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08-09-2012, 02:32 PM   #91
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QuoteOriginally posted by LamyTax Quote
Sure, but what do you do if you're already at 1/8000 and absolutely don't want to stop down anymore and don't want to use an ND?
You shoot and deal with it in post processing. More efficient sensors will have better high light recovery and better DR. Same thing that you do when you are at max ISO and can't open up the aperture any more or slow down the shutter speed. You shoot and deal with it in post. LR and other post programs have come a long way.

Ultimately a sensor only has 1 "ISO" setting, so all we are talking about is improving the efficiency of the sensor (and support architecture) to get better IQ across a wider range.

08-09-2012, 02:45 PM   #92
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
You shoot and deal with it in post processing.
Not exactly. Even if software development has come a long way there's no replacement for slowing the shutter speed to get smooth, flowing water in a stream or waterfall. Additional ISO steps would really help here.
08-09-2012, 05:47 PM   #93
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
More efficient sensors will have better high light recovery and better DR.
A full well is a full well mate. I think the most tech has been able to accomplish in that case is to control the overflow (blooming)
08-09-2012, 06:36 PM   #94
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Doesn't someone, I believe is Samsung, has a patent to count how many times the "well" is filled.

Dave

08-09-2012, 06:54 PM   #95
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QuoteOriginally posted by DaveBlack Quote
Doesn't someone, I believe is Samsung, has a patent to count how many times the "well" is filled.

Dave
I'm having trouble picturing (sorry) what this means. Is there a little elf at each sensel emptying the electron bucket as it fills and counting the number of times on an abacus?

I suppose the well can be emptied and a counter incremented. Sounds like a pile of work at a very high speed compared to building a deeper well but my knowledge of circuit design generally ranges from zero all the way to nil, depending on the day ....
08-09-2012, 08:08 PM   #96
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QuoteOriginally posted by builttospill Quote
Not exactly. Even if software development has come a long way there's no replacement for slowing the shutter speed to get smooth, flowing water in a stream or waterfall. Additional ISO steps would really help here.
Using the multiple images option (up to 9 exposures) of Pentax can do a pretty good job of smoothing the water.
08-09-2012, 08:38 PM   #97
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QuoteOriginally posted by LamyTax Quote
Sure, but what do you do if you're already at 1/8000 and absolutely don't want to stop down anymore and don't want to use an ND?
You can reduce flash power, I think...
Not using NDs- I can see the point of that. Even though NDs and CPLs are the most useful filters nowadays (as some color filters can be done in PP anyway), they're sometimes just additional cost too. But I would rarely see anyone go 1/8000s unless opting to stop bullets or hummingbird's wings in midair...

08-09-2012, 08:51 PM - 1 Like   #98
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QuoteOriginally posted by builttospill Quote
Not exactly. Even if software development has come a long way there's no replacement for slowing the shutter speed to get smooth, flowing water in a stream or waterfall. Additional ISO steps would really help here.
If it saves the world from having to see one more slow shutter waterfall picture, then it is worth it.
08-09-2012, 10:15 PM   #99
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
Using the multiple images option (up to 9 exposures) of Pentax can do a pretty good job of smoothing the water.
Yes, but my comment was in response to discussion of the advancement of PP software, not in-camera tricks.

QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
If it saves the world from having to see one more slow shutter waterfall picture, then it is worth it.
That's funny. I'm glad I didn't post an example then.
08-10-2012, 01:51 AM   #100
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
You can reduce flash power, I think...
Like I said, you often can't in studio settings.
08-10-2012, 02:50 AM   #101
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QuoteOriginally posted by LamyTax Quote
Like I said, you often can't in studio settings.
Hmm, that may be true when it's already way into the shoot, when everything else is working already e.g. models, and all the crew. As far as I know (and experienced) studio shoots, you already have a certain peg on the lighting you want to have in the shoot and then change angles mostly with only little changes in aperture and speed if just to adjust for depth of field and focal length.

Prior to the shoot proper, the photographer already sets white balance, color temperature and lighting control. Also, working in a studio with many powerful lights usually requires the services of an assistant, as the photographer will be busy shooting...

..but that's as far as experience has taught me. Anyone is free to correct me on whatever statement I pointed out wrongly~
08-10-2012, 03:01 AM   #102
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
Hmm, that may be true when it's already way into the shoot, when everything else is working already e.g. models, and all the crew. As far as I know (and experienced) studio shoots, you already have a certain peg on the lighting you want to have in the shoot and then change angles mostly with only little changes in aperture and speed if just to adjust for depth of field and focal length.

Prior to the shoot proper, the photographer already sets white balance, color temperature and lighting control. Also, working in a studio with many powerful lights usually requires the services of an assistant, as the photographer will be busy shooting...

..but that's as far as experience has taught me. Anyone is free to correct me on whatever statement I pointed out wrongly~
The problem is with many studio lighting equipment, you can't reduce power that much. Which is why some photographers go strobist for that .
Aside of reducing ISO to the lowest possible setting, you can only use ND-filters or stop down. ND-filters are no fun in dark studios for obvious reasons.
No, really, low in-camera ISO settings wouldn't be that bad .
08-10-2012, 03:45 AM   #103
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^hmm, that does indeed happen, though I never gone through that much before... at times we just reduce the number of lights or replace the lights with something weaker altogether. Unless of course the studio you're in doesn't have weaker lights.... or flashes... which is (for me) an easier workaround than waiting for a camera body that can support it.
08-10-2012, 06:21 AM   #104
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
If it saves the world from having to see one more slow shutter waterfall picture, then it is worth it.
Thanks for an eloquent and necessary rebuttal.
08-10-2012, 02:35 PM   #105
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What I would really like in a K-5 replacement would be:

Higher usable ISO
Lower ISO
Higher flash sync speed - not sure why we are still stuck at 1/180... need to move to electronic shutter.
The higher the MP, the better.

Of course I am still on a K10D... the K-01 interests me because it doesn't have a mirror.. more room to be able to mod more lenses to work than with the mirrored cameras.

The successor to the K-5 should be mirror less as well.. but also have a high quality digital view finder.

I would also like unlimited frame shooting at a decent speed. This shouldn't really be an issue with how fast SDHC cards have gotten. And if that is an issue, why not just adopt an addon that would fit like a battery grip that would accept an SSD... or even better yet, have an SSD attachement with a nice 4-8GB RAM buffer.. drool.
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