[Clavius]

I agree with you on this, but why insist that FF is even on the roadmap? Pentax has to realize that a significant portion of their users were disappointed by the k5II. They have to know that there are a lot of people considering jumping ship. So why show a FF prototype? If they are bound by some 6 month Sony/Nikon agreement, then why not just say that they are looking at their options for FF? The rhetoric the insists that FF is not coming or is not even on the roadmap...well, that is what has people throwing in the towels and moving to the dark side. I believe that most FF wishers are smart enough to know that it wasn't coming this photokina; we know that the k5II is all that Ricoh could do in such a short time...but they should have said it was on the roadmap. People would have waited if they said it was coming, but saying that it isn't coming will make a lot of people leave.

Exactly, it makes no sense keeping the FF-developement a secret, because it would keep a lot of potential switchers a while longer. That's why I think that there isn't going to be a FF from Pentax at all. Pentax wants to be in a niche market. And they're hoping Canon and Nikon will eventually leave the APSC-market. Actually, those signs are already there. Thus making Pentax the only big APSC-DSLR player.

[Zygonyx]

My guess is that it is a combination of three things. First of all, they really do want to sell some K5 IIs and they are afraid that if they indicate a planned camera on the horizon that a lot of folks will just hold off buying the current "flagship." The second thing is that such a full frame camera would require not only a camera, but the release of several lenses, all of which are still in the planning stage. Announce a product too soon and you spoil the announcement when it really happens. Finally, I think they are waiting for the air to clear a little bit. Nikon, Canon and Sony are busy staking out their claims in the full frame arena and Pentax is figuring out exactly where they can target a full frame camera where they will steal the most users from the current market leaders. Just simply releasing the smallest full frame dSLR camera probably would not be enough.

Still, I would be certain that there is something more "behind the curtain," that Pentax will bring out the beginning of next year or perhaps in the spring. (at least I'm hoping)

I am hoping so.
If you consider Canon 6D and Nikon D600 as "low-cost" answers to Sony A850, it has taken them exactly 2 years to complete production of these models.

[mee]

Exactly, it makes no sense keeping the FF-developement a secret, because it would keep a lot of potential switchers a while longer. That's why I think that there isn't going to be a FF from Pentax at all. Pentax wants to be in a niche market. And they're hoping Canon and Nikon will eventually leave the APSC-market. Actually, those signs are already there. Thus making Pentax the only big APSC-DSLR player.

Don't the Nikon FF bodies behave as APS-C with APS-C lenses?

[Kunzite]

Exactly, it makes no sense keeping the FF-developement a secret, because it would keep a lot of potential switchers a while longer.

Yet Nikon did exactly that.

[ElJamoquio]

Pentax wants to be in a niche market.

Ricoh has stated things differently.

[ElJamoquio]

Yet Nikon did exactly that.

It makes far less sense for Nikon to announce anything.



If Nikon would've announced the D800 early they would've potentially killed D700 sales.

If Nikon would've announced the D600 early they would've potentially killed D800 sales.

If Pentax would've announced the K-1 early they would've potentially killed D600 sales.

[Vanheden]

It´s to bad, i know it was just a Aprils fools joke but i still hoped to hear about a FF Pentax. The Cropcameras is realy nice (and good worth for the money), but still...

[Kunzite]

It makes far less sense for Nikon to announce anything.



If Nikon would've announced the D800 early they would've potentially killed D700 sales.

If Nikon would've announced the D600 early they would've potentially killed D800 sales.

If Pentax would've announced the K-1 early they would've potentially killed D600 sales.

I was talking about when they were preparing for their first FF digital camera. I don't remember them announcing it beforehand, leaking anything.
And you're waaaay to optimistic; if Pentax would announce a FF camera which would be launched sometimes in the future (because, if it exists, it's not ready yet) they would kill nothing. Wait, maybe their APS-C sales, as people would jump with "it'll only cost $1000, APS-C is so dead" speculations?

[FullertonImages]

It makes far less sense for Nikon to announce anything.



If Nikon would've announced the D800 early they would've potentially killed D700 sales.

If Nikon would've announced the D600 early they would've potentially killed D800 sales.

If Pentax would've announced the K-1 early they would've potentially killed D600 sales.

More likely, if Pentax announced the K-3/1 early, it would murder K-5II sales. But I still think it would be in their best interest to let the plans be known, and keep people on the hook for a few more months, rather than risk loosing them.

[sjwaldron]

More likely, if Pentax announced the K-3/1 early, it would murder K-5II sales. But I still think it would be in their best interest to let the plans be known, and keep people on the hook for a few more months, rather than risk loosing them.

