horuk I don't think anyone is claiming that Pentax wants to say anything bad with its model name, but fact is that a name of a product has a huge influence on whether people will buy it or not. There are plenty of examples of this happening, particularly in the car industry Like what? Admittedly, my memory seems to be getting poorer, but I can't recall an instance in the car industry of this occurring.