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09-19-2012, 10:58 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
...Clearly they do have a FF sensor supplier whenever they are ready.
Who needs to be ready? - PRICL or the sensor supplier? My guess is that it is like what others have said. A FF sensor has not been supplied to PRICL as of today - either for R & D or production. Seeing as they probably don't even have a sensor for R & D, is there any doubt why the PRICL officials have been tight lipped about FF development or release timeframes?

QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
...I actually hope Pentax develops a new mount for a Full-Frame EVIL. That is a market where Pentax does not have to compete with Nikon and Canon and it is wide open. Take a page from Fuji. In one year they have launched a new mount that has sold like crazy and is receiving more 3rd party lens support than K-mount.
Given the snail's pace for recent product developments (the retreaded K-5 in all its forms - K-01, K-30, K-5II and K-5IIs, for example), do you really think that PRICL is even contemplating a new lens mount?

09-19-2012, 11:05 AM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by lammie200 Quote
Given the snail's pace for recent product developments (the retreaded K-5 in all its forms - K-01, K-30, K-5II and K-5IIs, for example), do you really think that PRICL is even contemplating a new lens mount?
That depends. What did Ricoh have in development prior to the purchase of Pentax? Ricoh could have had several products under development that it could release under the Pentax banner. Pentax is not the only factor in the development. Ricoh has been working on product development and has a well established R&D department that thinks outside the box.

Looking at Ricoh's background I could easily see a FF EVIL coming to market from them. Maybe it will have the Ricoh name on it. Maybe it will have the Pentax name on it. Ricoh may make the body and Pentax may design the glass.
09-19-2012, 11:12 AM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
That depends. What did Ricoh have in development prior to the purchase of Pentax? Ricoh could have had several products under development that it could release under the Pentax banner. Pentax is not the only factor in the development. Ricoh has been working on product development and has a well established R&D department that thinks outside the box.

Looking at Ricoh's background I could easily see a FF EVIL coming to market from them. Maybe it will have the Ricoh name on it. Maybe it will have the Pentax name on it. Ricoh may make the body and Pentax may design the glass.
GXR might be able to support FF. It should've at least supported K-Mount by now (instead of the dreadful K-01).
09-19-2012, 11:29 AM - 1 Like   #64
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To those who claim that Pentax is doomed: The sky is not falling.

While Pentax Ricoh has not officially confirmed a full-frame camera, it is likely that Pentax internally has one or more proposed designs and is researching market conditions and available parts for use in the design. I think that while Pentax currently does not have a sufficiently complete mock-up to show, let alone a functional prototype, the design and development of a new full-frame camera is well underway and an official announcement of the development of a full-frame camera is due some point next year.

Pentax is not dead and it will not be dying anytime soon. Ricoh is a huge company, and it surely recognizes the potential of the Pentax brand that Hoya had failed to harness. It's important to realize that the name Pentax once represented one of the world's foremost camera and lens manufacturers. All I ask of you is to continue waiting patiently for the next-generation Pentax camera.

--DragonLord


Last edited by bwDraco; 09-19-2012 at 11:38 AM.
09-19-2012, 11:37 AM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Read into it as you wish, but the Pentax/Ricoh merger happened 12 months ago. This would suggest that we can expect to hear a full-frame announcement in 6-12 month's time.
As always, Thank you for doing this for us. I am hopeful that they see our input as integral. Truly hope that they can see that they have f'd up in the US horribly and improve things ASAP.
09-19-2012, 11:46 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
They're running on vaporware now.

Why would they be afraid of making a clear statement - it's not like there is any other company that might be tipped off by the development of this new FF thingie and start sweating off and changing their plans as a result of such announcement.
Pretty much. A couple of coy smiles are supposed to provide proof that Pentax is preparing to make some sort of move? Have they done anything, other than smile, that demonstrates that they are preparing to support higher end users (FF) or make a serious retail push? There's nothing magical in the D6 that Pentax couldn't have replicated and released this year except having the balls to do it, the fact that they're not even showing design mules tells you what the real deal is.
09-19-2012, 11:53 AM - 1 Like   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by magkelly Quote
I would think their #1 priority would be retail availability. I mean if people can't find their cameras and lenses except online it really doesn't matter what they sell, now does it? I'm far more concerned with that than I am on when they will come out with a FF. Pentax-Ricoh you need to make it possible for me and people like me to be able to actually go in and take a look at your products on a shelf. I shouldn't have to take a plane trip to be able to do that. I live in a smaller city but there's a big city right across the bridge and another one an hour and a half away and NOWHERE can I buy anything by way of anything Pentax. I'd actually love to be able to buy a K-30 at least locally.
BINGO. I get asked camera buying advice at least weekly by people and it is quite literally impossible to try and steer them towards Pentax, because there is only one shop in a 100 mile radius that carries Pentax cameras. And the shelf space they devote to Pentax is smaller than the area they reserve for the 35mm film they are phasing out.
People want to know which CANON or NIKON camera they should be buying because those are the two brands they see on the counters of the electronics departments of every box store they enter. They don't even know what Pentax is.
09-19-2012, 11:54 AM   #68
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I dont care about AF, pixels and burst rate, ISO, just sell me that working original K-1 camera.

