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04-25-2012, 03:49 PM   #451
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
You are thinking static market, like the Congressional Budget Office does - a classic projection error.

If Pentax increases market share B&H will increase unit sales and margins.
I didn't make myself clear, monochrome. My reference to unit sales projections was intended to encompass the lovely end game in which a rising tide lifts all boats. Oh, that analogy has been used. Never mind.

I would not assume that increasing Pentax unit sales in the American market will necessarily mean that B&H will see increased unit sales, from the American market or overall. I don't know that. I suspect not, particularly as US-based online retailers are likely to lose more sales to non-US B&M outlets in addition to those lost to B&M in the US.

But we'll just have to see how it plays out. This should make a fascinating case study some day.

04-25-2012, 04:04 PM   #452
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QuoteOriginally posted by glanglois Quote
But we'll just have to see how it plays out. This should make a fascinating case study some day.
Yes, it will. Quite a lot will depend upon how well Pentax USA executes.
04-25-2012, 05:48 PM   #453
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
"We won't miss you."

I think that's what Pentax might be saying that right now about other customers. Perhaps myself included.
04-25-2012, 05:53 PM   #454
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QuoteOriginally posted by glanglois Quote
I didn't make myself clear, monochrome. My reference to unit sales projections was intended to encompass the lovely end game in which a rising tide lifts all boats. Oh, that analogy has been used. Never mind.

I would not assume that increasing Pentax unit sales in the American market will necessarily mean that B&H will see increased unit sales, from the American market or overall. I don't know that. I suspect not, particularly as US-based online retailers are likely to lose more sales to non-US B&M outlets in addition to those lost to B&M in the US.

But we'll just have to see how it plays out. This should make a fascinating case study some day.
My supposition is if Pentax is successful globally introducing competitive new products and gaining market share, especially in the US (and perhaps doing some advertising to encourage first-time buyers) ALL end points in the channel will benefit, including Amazon, B&H, Adorama and the other large dealers. Their share of total sales might decline but their dollar volume and unit volume can increase anyway,

04-25-2012, 06:33 PM   #455
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Yes, it will. Quite a lot will depend upon how well Pentax USA executes.
I totally agree, it will depend on how they execute.

Currently, Nikon looks like they are hitting every tier they can at the moment. This is going to make execution that more critical for Pentax. I'm assuming of course that Pentax, Nikon and Sony are not secretly planning all this to take on Canon.

It's going to be an interesting year.
04-25-2012, 06:56 PM   #456
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
And this is pretty much a good reason for the action on their part. While we are a loyal bunch the existing user base is smaller than what Canon is bleeding to Nikon right now, and the growth the company wants will not come from us. Not even close. If they manage the growth they desire even lost users won't make a huge difference.
The only way they are going to grow to at least the Sony level is to get in new users faces and get the name known. All the other rumours floating around point to this being the mid term (ie 3-4 year goal) and will require some pretty aggressive moves in the next year.
For me if this is what it takes I'm fine with it. If it means I buy a Sigma 30 rather than a 31LTD so be it.

You won't be alone.....and let's not forget that both Sigma and Tamron make some excellent glass...and have much better warranties...all at a lower price. Maybe Ricoh thinks that Pentaxians will pay double just for that Pentax on the lens? That thought would make a lot of Canon and Nikon guys pee in their pants with laughter! Sorry, but let's get real here, very few would pay more just to own a Pentax product.......Fanboys aside, it just won't happen.
Regards!
04-25-2012, 08:11 PM   #457
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Maybe Sigma et al. will make more models in a Pentax mount if they think that the new price structure will drive more business their way. That could be quite a valuable benefit to some here.

I, for one, would like an 11-16 2.8 for interiors of churches, museums, etc. Others have expressed similar desires for Tamron or Sigma glass available only to Canikon owners. This may even be the opening that drives them to support weather sealed or resistant lenses, e.g., 70-200. I'm watching this closely.
04-25-2012, 08:29 PM   #458
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
State the "terms" of your purchase beforehand, as I do when I haggle over a car. ... BIG SNIP to minimize thread derailment ...
I let my credit union do my haggling for my current car. They pre-negotiated with some dealers. I briefly spoke with 2 other dealers who couldn't/wouldn't beat that price so I bought from the dealer with the pre-negotiated price. (That was way back in 1999. I went with VW because I wanted a station wagon and the Passat was one of the few car models still available in wagon form. The car's still running strong without needing any major repairs yet.)

04-25-2012, 10:25 PM   #459
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
I am suspecting dgcom as a Pentax troll.
Just saw this... I can assure you, I'm not a Pentax troll. I'm a long time Pentax fan, starting from soviet union screw-mount and K-mount cameras and continuing using K-mount after moving to U.S. some tome ago. Also, long time PDML reader...

I did see Ned in-person once and I sop in B&H... I'm against price increase, but I'm also against de-valuing brand (because I have many-many lens I can sell off if I want to...)

I think, this is just a coincidence that Ned responded to me twice...
04-26-2012, 05:32 AM   #460
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QuoteOriginally posted by dgcom Quote
Just saw this... I can assure you, I'm not a Pentax troll. I'm a long time Pentax fan, starting from soviet union screw-mount and K-mount cameras and continuing using K-mount after moving to U.S. some tome ago. Also, long time PDML reader...

I did see Ned in-person once and I sop in B&H... I'm against price increase, but I'm also against de-valuing brand (because I have many-many lens I can sell off if I want to...)

I think, this is just a coincidence that Ned responded to me twice...
Fair enough. I was wondering if you were one of the Pentax folks in Colorado. He approved it with the first sentence acknowledge him approving all posts which isn't the case. Like I said, I don't expect him to, but that is odd that he would select a post acknowledging that. As far a devaluing goes, I don't think B&H, Adorama, Abe's, 47th St or 17th St could be accused of doing that.
04-26-2012, 06:16 AM   #461
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
He approved it with the first sentence acknowledge him approving all posts which isn't the case.
I wrote that statement after reading that all comments seems to be approved, right here, earlier in this thread... Full circle
04-26-2012, 10:07 AM   #462
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Well, for what it's worth, Tamron announced a new 24-70 F2.8 a few minutes ago. For Cannon, Nikon, Sony. Sort of puts us into perspective although it's a full frame lens and we don't have one of those.....

Ed
04-26-2012, 10:09 AM   #463
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QuoteOriginally posted by Greeneg Quote
Well, for what it's worth, Tamron announced a new 24-70 F2.8 a few minutes ago. For Cannon, Nikon, Sony. Sort of puts us into perspective although it's a full frame lens and we don't have one of those.....

Ed
Even if we did share has dropped far enough that support is now dropping. if the next year and a half meets what ricohs expectations supposedly are then the 3rd part guys will reverse the trend
04-26-2012, 12:48 PM   #464
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1) It's a full frame lens, really. Pentax doesn't have a full frame camera. Yes, I know you can use a 24-70 on a APS-C, but it looks like Tamron isn't expecting that market.
2) The decision to exclude this lens from Pentax was before Pentax decided to give so much money to third-party-lens manufacturers.
04-26-2012, 01:32 PM   #465
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My problem is that I was sort of hoping that they (Tamron), Sigma, and even Tokina, might view the Pentax market as an opportunity. I guess that they all figure that it's too small to make it worthwhile. Another argument for the Canikon people.......

Ed
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