People who want and are able to buy a full-frame Pentax most likely already have a K-5 or two. Besides what should be better auto-focus, nothing else appeals to me. K-5 AF is decent and there is no way I'd pay $1300 for even magically quick AF alone. Had Pentax at least put in some form of new processing engine that included peaking, improved movie mode with a new encoding codec (try uploading a video from the camera straight to Youtube...), and a few extras like a headphone jack or some other bits that would only require slight changes to the body, yeah.... maybe then it would have been worth around $1300. The rear LCD seems more like a bug fix for (rare) water intrusion problems than a new feature.

Sure, there will be people who are interested in upgrading from an older Pentax of the previous generation or before. In their case the K-5 is somewhat decent, but they will also see it is missing firmware/processor capabilities even the K-01 has.

If the K-5 II started and stayed around $950 to slightly undercut the D7000, maybe it wouldn't be as much of a red herring as it is now. Even at that price I would not bother. Actually, I'm in the beginning process of a big change at the moment...

[Allison]

I was talking about when they were preparing for their first FF digital camera. I don't remember them announcing it beforehand, leaking anything.
And you're waaaay to optimistic; if Pentax would announce a FF camera which would be launched sometimes in the future (because, if it exists, it's not ready yet) they would kill nothing. Wait, maybe their APS-C sales, as people would jump with "it'll only cost $1000, APS-C is so dead" speculations?

But the difference is that when they were announcing their first FF they were in a different position than Pentax is now. Sure Nikon had lost some to canon, but they weren't in a position where their current users were jumping ship as rapidly as pentax has been loosing (and is about to lose even more) users.

You are right, announcing a FFcamera for the way future release kills nothing. No one expects it to cost $1000 to $1500, so we are talking about the next class of spenders over the k5II. Plus, I just don't think a lot of k5 owners are planning on upgrading the the II.

Without a peep about future plans, I am starting to consider if I really should wait to sell off gear or if I should begin now so I can make my purchases in November right after the last wedding of the season. Maybe I could even rent Nikon for one wedding to see if I could make the switch mid season!

[IchabodCrane]

People who want and are able to buy a full-frame Pentax most likely already have a K-5 or two. Besides what should be better auto-focus, nothing else appeals to me. K-5 AF is decent and there is no way I'd pay $1300 for even magically quick AF alone. Had Pentax at least put in some form of new processing engine that included peaking, improved movie mode with a new encoding codec (try uploading a video from the camera straight to Youtube...), and a few extras like a headphone jack or some other bits that would only require slight changes to the body, yeah.... maybe then it would have been worth around $1300. The rear LCD seems more like a bug fix for (rare) water intrusion problems than a new feature.

Sure, there will be people who are interested in upgrading from an older Pentax of the previous generation or before. In their case the K-5 is somewhat decent, but they will also see it is missing firmware/processor capabilities even the K-01 has.

If the K-5 II started and stayed around $950 to slightly undercut the D7000, maybe it wouldn't be as much of a red herring as it is now. Even at that price I would not bother. Actually, I'm in the beginning process of a big change at the moment...

I think that because the K-5 II is such a mild upgrade, it indicates another camera is coming soon. Pentax knows that what they just came out with won't maintain the brand's standing longer term. Another camera must, and I suspect is expected by Pentax, to do just that.

[Class A]

Another camera must, and I suspect is expected by Pentax, to do just that.

For sure! But the wait is killing me...
(March 2013 is such a long way away and that will "only" be a new APS-C flagship, not an FF camera).

[trublubiker]

Could this be coming to a store near you?

PRIC may have been in hush hush talks with Truesense Imaging, the renamed 'Image Sensor Solutions', formerly owned by Eastman Kodak.
It is rumoured that the talks revolve around a FF CCD sensor to be used in the upcoming Pentax FF still camera, yes, you got it right Virginia, no Video.
The sensor, similar to that used in the Leica M9, will produce IQ far surpassing any CMOS sensor on the market today, and with some tweaks PRIC are hopeful of getting up to ISO1600, more than enough for 99.9% of normal use.

The new model, using the K5 chassis with built-in grip, will be named the K-1. The latest auto focusing solutions will be incorporated as well.

OK, I'm bored with all the FF rumours and made this up, but I'd be onto a camera like this, like a seagull onto a sick prawn. I'll more than happily sacrifice no video for a stand-out still camera.

[gtl]

I would agree that announcing a FF might kill K5II sales, but would it be better than losing users to Canikon with their new cheap FF? I think it is best if Pentax can at least confirm that they are currently developing a FF, with no release date in mind. A compromise, but it might prevent Canikon FF migration to those who can wait, and still not so adversely affect K5II sales.