09-19-2012, 11:56 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by junyo Quote
Pretty much. A couple of coy smiles are supposed to provide proof that Pentax is preparing to make some sort of move? Have they done anything, other than smile, that demonstrates that they are preparing to support higher end users (FF) or make a serious retail push? There's nothing magical in the D6 that Pentax couldn't have replicated and released this year except having the balls to do it, the fact that they're not even showing design mules tells you what the real deal is.
I think it is realistic if talk about 1-2 year away. The coming spring with may see the high end APS K-3 and the rest of the APS roadmapped lenses in 2013. Then the APS line-up will be the best in business both regarding cameras and lenses. Also next year will see the two roadmapped zooms for the 645D and hopefully an updated 645 body. If lucky, we will see the FF camera late next year for 2014 release along with a handfull of new FF lenses.

A competitive Pentax FF camear is not feasible as long as Pentax have a ~5% marketshare. Hence, only a complete and sucessful APS line can pave the way for a possible Pentax FF camera.

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 09-19-2012 at 02:17 PM.
09-19-2012, 12:13 PM - 1 Like   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
NO FF till the spring of 2013 - no any serious future for Pentax Ricoh...IMO
They will miss the train of modern photo market forever.

no HIGH-END APS-C camera till January, 2013 - really bad...
if they will announce it at CP+, it means that the cameras will be on sale from March, 2013....
K-5 will be almost 2.5 year old!!!!

Amen
Don't panick !

Just think Pentax is not in the same time-schedule as their "competitors" ; and that this is a +90 years longlasting story...
09-19-2012, 12:24 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
I think it is realistic if talk about 1-2 year away. The coming spring with may see the high end APS K-3 and the rest of the APS roadmapped lenses in 2013. Then the APS line-up will be the best in business both regarding cameras and lenses. Also next year will see the two roadmapped zooms for the 645D and hopefully an updated 645 body. If lucky, we will see the FF camera late next year for 2014 release along with a handfull of new FF lenses.
What makes a 'high end' camera? My definition of 'high end' is what a professional photographer would use, as opposed to gadgets or tacked on features. So my simple question is 'Is there any reasonable chance that Pentax will release a camera that will seriously impact that market, APSC or FF, in the next couple of years?' My answer is no.

Echoing many people here, I can't lay hands on Pentax gear locally. I live in the third largest metro area of a northeastern US state, within an hour of the first and fiifth most populous metro areas of the country. And I have to drive every bit of that hour to touch a Pentax product in person. No matter how great an individual camera Pentax can make, they have almost zero presence on the ground. And that's the prep work they'd be doing if they were planning on releasing a 'high-end' anything. Retail, rental, and repair. Professional services. Accessories. The bodies are the end of a very long chain of the overall system. And as toe to toe as Pentax might make a body, what sells 'high end' Canikon is actually the system, and the halo from that, and the clear upgrade path it provides, translates to consumer sales. Pentax Ricoh would need to have that in place regardless of what new products they might offer. I'm a) assuming that they're smart people that realize this, and b) it's not accidental that we're not seeing this trajectory change. You need lead-time on this stuff. If anything serious were on the drawing board we'd be seeing precursor products and services, in new outlets, with new marketing.

Therefore the logical conclusion is Pentax will continue to release marginally improved iterations of familiar products, fine in their own right, but with a system that lags behind their competitors. That's probably fine for the existing user base, but it's death for a small market share company to not be making moves that bring in new customers. And I can't imagine picking Pentax if I were starting from scratch tomorrow. The lack of announcements mean that Pentax doesn't even believe internally that they have any case to make/product on the board that would compel someone to hold off on another purchase. Maybe it's different in the home market, but from a US prospective there doesn't appear to be any real movement.
09-19-2012, 12:32 PM   #72
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I still want to know about a Teleconverter......
09-19-2012, 12:33 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by lammie200 Quote
Who needs to be ready? - PRICL or the sensor supplier? My guess is that it is like what others have said. A FF sensor has not been supplied to PRICL as of today - either for R & D or production. Seeing as they probably don't even have a sensor for R & D, is there any doubt why the PRICL officials have been tight lipped about FF development or release timeframes?
Pentax and Ricoh historically buy Sony sensors, the same ones used in Nikon and Sony cameras. Sony clearly likes to sell sensors, because they supply other makers too, ergo they would be eager to supply Ricoh Pentax with sensors for R&D and later for production. I wouldn't be surprised if the sales force selling to Pentax and Nikon are operating as a profit center and selling to Sony too, at a discounted price of course.
09-19-2012, 12:36 PM   #74
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I bought my K10D used because it was the best value and had the best output for what I was able to spend. If I could afford a new camera and didn't own a bunch of Pentax film cameras and lenses there's no way I would buy a new K5II or whatever it's called. If I were starting over I'd probably go with Canon, Nikon or even Fuji. At least I can buy the cameras and accessories in most major cities.
09-19-2012, 12:52 PM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Also, when I asked them about the full-frame (even as I was reading the question), everyone couldn't help but smile. People smile when they're hiding something
!
Hiding the fact that they , like most of us, think there are more important issues?
I think no. 1 and 2 are more important for Pentax future than antyhing else...
By the way were we supposed to say something about individual countries as well? I thought just General issues. You should have mentioned de Beukelaer (BE/NL)agony, there is a whole thread on that on a Dutch Pentax forum..
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