K20D Specs ???

Tom M · 01-21-2008, 09:04 AM

Think Casio Exilim - CMOS sensor. Check out the FPS on that sucker! I don't hink it will be as much but, I think it will be along those lines as it's similar technology.

lol101 · 01-21-2008, 09:12 AM

Originally posted by Tom M

Think Casio Exilim - CMOS sensor. Check out the FPS on that sucker! I don't hink it will be as much but, I think it will be along those lines as it's similar technology.

But the Casion has no mirror box + a small sensor, how would you reach these kind of fps on an APS-C DSLR?

Even in LV, where the Casio doesn't really need a fast AF (DoF is very large) an APS-DSLR would need to be able to track a moving object with it's mirror up... unless they invented an ultra fast contrast detection AF, 10x faster than the one on D300...

mawz · 01-21-2008, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by nosnoop

The FPS may affect some users, but purchase decision based on 250 flash sync? You mean 1/2 stop would make that much difference, especially if you have HSS as a backup (albeit with reduced flash range)?

HSS is useless with strobes or manual flash. And that 1/2 stop is very useful outdoors. The 250th sync means far more to me than the extra fps.

Olivier · 01-21-2008, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by lol101

mmmmh... ISO 1600 max sensitivity?

Could ISO 3200/6400 be "software" sensitivities..?

No, it looks like the press release was incorrect. They have now updated it and are claiming ISO3200. Still short of 6400, but consistent with other GX20 rumors.

Kunzite · 01-21-2008, 09:29 AM

Maybe the K20D can reach a faster speed only in Live View mode, i.e. without using the mirror?

quarc · 01-21-2008, 09:29 AM

I have speculated a lot around Pentax will use the fact they can move the sensor to allow for multishot with increased resolution as a consequence. You would not even have to move the sensor, just detect the motion of the camera, surely that will move half a pixel even on a tripod.

Then I thought of moving the sensor back and forth to achive focus bracketing without having to refocus the lens, which would be slow.

And after reading some comments on AF I realised they will of course use it for utra quick AF. Why refocus the lens, when you can move the sensor in a fraction of the time. I think they could achive something like the 1.7x AF converter, providing AF with ALL lenses, even old one. Yes you would need to focus roughly manually, but then to keep the object in focus the camera could keep the sensor in focus. I dare say if they have power enough in the camera to quickly identify focus on the sensor, Pentax would have the fastest AF of any camera provider by a factor of 10 or so. But maybe that will be the K1? ;-)

mawz · 01-21-2008, 09:30 AM

Originally posted by RMabo

The Norwegian distributor listed a 2.7" LCD and ISO 3200 in their leaked tech specs a couple of weeks ago.

Neither of which are actually competitive at the supposed pricepoint. After using the D300/A700 3" 640x480 display, a 230k display is poor comfort. The 922k display is quite capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 magnification (6.7x on the 12MP bodies), the lower-resolution 230k displays are not. And Live View is far more useful for macro with a display capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 pixel magnification.

If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate.

If the tech nobody else has is HD video as rumoured, I'll be even less impressed with those specs.

jeffkrol · 01-21-2008, 09:35 AM

German report has the Samsung 14.?MP CMOS listed. I have the link at home. Sorry.
Seems Samsung it is. Highest density CMOS APS-C.

Tom M · 01-21-2008, 09:35 AM

Not 60fps like the Casio but, more like 8-10 fps is what I was thinking.

Also, thinking about that Casio, that's got to be one hell of a fun toy to play with! And I do say toy, because the image quality surely won't be as good as what we have.

codiac2600 · 01-21-2008, 09:38 AM

Originally posted by mawz

Neither of which are actually competitive at the supposed pricepoint. After using the D300/A700 3" 640x480 display, a 230k display is poor comfort. The 922k display is quite capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 magnification (6.7x on the 12MP bodies), the lower-resolution 230k displays are not. And Live View is far more useful for macro with a display capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 pixel magnification.

If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate.

If the tech nobody else has is HD video as rumoured, I'll be even less impressed with those specs.

The Nikon screen is around 307,000 pixels (RGB = 922,000)

This 2.7" screen is very competitive with that resolution and Samsung produces both screens AFAIK.

