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04-19-2012, 11:48 AM   #271
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yep, that one. Have mercy, I'm not very confident in my English (joking in a foreign language being particularly difficult, IMO) - but please do tell me if I failed
Its good - you are spot on. The next twelve months look very interesting.

04-19-2012, 11:53 AM   #272
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
your correct the us was isolationist at the time, and it took pearl harbor to get them involved. not a request for help.
Actually it was a request for help, but the powers that be could only get the backing of the actual populace by allowing an attack to happen.

QuoteQuote:
but like i said this is a P&R discussion
Yup back to Pentax
04-19-2012, 02:10 PM   #273
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Greater presence in B&M stores is good. I primarily purchase photo gear online but have bought Pentax gear at Berger Bros (Amityville, NY) when impulsive or in a clutch. And the prices are higher than at, say, B&H, but there are other intangibles like customer support, trying out lenses on your own camera, etc., that account for something.

That said, the dearth of Pentax in shops across the US has less to do with a lack of unilateral pricing than the fact that Pentax advertising sucks. Why would independent shops stock an unpopular product and act as ambassadors for the Pentax label when Nikon and Canon spend tons doing it for them with celebrities and superstar pros?

I don't buy into this strategy but don't plan on jumping ship. I'm more disturbed that 3rd party makers like Tamron are neglecting the K-mount. Options are getting thin.
04-19-2012, 02:35 PM   #274
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This is a mind twisting thread....you're reading about lenses and prices, B&M stores and internet retailers...then you are suddenly fighting in WWII........or buying a new car.....that's PF, you never know what to expect, but you know it will soon go loco if it lasts long enough! I think I can get a weather report here later on today?

I was in Ft Worth today and stopped by Ft Worth Camera to browse. They had a decent selection of Nikon, Canon and Fuji...a few Sony products, and a big zero on Pentax. The reason was explained rather rationally, I thought...there is no demand for Pentax.
No need to go much farther than that...it is a job for Ricoh to increase demand, through advertising and in any way that will increase public awareness....huge billboards across America screaming out "We Just Doubled Our Prices" is not exactly what I would do...but who knows what they are thinking?

As for B&M stores.....it certainly is nice to talk with a salesperson that has some degree of knowledge, and to actually hold products in your hands and sample them. I do wish this was possible with Pentax, but I am not sure it will ever happen....it is just not looking like a reality from my viewpoint. Pentax will do better on the internet, in my opinion, and prices will have to be a factor whether they like it or not.


BTW- It was great to get to shoot a few with the X-Pro and a 35 1.4.....sweet camera, felt great. The advantage of B&M is that you can get hooked and buy on the spot. I didn't, but if they had a zoom out, I am pretty sure I would have come home with it. I also believe that if they had a K5 in that store it would easily compete with the Canon and Nikons, it certainly outclasses what they had on hand.

Regards! .... Don't forget to throw in a weather report for me when your new cars arrive.....and WWII is over......

04-19-2012, 02:40 PM   #275
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
This is a mind twisting thread....you're reading about lenses and prices, B&M stores and internet retailers...then you are suddenly fighting in WWII........or buying a new car.....that's PF, you never know what to expect, but you know it will soon go loco if it lasts long enough! I think I can get a weather report here later on today?

I was in Ft Worth today and stopped by Ft Worth Camera to browse. They had a decent selection of Nikon, Canon and Fuji...a few Sony products, and a big zero on Pentax. The reason was explained rather rationally, I thought...there is no demand for Pentax.
No need to go much farther than that...it is a job for Ricoh to increase demand, through advertising and in any way that will increase public awareness....huge billboards across America screaming out "We Just Doubled Our Prices" is not exactly what I would do...but who knows what they are thinking?

As for B&M stores.....it certainly is nice to talk with a salesperson that has some degree of knowledge, and to actually hold products in your hands and sample them. I do wish this was possible with Pentax, but I am not sure it will ever happen....it is just not looking like a reality from my viewpoint. Pentax will do better on the internet, in my opinion, and prices will have to be a factor whether they like it or not.


BTW- It was great to get to shoot a few with the X-Pro and a 35 1.4.....sweet camera, felt great. The advantage of B&M is that you can get hooked and buy on the spot. I didn't, but if they had a zoom out, I am pretty sure I would have come home with it. I also believe that if they had a K5 in that store it would easily compete with the Canon and Nikons, it certainly outclasses what they had on hand.

Regards! .... Don't forget to throw in a weather report for me when your new cars arrive.....and WWII is over......
Sunny and dry with a strong chance of Choir Singing and Koolaid later in the day
04-19-2012, 02:58 PM   #276
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Sunny and dry with a strong chance of Choir Singing and Koolaid later in the day
koolaid
04-19-2012, 03:13 PM   #277
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
:koolaid:
Oh YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
04-19-2012, 04:42 PM   #278
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Has anyone considered the violation of US price fixing and fair trade laws. These are intended, at least in part, to address this kind of distributor/importer manipulation of retail prices. Those laws make things difficult for smaller retailers, but offer more affordable prices for retail customers.

