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01-13-2008, 06:36 AM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
It is known that all of the journalists that attended the Dubai News Conference had to sign an NDA. This required that there be an embargo that must be honored. The date given for the lifting of that embargo was January 24, 2008.
Real question here:

Since journalists were invited to this conference, obviously being a big deal, could there be the possibility that some journalists have ties or hidden loyalties to the competition? I'm sure Mr Canon and Mr Nikon had heard that there was going to be a conference in Dubai. Can the competition have eyes and ears, so to speak? Or is Pentax just small potatoes and this really isn't THAT big of a deal?

Being so secretive, it seems this NDA stuff could be "spy" worthy from Canon or Nikon's perspective. Do these type of conferences happen often in the camera industry? And does "snooping" really happen in the industry?

01-13-2008, 07:01 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marcus Quote
Real question here:

Since journalists were invited to this conference, obviously being a big deal, could there be the possibility that some journalists have ties or hidden loyalties to the competition? I'm sure Mr Canon and Mr Nikon had heard that there was going to be a conference in Dubai. Can the competition have eyes and ears, so to speak? Or is Pentax just small potatoes and this really isn't THAT big of a deal?

Being so secretive, it seems this NDA stuff could be "spy" worthy from Canon or Nikon's perspective. Do these type of conferences happen often in the camera industry? And does "snooping" really happen in the industry?
It's pretty sure that Canon and Nikon would want to get info on new products from Pentax, no matter how insignificant Pentax is to them.

In the car industry, we keep a close eye on every competitor, no matter how small as long as we are competing for the same market segment.
01-13-2008, 08:40 AM   #48
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"Every one is guilty of it at some point , some more than others .
If you disagree you are in denial"

That doesn't make it right though, does it?
01-13-2008, 10:13 AM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by mutley Quote
Obviously you can post the info under a different name, and computer. Pentax wouldn't be able to figure out it was you or not.

There are other reasons that it is fun not to tell us anything.
Other posters has been into the ethic aspects of this. I must say I support them.

But. There is one more thing. If Bejamin or others posted info under some nick. How could we know that this was credible information? It would just become another rumour. In other words. I don't see the point in your request.

Tim

01-13-2008, 11:03 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fototim Quote
If Bejamin or others posted info under some nick. How could we know that this was credible information? It would just become another rumour. In other words. I don't see the point in your request.

Tim
Lol, as I was wading through this, I was thinking the same exact thing.
01-13-2008, 11:22 AM   #51
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Come on guys , any one please sign in as a fake person , claiming to of been at Dubai and just a mock run down on the New K20D ,,,,, just make stuff up , let have some fun.


This section is called "News & Rumors" ya know

Geez , some of you are a little slow
01-13-2008, 12:09 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jesus Quote
Come on guys , any one please sign in as a fake person , claiming to of been at Dubai and just a mock run down on the New K20D ,,,,, just make stuff up , let have some fun.


This section is called "News & Rumors" ya know

Geez , some of you are a little slow
Sooo..... whatchawaitingfor?
01-13-2008, 12:29 PM   #53
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Ethical Standards

Seems to me that many folks are asking those who signed the NDA to throw their ethics into the garbage can. I imagine that these folks are professionals and as such they wouldn't risk their reputations or their profession by doing something as breaking a legal promise.

As for me, I have enjoyed the discussion on these threads but when it comes to asking someone to break a pledge., I have to support Ben and others in their ethical position of saying no.

I can wait. Heck we are only looking at a few days. There is a lot more happening in this world foks than to loose sleep over the revelation of a new camera. Also my K10d is working just fine thanks.

01-13-2008, 04:09 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fototim Quote
Other posters has been into the ethic aspects of this. I must say I support them.

But. There is one more thing. If Bejamin or others posted info under some nick. How could we know that this was credible information? It would just become another rumour. In other words. I don't see the point in your request.

Tim
There are ways to be tracked down. Every time you long into the board, you are sending info on yourself like your location, and which ISP you are using. Is it worth pentax's time to track them down, that I can't say. Also I am not saying that you can't totally hid yourself, there are ways to do that too.
01-13-2008, 05:36 PM   #55
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We don't want anyone to get sued, so let's not break the rules. How about bending them? Is there a strict time that you must honor the embargo, or does it expire once 24 Jan hits the international date line?
01-13-2008, 07:58 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobell69 Quote
Seems to me that many folks are asking those who signed the NDA to throw their ethics into the garbage can.
Remember this, it was people under NDA who threw us the bone. None of us has heard about the K20D and its supposedly "potent bomb" feature list before. It was people under NDA who get us all hyped up; that there is some "really big" coming up, something "revolutionary"...