Plus this screen has an ability that the nikon screen doesn't

, which is why Pentax went with it.

These numbers are for effective pixels while Nikon gives you data for ALL pixels (RGB).

These specs are just rough numbers that don't show the whole pictures and it's worth the $1300 price tag when everyone sees the whole picture.

codiac2600 · 01-21-2008, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by jeffkrol

German report has the Samsung 14.?MP CMOS listed. I have the link at home. Sorry.
Seems Samsung it is. Highest density CMOS APS-C.

Ummm... wait until you see the whole spec list. You'll see something very interesting if not shocking when Pentax announces the pixel density and size of each pixel.

nosnoop · 01-21-2008, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by mawz

If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate.

Sure, who cares about image quality right?
You can already determine the price point just by the few specs we have?

As for the LCD, 40D has the low res rear LCD as well.

Tom M · 01-21-2008, 09:45 AM

Codiac!!! So far, between you and Ben, you have us all drooling over what this next beast will be.

A few more days, right? And we'll all know?

Busiko · 01-21-2008, 09:47 AM

Originally posted by lol101

I would also like to see a shutter spec of 1/8000s X-sync. 1/250s but it's only because it would look more "pro" as I can't really find a practical use for it...

With new generation cameras you're no longer be limited by mechanics, so you can expect way better performances from the new electronic shutters.
Rui

codiac2600 · 01-21-2008, 09:47 AM

Originally posted by Tom M

Codiac!!! So far, between you and Ben, you have us all drooling over what this next beast will be.

A few more days, right? And we'll all know?

Yes and like Ben my NDA ends exactly when Pentax announces the cameras officially, so I'll try and answer all of these questions with appropriate answers. I've got everything memorized in my brain and will try to get it out of there in a few days.

01-21-2008, 09:47 AM	#59
Busiko Guest	Originally posted by lol101 I would also like to see a shutter spec of 1/8000s X-sync. 1/250s but it's only because it would look more "pro" as I can't really find a practical use for it... With new generation cameras you're no longer be limited by mechanics, so you can expect way better performances from the new electronic shutters. Rui Last edited by Busiko; 01-21-2008 at 09:58 AM.

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01-21-2008, 09:04 AM	#46
Tom M Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Lincoln Park, NJ Photos: Gallery Posts: 780	Think Casio Exilim - CMOS sensor. Check out the FPS on that sucker! I don't hink it will be as much but, I think it will be along those lines as it's similar technology.

01-21-2008, 09:12 AM	#47
lol101 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Garennes sur Eure France Photos: Gallery Posts: 899	Originally posted by Tom M Think Casio Exilim - CMOS sensor. Check out the FPS on that sucker! I don't hink it will be as much but, I think it will be along those lines as it's similar technology. But the Casion has no mirror box + a small sensor, how would you reach these kind of fps on an APS-C DSLR? Even in LV, where the Casio doesn't really need a fast AF (DoF is very large) an APS-DSLR would need to be able to track a moving object with it's mirror up... unless they invented an ultra fast contrast detection AF, 10x faster than the one on D300...

01-21-2008, 09:23 AM	#48
mawz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 166	Originally posted by nosnoop The FPS may affect some users, but purchase decision based on 250 flash sync? You mean 1/2 stop would make that much difference, especially if you have HSS as a backup (albeit with reduced flash range)? HSS is useless with strobes or manual flash. And that 1/2 stop is very useful outdoors. The 250th sync means far more to me than the extra fps.

01-21-2008, 09:27 AM	#49
Olivier Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Portland, OR Photos: Albums Posts: 25	Originally posted by lol101 mmmmh... ISO 1600 max sensitivity? Could ISO 3200/6400 be "software" sensitivities..? No, it looks like the press release was incorrect. They have now updated it and are claiming ISO3200. Still short of 6400, but consistent with other GX20 rumors.

01-21-2008, 09:29 AM	#50
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Maybe the K20D can reach a faster speed only in Live View mode, i.e. without using the mirror?

