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01-25-2008, 08:05 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by ftpaddict Quote
I know throngs of people who have never heard of Pentax in their life, but to whom SONY sure rings a good bell.
Interesting. I know throngs of people (including myself) who will never own another Sony product.

01-25-2008, 08:20 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Duck Dodgers Quote
Interesting. I know throngs of people (including myself) who will never own another Sony product.
I want to be in that crowd.
01-25-2008, 08:41 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by ftpaddict Quote
I want to be in that crowd.
For $5 I'll send you a membership card.
01-25-2008, 09:21 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by mattdm Quote
I'm not saying you or anyone else here doesn't give their honest sales advice, but even if one doesn't work on commission, one's salary and performance is usually linked to how much money one makes for the store. So the "I don't work on commission" line seems a bit, I dunno, not-telling-the-whole-story -- as anyone who's gotten the hard sell for extended warranties and gold-plated gamma-radiation-shield cables from a not-on-commission Best Buy employee can attest.
personally, since i'm a salesperson who is paid by commission (tools though), i think that having sales people who actually care to keep a product sold, and a customer happy, lest they get returns, would work out to get the customer the right camera, otherwise it's money out of their pockets, when it does get returned

01-26-2008, 12:01 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jimbo Quote
I thought the new k20 was 200-6400 ISO? I was looking at a video on the K 20 and I think they did mention that? Could be wrong and still a good deal on the product. Well layed out cost comparisons JB. JIMBO

masterchong.com - Pentax K20D and K200D Introduction Video
My understanding is

ISO 100-6400
Using the dynamic boost in jpg, minimum ISO becomes 200.
01-26-2008, 12:15 AM   #21
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[QUOTE][Using the dynamic boost in jpg, minimum ISO becomes 200. /QUOTE]

Went through the video again and you are correct. Thanks Avant..
01-26-2008, 02:06 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by lol101 Quote
Mmmmhhhh... what will Mr Smith choose...
i can bet 99%, it will be 40D by canon
01-26-2008, 03:02 AM   #23
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Mr. Smith buys the Canon 450D because the salesman tells him to.

At least that's what happens to people who don't research cameras before going to the store and buying one

01-26-2008, 03:29 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by lol101 Quote
Mr Smith recently got interested in photography.

K20 says: 14,6MP, ISO 100-6400, Live view, Shake Reduction, Weather resistant - $1199
40D says: 10MP, ISO 100-3200, Live view, Dust resistant -$1199
A700 says: 12,5MP, ISO 100-6400, No Live View Anti Shake Weather resistant - $1399
E3 says: 10MP, ISO 100-3200, Live view, Anti Shake, Weather resistant - $1699
D300 says: 12,5MP, ISO 100-6400, Live View, Weather Sealed - $1799

Mmmmhhhh... what will Mr Smith choose...
Please add the FPS specs as well.
Add
20FPS (only bust mode)
for K20D
01-26-2008, 03:50 AM   #25
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And then just before he leaves the shop due to confusion and a pushy sales person, he spots:

Pentax K10D - 10MP, ISO 100-1600, Shake Reduction, Weather resistant , more features than he has ever seen on any P&S he has ever owned- $699 on sale WITH 18-55 lens.

He went home happy and his wife didn't leave him either.

The end.

01-26-2008, 03:55 AM   #26
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Not your average Joe

Joe looks at the features and price and decides that the Pentax 20d is the best option. He buys the kit and heads home to show the family. He reads the manual all night long and the next day is ready to take his first shots with the new camera.
His oldest daughter is finally ready to take off the training wheels and ride her bike. He take some great shots of her by the bike. They are so sharp and with such detail that you can read the inflation numbers on the side of the little tires.
Finally his daughter takes off on her first solo ride, but every time Joe trys to get a picture of her riding towards him, it comes out blurry... His wife calls him an idiot, and says it is just another in long series of mistakes made by poor Joe. She screams something about wasting the family's Money. Then she goes in the house, slams the door and begins drinking a little earlier in the day than normal... Another rough night in HappyTown awaits poor old Joe.

Then Joe gets an idea. He puts the training wheels back on the bike. Has his daughter sit on the seat. And takes some wonderful pictures of her. He tells her to pretend like she is riding the bike and takes some "action" shots of her. He shows the pictures to his wife and tells her that it just took him a bit to figure out how to get the best out of the camera. She is happy with the photos of her daughter "riding" the bike... and tells Joe how good of a photographer he is. All is swell in Joe's World.....
THE END



01-26-2008, 04:28 AM   #27
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I think if you pulled the training wheels of those two bikes, you would really have problems getting a shot of your daughter 'riding' the bike LOL

...but you could easily manual focus (even with my beautiful voigtlander which has what seems the worlds longest throw when you're in a hurry)

...hmm now Joes wife has looked at the pictures and calls him an idiot and you thought it was because of his photography

Phil
01-26-2008, 04:41 AM   #28
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hmm

I believe that even in the richer country the first step from ps and bridge cams is most of the time an entry level DSLR. So, Mr. Smith will probably choose a Rebel 450 or Nikon whatever the numbers because he is often reassure by the ring of the name. Besides, to be honest I think for the first time Pentax will outsell K200D with the K20D not because is a wonder-DSLR but simply because can appeal to many more advanced pros than K200D can appeal to a beginner. Also K200D has one fatal flow for a true beginner camera and we all know what that is (and BTW is a stupidest of all IMHO especially for JPEG’s number).

One more thing: if they are really smart and did learnt from their previous mistakes they will provide a K20D kit with a DA* 16-50 at a discounted price (and hopefully improved quality of the copies). Even 100-200 Euros is enough as a discount to really put C and N in trouble for the image quality vs. money paid. Hopefully the maximum autofocus speed, accuracy and silence will be on this combination and 101% of what Pentax can deliver in this moment. Also will be a weather proof system which for the 1700 Euros or so I think is impossible to find in this class of DSLR. Finally if what happened to my kit is to repeat (I received my K100D kit in a single unit camera body and kit lens) Pentax could have a chance to “accord” ff or bf for the system body and kit lens they deliver. Only concern remains the centering defects (maybe other quality problems).

Finally I tend to believe that Pentax crippled on purpose K200D to focus on more lucrative upper market (and I mean lenses too, BTW) and at the end of the day all depends on the REAL image quality of K20D and the conditions (read lenses necessary) you need to have in order to obtain this image quality. This in my book is very smart because they don’t have the production numbers to sustain low price/low margins type of cameras anyway.

Radu
01-26-2008, 04:48 AM   #29
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errata

... can appeal to more advanced AMATEURS or people which aspire to a pro status in some form of photography wich is not necessary related to machine gun speed of shutter ...
01-26-2008, 05:19 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by jbcampbell Quote
He will end up with which ever one the salesperson has an incentive to sell.
That's why you do your homework before you ever go to the store
Of course, the majority will still go to Canikon because of aggressive sale incentive + brand recognition.

My point was just that the K20D offer makes sense on the market. Put in a little price reduction n 6 month and I really think the sale numbers should be OK... for a Pentax
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