So when we ask more questions, we are morally corrupt? :ugh:

To be honest, all these leaks were intentional by Pentax; otherwise, they would have kept the cameras and details close to their chest until Jan 24th. They wouldn't have shown the prototypes to an unprecedented number of people so early in the game. This is a clever way to hold people off from jumping ship in the holiday buying season as the cameras were delayed until this year.

No, I don't believe it was an ethics or moral issue if we ask more questions. It is entirely up to those people to decide whether to respond or not. And what is the NDA terms anyways? That you can tell everyone around you that something really big is going to happen, just don't tell them what it is.... ? Is that it?

Seriously, when they threw us the bone, what exactly do you expect? Just sit quietly and hope that they would throw us another one? We are just basically saying "Can we have another bone?" The response was "No." And that's that. Why would people get upset over this?
01-13-2008, 08:19 PM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marcus Quote
Real question here:

Since journalists were invited to this conference, obviously being a big deal, could there be the possibility that some journalists have ties or hidden loyalties to the competition? I'm sure Mr Canon and Mr Nikon had heard that there was going to be a conference in Dubai. Can the competition have eyes and ears, so to speak? Or is Pentax just small potatoes and this really isn't THAT big of a deal?

Being so secretive, it seems this NDA stuff could be "spy" worthy from Canon or Nikon's perspective. Do these type of conferences happen often in the camera industry? And does "snooping" really happen in the industry?
I'll attempt a real answer:

It makes no difference whatsoever if Canon or Nikon learn about the details of the Pentax January 24th announcement a few weeks earlier. None at all. Nada. Zip. Of course, it would be helpful to learn of a competitor's product in development that might be released in six months or a year, so you could design a competing product. But a few weeks means nothing.

The concern of Pentax is to control the product launch with their presentation coordinated with advertising, the industry show (PMA), dealer promotions, or whatever else they have planned. It's all about their marketing and controlling the market introduction. I base this opinion on case studies such as Apple's vigorous prosecution of NDA violations before certain product introductions. Apple doesn't want anybody undermining the big product launches at Macworld by Steve Jobs. It's the same thing with Pentax. They have a show planned and they don't want it spoiled. They think (rightly or wrongly) that the product introduction will be more successful if it is a surprise.

Pentax is small potatoes, and the Big Boys (Canon and Nikon) are more worried about consumer electronics giants like Sony, Panasonic and Samsung. These big companies have enough money to completely transform the industry, as they did with stereo gear, TVs, and appliances. I'm sure they watch Pentax and Olympus as well, but the consumer electronic giants are the 300 lbs gorillas in the room. Of course Panasonic has access to Olympus technology and Samsung has access to Pentax technology. But the issue here is economies of scale, distributions channels and marketing dollars.

Finally, industrial spying does happen all the time. Companies hire workers away from competitors to learn trade secrets. There was a well publicized incident some years back where a Japanese computer manufacturer tried to bribe an IBM executive to gain access to secret product design manuals. I have no idea how common this practice may be in the camera industry, but it would be naive to think that it never happened.
01-14-2008, 12:59 AM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by GaryML Quote

Pentax is small potatoes
They no longer are if you look at their potential. They share ressource with Samsung and they now there's Hoya money. It's not like if Pentax had been bought by Leica... Hoya has loads of money andwith Samsung on their side they could bring quite a few problems to Canon/Nikon.
01-14-2008, 01:50 AM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote

Seriously, when they threw us the bone, what exactly do you expect? Just sit quietly and hope that they would throw us another one? We are just basically saying "Can we have another bone?" The response was "No." And that's that. Why would people get upset over this?
Maybe when they hear a crowd of people crying "Bone, bone, bone" all the day 'cause they can't wait a week? Anyway, i'm in the "bonebonebone" bunch too
01-14-2008, 05:54 AM   #60
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With 10 days to go, I'll happily wait for my dinner. You can take the scraps in advance.
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