01-21-2008, 09:29 AM	#51
quarc Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 182	I have speculated a lot around Pentax will use the fact they can move the sensor to allow for multishot with increased resolution as a consequence. You would not even have to move the sensor, just detect the motion of the camera, surely that will move half a pixel even on a tripod. Then I thought of moving the sensor back and forth to achive focus bracketing without having to refocus the lens, which would be slow. And after reading some comments on AF I realised they will of course use it for utra quick AF. Why refocus the lens, when you can move the sensor in a fraction of the time. I think they could achive something like the 1.7x AF converter, providing AF with ALL lenses, even old one. Yes you would need to focus roughly manually, but then to keep the object in focus the camera could keep the sensor in focus. I dare say if they have power enough in the camera to quickly identify focus on the sensor, Pentax would have the fastest AF of any camera provider by a factor of 10 or so. But maybe that will be the K1? ;-)

01-21-2008, 09:30 AM	#52
mawz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 166	Originally posted by RMabo The Norwegian distributor listed a 2.7" LCD and ISO 3200 in their leaked tech specs a couple of weeks ago. Neither of which are actually competitive at the supposed pricepoint. After using the D300/A700 3" 640x480 display, a 230k display is poor comfort. The 922k display is quite capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 magnification (6.7x on the 12MP bodies), the lower-resolution 230k displays are not. And Live View is far more useful for macro with a display capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 pixel magnification. If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate. If the tech nobody else has is HD video as rumoured, I'll be even less impressed with those specs.

01-21-2008, 09:35 AM	#53
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	German report has the Samsung 14.?MP CMOS listed. I have the link at home. Sorry. Seems Samsung it is. Highest density CMOS APS-C.

01-21-2008, 09:35 AM	#54
Tom M Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Lincoln Park, NJ Photos: Gallery Posts: 780	Not 60fps like the Casio but, more like 8-10 fps is what I was thinking. Also, thinking about that Casio, that's got to be one hell of a fun toy to play with! And I do say toy, because the image quality surely won't be as good as what we have.

01-21-2008, 09:38 AM	#55
codiac2600 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 2,027	Originally posted by mawz Neither of which are actually competitive at the supposed pricepoint. After using the D300/A700 3" 640x480 display, a 230k display is poor comfort. The 922k display is quite capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 magnification (6.7x on the 12MP bodies), the lower-resolution 230k displays are not. And Live View is far more useful for macro with a display capable of showing accurate focus at 1:1 pixel magnification. If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate. If the tech nobody else has is HD video as rumoured, I'll be even less impressed with those specs. The Nikon screen is around 307,000 pixels (RGB = 922,000) This 2.7" screen is very competitive with that resolution and Samsung produces both screens AFAIK. Plus this screen has an ability that the nikon screen doesn't , which is why Pentax went with it. These numbers are for effective pixels while Nikon gives you data for ALL pixels (RGB). These specs are just rough numbers that don't show the whole pictures and it's worth the $1300 price tag when everyone sees the whole picture.

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01-21-2008, 09:41 AM	#56
codiac2600 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 2,027	Originally posted by jeffkrol German report has the Samsung 14.?MP CMOS listed. I have the link at home. Sorry. Seems Samsung it is. Highest density CMOS APS-C. Ummm... wait until you see the whole spec list. You'll see something very interesting if not shocking when Pentax announces the pixel density and size of each pixel.

01-21-2008, 09:41 AM	#57
nosnoop Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,299	Originally posted by mawz If those specs are at all accurate, I'm seeing a competitive $999 camera. Not a $1300 one. But I'm hoping those specs aren't accurate. Sure, who cares about image quality right? You can already determine the price point just by the few specs we have? As for the LCD, 40D has the low res rear LCD as well.

01-21-2008, 09:45 AM	#58
Tom M Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Lincoln Park, NJ Photos: Gallery Posts: 780	Codiac!!! So far, between you and Ben, you have us all drooling over what this next beast will be. A few more days, right? And we'll all know?

01-21-2008, 09:47 AM	#60
codiac2600 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Rockford, Illinois Posts: 2,027	Originally posted by Tom M Codiac!!! So far, between you and Ben, you have us all drooling over what this next beast will be. A few more days, right? And we'll all know? Yes and like Ben my NDA ends exactly when Pentax announces the cameras officially, so I'll try and answer all of these questions with appropriate answers. I've got everything memorized in my brain and will try to get it out of there in a few days.