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04-03-2012, 12:37 AM   #181
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
It isn't legal in the EU.
But surely this is what Apple have done for years with all of their products?

I understand that the consumer might benefit from having stock in B&M shops rather than just online, but it's still price-fixing by another name.

It's a very similar situation to bookselling in Spain, where it is illegal to discount books by more than 5%. This is to protect small bookshops, a noble idea (I like small bookshops). But the end result of the situation is that the consumer gets screwed wherever he buys his books, which is very unfair.

Price-fixing by any name should be illegal, and the market will get the best deal for the consumer, and the businesses won't sell at a loss because they'd be insane to do so. Everyone gets by nicely.

04-03-2012, 01:23 AM   #182
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This is pretty sad. The 16-50 doubling in price is just beyond my understanding. So far, prices in europe seem to remain at previous levels (meaning that for example the 60-250 now costs less here), but we'll see what happens.

The only hope is that we'll actually get something for the extra money we have to spend for lenses. Like better QC, advancements in AF or flash tech or new product segments (still hoping for FF).
04-03-2012, 01:51 AM   #183
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I was in a situation last October where I had some money to invest in my hobby. This was a one off situation for me as it was part of my pension pay out. More than anything it was the little DA limiteds and the great value for money that they offered that prompted me to nail my colours to the Pentax mast. Would I do the same today? No. There is simply too much confusion in my mind as to where Pentax think they are going.
04-03-2012, 01:56 AM   #184
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Prices in europe increased a soon after hoya took control.

04-03-2012, 02:36 AM   #185
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It will level back out I'm sure. Ricoh can't afford to raise the prices permanently- how could they? Pentax currently doesn't have a strong following. If anything they should be looking to lower the prices and raise the quality to get more people interested.
04-03-2012, 02:44 AM   #186
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jonathan Mac Quote
But surely this is what Apple have done for years with all of their products?
I don't think so.

They simply sell to dealers at high prices, leaving only little margin to list price (Apple store prices) for everyone. You may receive an extra discount (Apple premium reseller) but only if offering extra services and top notch consultancy. This is why B&M PC dealers didn't carry Apple for the most part.

Perfectly legal and fair.
04-03-2012, 03:13 AM   #187
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Something to consider is, that there are other brands of lenses in the Pentax mount. Has anyone ever heard of Sigma and Tamron?? Go get 'em. They are even cheaper now....

Regards
04-03-2012, 03:42 AM   #188
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I won't be affected by this much at all as I likely won't be buying any new lenses, just bodies. I've already got almost all the lenses that I will need plus I've stayed away from the new SDM lenses anyway, mostly due to the QC issues. Actually the only DA lens that I currently own is the 18-55mm WR and the only one that I am seriously considering is the new super tiny 49mm XS. The FA 43mm Limited price seems to have stayed the same.

04-03-2012, 03:47 AM   #189
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When Pentax lens prices are on par with Canon/Nikon lens prices, especially in the FF versions, it will be time to consider shooting Canon/Nikon. Unloading used Pentax glass wont be a problem, and in many cases, they will be worth more than what you paid for them. The cost of switching systems will become much more palatable.
04-03-2012, 03:49 AM   #190
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Prices here seem to have stayed the same pretty much.
Doesnt matter to me anyhow- I won't be buying any more anytime soon- I only recently splashed out on a fa77. Probabably the next lens il get is the ltd zoom on the road map. I doubt il find I need/ want for any others before then.
Unless I decide I want to swap my sigma 10-20 for something more compact like the 15. Or something faster like the 14.
04-03-2012, 04:01 AM   #191
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Pentax, by forcing artificially raised prices on new lenses may be making it doubly easy for people to switch out and away from the brand -- 1) new equipment isn't priced right to attract purchases and 2) the price of used lenses also rises, making sales attractive for people hesitant to remain with Pentax.

And add to that the general irritation of feeling ripped-off (neither B&H nor Pentax have added anything of value to deserve the additonal $750 on the 60-250 e.g.), doesn't seem like a smart thing for Pentax USA to have done.

Perhaps LOWER prices would be a better way of increasing market share and revenue.

Last edited by Gray; 04-03-2012 at 04:28 AM.
04-03-2012, 06:39 AM - 1 Like   #192
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Pentax isn't earning any more money from these price increases. Right now the dealers seem to be earning a much higher margin, but their volume has likely slowed dramatically. Pentax is forcing the gray market resellers to deplete thier stock, then they will simply not sell to them any more. At that time prices will normalize at a somewhat higher level than today's prices, but not nearly where they are now.

Understand that in the USA we have virtually no distribution aside from large internet electonics dealers and Amazon. That leaves the market ripe for low margin, high volume dealers to disrupt the pricing structure, and do so by purchasing ovcerstock from authorized dealers such as Best Buy and other bid box retailers. Dealer agreements should discourage such reseller actions.

I beleieve this is all the result of the Hoya business decision to dismantle the B&M dealer operation in the USA (understandable considering the market share here) and distribute only through volume merchants. If Hoya did anything truly destructive to Pentax, this is it.

Prices will normalize over the summer. If they stick here that means there is enough demand to maintain them, which I doubt there is.

Next step - Pentax will help authorized dealers to liquidate overstock by co-op "sales".
04-03-2012, 06:53 AM   #193
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How do we know that Pentax isn't earning more from these price increases - or won't in the near future? Pentax could have easily raised their prices, I saw something similar happen years ago in a store where I worked, the boss was not happy.
04-03-2012, 07:03 AM   #194
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All I know is that last week I had saved up 90% of what I needed for my first DA*. This morning I'm back to 50%. I'm all of a sudden not so excited about getting this lens ... it's very deflating. I'm sure I'm not any different than many here ... I've raised 4 wonderful children and my beloved hobby has had to take a back seat to my main responsibilities. That doesn't mean I don't dream of new bodies and lenses almost daily, I just keep it real and keep those dreams at arms length. I try and save a little coffee money and change when I can and hopefully with a little luck, I get to purchase another piece of gear.
I can't afford to change systems and have to see this out and just hope a little sanity settles in when it's all said and done.

Last edited by Hawki; 04-03-2012 at 07:09 AM.
04-03-2012, 07:11 AM   #195
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@ luftluss

these rises are currently to MSRP or a listed low price floor .the MSRP prices were in place before this went into effect. Cost will not have changed (though given how much volume may drop the next quarters VIR will not be as good (VIR = Volume Incentive Rebate) depending on how the dealership agreement was written for those large volume guys (they may be getting it monthly , or based on a long history a lower price up front, or in the form of AD co-op.....)
So yep at least for the moment those extra profits will go straight to the dealer. mind you they will be selling a lot less so their overall ROI may be less)
Ultimately a lot of these prices will see adjustment over the next few months

Monochrome is right it may be to work on shutting down some of the grey market trans-shipped goods being bought from other dealers (though having worked for Best Buy I can pretty much guarantee they aren't the source of those trans shipped items)
On the flip side it may develop a larger truly grey market where goods are being imported from offshore distributors in Asia (not all Pentax Distribution is run by Pentax) with essentially no warranty aside from the one the dealer provides
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