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09-17-2012, 09:51 AM   #196
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QuoteOriginally posted by janneman Quote
by the way what is bad about big focus points?
To use a real world example. Let's look at the K-5 with its golf ball sized center AF point. When shooting a concert where you are shooting 85mm at F/2 to keep ISO down and shutter speed up you have a very thing DoF and focus becomes pretty critical. The lighting is awful. You are holding the little red square right over the singers left eye and firing away. Through the little bitty OVF of the K-5 you can't really judge critical focus under this light. When you go to chimp a few images you see that the AF has been grabbing the microphone (much higher contrast) in most of the images. Yow now have a nice collection of microphone pictures with some fuzzy guy. To compensate you have to use AF micro adjust to make the lens back focus and lock on to the singers ear.

On APS-C DoF is too narrow to get reliable AF, so I can only imagine how much fun the 6D will be in that situation. The K-5 needs 2x as many AF points that are 1/2 the size of the current points.

For people using slow glass or shooting wide angle the current size of the AF points is not an issue. For people with fast glass who shoot wide open, the AF points are way too big. I would be willing to bet this is why Pentax has not released any long fast glass in years. They know the AF can't handle it. For Canon, I doubt the people who can only afford the 6D are going to be buying a 200L or 85L as they both cost more than the body. The first Canon wedding photog who upgrades to an 85L to shoot at F/1.2 is going to be all over the Canon forums talking about how they got a defective 85L that can't focus consistently below F/2.8. The first thing I did when I got my 85L was set out to master F/1.2 photography with my 5D. It can be very frustrating. Like getting a MP-E 65mm Macro Lens as your first macro lens.

09-17-2012, 10:23 AM   #197
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
They were broke musicians and I was a broke photographer. Now some of them are wealthy musicians and I am a half broke photographer.
Methinks you did something wrong... You should have been wealthy, not the bands... They got rich because of you...
09-17-2012, 10:51 AM   #198
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QuoteOriginally posted by janneman Quote
Methinks you did something wrong... You should have been wealthy, not the bands... They got rich because of you...
I wish. The ones who have gotten wealthy have done so by writing songs for other artist. I can't give my images any credit for that. There are only a couple who are still touring and playing full time. It is a grinding job and a hard life.
09-17-2012, 12:21 PM   #199
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QuoteOriginally posted by janneman Quote
Isnt that the same with Nikon?
No, the DX Nikon glass will work fine in DX mode on their FF cameras.

09-17-2012, 12:30 PM   #200
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
Even in the film days this was the case. Nothing has changed. It has gotten easier with digital, but those people have always been in the market. Looking for experience, or looking to build a portfolio, or friend of the family.
I have to disagree. In the film days you had to be pretty serious about photography to be carting around an slr, as learning to get good pictures was a far more expensive and drawn out process, subsequently you tended to get better results from what amateurs there were. These days anyone can afford to wield a camera that to most people in the street would look like the tool of a 'pro', but it is in no way indicative of their skill. Of course there were some not-so-good togs in the film days, but it's significantly more prevalent now.

It makes me sad seeing these people at weddings frantically chimping and faffing around trying to look like David Bailey, I'm not a pro and I wouldn't dream of suggesting I am good enough to earn my living taking pictures, but it is quite telling (to me at least) that the weddings where I see the worst offenders are invariably the ones where the happy couple end up using my photos after the event instead of the official ones.
09-17-2012, 12:32 PM   #201
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QuoteOriginally posted by JinDesu Quote
Yeah, but are those focus points as big as Pentax's?
*snickers*
I really want to see tests of the Pentax system - if it blows the 6D's away, that'll be depressing for Canon users.
"Hey, we got 11 points too. And -3EV. And 9 cross type. Booyaaaa~"
And then 7D users will laugh at us, but that's a different story.
Ya but Canon users don't know that Pentax even exists! Where do you see a Pentax camera? Canon is in every store and all over the TV. I live in Southern CA and I can't find a Pentax. Only the internet and the mighty forum!
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09-18-2012, 04:12 AM   #202
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QuoteOriginally posted by Vormulac Quote
I have to disagree. In the film days you had to be pretty serious about photography to be carting around an slr, as learning to get good pictures was a far more expensive and drawn out process, subsequently you tended to get better results from what amateurs there were. These days anyone can afford to wield a camera that to most people in the street would look like the tool of a 'pro', but it is in no way indicative of their skill. Of course there were some not-so-good togs in the film days, but it's significantly more prevalent now.