04-19-2012, 05:39 PM   #279
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QuoteOriginally posted by dfinjc66 Quote
Has anyone considered the violation of US price fixing and fair trade laws. These are intended, at least in part, to address this kind of distributor/importer manipulation of retail prices. Those laws make things difficult for smaller retailers, but offer more affordable prices for retail customers.
Apparently this kind of pricing policy isn't illegal (there's a wikipedia page on it), and at least it'll help smaller stores that was to carry Pentax.

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04-19-2012, 05:51 PM   #280
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Apparently this kind of pricing policy isn't illegal (there's a wikipedia page on it), and at least it'll help smaller stores that was to carry Pentax.
Here's a recent writeup from a US law firm about this kind of pricing policy:

Can I Stop ?Bargain Basement Pricing? of My Branded Products? | Whiteford Taylor Preston

I'm not affiliated with the firm -- and I don't really know anything about them. But the writeup came to me recently in an email digest of legal articles (since I'm, as they say, in the business) and it's consistent with my knowledge of the US law in the area.

It does contain a bit of legal lingo though, I'm afraid.
04-19-2012, 05:53 PM   #281
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QuoteOriginally posted by dfinjc66 Quote
Has anyone considered the violation of US price fixing and fair trade laws. These are intended, at least in part, to address this kind of distributor/importer manipulation of retail prices. Those laws make things difficult for smaller retailers, but offer more affordable prices for retail customers.
Was illegal until very recently. Not anymore.
04-19-2012, 05:54 PM   #282
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QuoteOriginally posted by Quicksand Quote
Here's a recent writeup from a US law firm about this kind of pricing policy:

Can I Stop ?Bargain Basement Pricing? of My Branded Products? | Whiteford Taylor Preston

I'm not affiliated with the firm -- and I don't really know anything about them. But the writeup came to me recently in an email digest of legal articles (since I'm, as they say, in the business) and it's consistent with my knowledge of the US law in the area.

It does contain a bit of legal lingo though, I'm afraid.
Thanks, cogent and concise - which I like. The killer in it is the "and" between a & b. I think it could be effectively argued that a is met under the standard with K-Mount lenses by Pentax. However, proof of b would be very hard without extensive discover. Ah well. The implementation section poses interesting aspects, but it would be simplicity itself to merely hire a teenager to monitor the ecommerce sites and write reports on a regular basis. Pentax does appear more exposed because they sell directly to the public (their non-customers) though. Frankly, the Minimum Advertised Price ("MAP") policy would appear to be less prone to abuse and leave less potential for litigation but Pentax has chose the MSRP route. Interesting.

The B&H rep made a statement someplace, can't seem to find it, that I think might be interesting given that the article also states: "However, certain U.S. states such as California, New York, New Jersey and Maryland, it is illegal to enter into any contract requiring another party to agree to not to sell a product or service below a specific price."

Last edited by Docrwm; 04-19-2012 at 06:16 PM.
04-19-2012, 06:00 PM   #283
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QuoteOriginally posted by seventysixersfan Quote
Sorry if someone else figured this out and already posted this, but according to Ned's blog, it sounds like the "national distributor" in the USA will soon be Target! He said in a reply on his blog: "I think you'll be pleasantly surprised when you find out that our weatherproof line is now being carried in over 1700 stores whose primary color is red." I just googled "Target and 1700" and that's the number of stores that Target claims to have across the country. There are several Targets near me, and I'd love to be able to walk into them and handle a K-5 or successor weatherproof camera!
I took the weatherproof comment as referring to the Optio line.
04-19-2012, 07:15 PM   #284
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I've been a Olympus fan and owned 5 of their dslr's and a few lenses for a number of years. Went there after Minolta sold out. After Olympus management fiasco in Japan hiding money that could be used in development. I felt like a fool waiting for the next better improved camera that could not come because they were busing wasting money and lying about the future of the 4/3 system. I sold all but one camera. After much research I went with Pentax and bought a K5 and several lenses batteries, power supply, astrotracer . Why because it is a great camera and great price's available on line many used lens that are compatible. Prices are competitive and hoping the next upgrade will be even better then I hope. I thought about going to Canon, just could not go there. If Ned is right, I don't really like his attitude, out of principle I will be moving on to Sony If Pentax implements this new policy. Because they are bouncing around ideas and still spinning gears that will only result in higher prices and less new users
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04-19-2012, 07:26 PM   #285
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QuoteOriginally posted by oneeyedhawk Quote
I've been a Olympus fan and owned 5 of their dslr's and a few lenses for a number of years. Went there after Minolta sold out. After Olympus management fiasco in Japan hiding money that could be used in development. I felt like a fool waiting for the next better improved camera that could not come because they were busing wasting money and lying about the future of the 4/3 system. I sold all but one camera. After much research I went with Pentax and bought a K5 and several lenses batteries, power supply, astrotracer . Why because it is a great camera and great price's available on line many used lens that are compatible. Prices are competitive and hoping the next upgrade will be even better then I hope. I thought about going to Canon, just could not go there. If Ned is right, I don't really like his attitude, out of principle I will be moving on to Sony If Pentax implements this new policy. Because they are bouncing around ideas and still spinning gears that will only result in higher prices and less new users
Hank
But Olympus did come out with a sweet new camera, and if they went belly up you could always buy Panasonic bodies.
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