It makes me sad seeing these people at weddings frantically chimping and faffing around trying to look like David Bailey, I'm not a pro and I wouldn't dream of suggesting I am good enough to earn my living taking pictures, but it is quite telling (to me at least) that the weddings where I see the worst offenders are invariably the ones where the happy couple end up using my photos after the event instead of the official ones.
who do you think you are...David bailey?,,,,David Bailey...whose he..LMAO
09-18-2012, 04:13 AM   #203
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QuoteOriginally posted by Vormulac Quote
I have to disagree. In the film days you had to be pretty serious about photography to be carting around an slr, as learning to get good pictures was a far more expensive and drawn out process, subsequently you tended to get better results from what amateurs there were. These days anyone can afford to wield a camera that to most people in the street would look like the tool of a 'pro', but it is in no way indicative of their skill. Of course there were some not-so-good togs in the film days, but it's significantly more prevalent now.

It makes me sad seeing these people at weddings frantically chimping and faffing around trying to look like David Bailey, I'm not a pro and I wouldn't dream of suggesting I am good enough to earn my living taking pictures, but it is quite telling (to me at least) that the weddings where I see the worst offenders are invariably the ones where the happy couple end up using my photos after the event instead of the official ones.
I agree 100% with your statement sir

09-18-2012, 07:11 AM   #204
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote

On APS-C DoF is too narrow to get reliable AF, so I can only imagine how much fun the 6D will be in that situation. The K-5 needs 2x as many AF points that are 1/2 the size of the current points.
.
I thought FF DoF was narrower
09-18-2012, 07:35 AM   #205
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QuoteOriginally posted by janneman Quote
I thought FF DoF was narrower
It is - he is saying - if the k-5 (APS-C) has trouble achieving focus with 11 points, he's going to be amused by how the 6D does the same with less DOF.

Sorta like the 5D Mk2....
09-18-2012, 07:47 AM   #206
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QuoteQuote:
It is - he is saying - if the k-5 (APS-C) has trouble achieving focus with 11 points, he's going to be amused by how the 6D does the same with less DOF.

Sorta like the 5D Mk2....
If the AF central point of the 6D is the same as the one of the 5D it should be far more accurate that the one of the K-5...
Just have to cross the fingers that it focuses on the eye, not on the mike and on the ear... Same problem except that you might notice it if you use a "manual focusing" screen (EG-S or EE-S I don't remember) and that the focusing area might be smaller (I'm not that sure).

Well, another difference, with the 5D (I or II) forget the other focusing points than the central one in dim light... Where the K-5 can still have a chance to lock.
09-18-2012, 07:48 AM   #207
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kikool_CH Quote
If the AF central point of the 6D is the same as the one of the 5D it should be far more accurate that the one of the K-5...
Just have to cross the fingers that it focuses on the eye, not on the mike and on the ear... Same problem except that you might notice it if you use a "manual focusing" screen (EG-S or EE-S I don't remember) and that the focusing area might be smaller (I'm not that sure).
I actually didn't know that the center one of the 5D Mk2 was better than the k-5. However, I do know that quite a lot of people complain about the 5D's AF performance, and how the new Mk3's AF system is a huge upgrade (if nothing else much was) - that's why I was a little confused as to why they put this in the 6D, and not like the 7D's AF system.
09-18-2012, 07:56 AM   #208
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Dumb question maybe, but how do we know for sure that the AF point size hasn't decreased? Just wondering... Since we haven't had a chance to shoot a k5ii and Pentax hasn't mentioned anything about AF point size, just their number. Am I missing something here? Unless all they tweaked was the algorithm and no hardware changes were made...
09-18-2012, 08:07 AM   #209
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QuoteOriginally posted by gtl Quote
Dumb question maybe, but how do we know for sure that the AF point size hasn't decreased? Just wondering... Since we haven't had a chance to shoot a k5ii and Pentax hasn't mentioned anything about AF point size, just their number. Am I missing something here? Unless all they tweaked was the algorithm and no hardware changes were made...
There's a f/2.8 sensor in there, so the hardware has definitely changed.
09-18-2012, 08:09 AM   #210
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
There's a f/2.8 sensor in there, so the hardware has definitely changed.
Very good point there.
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