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03-10-2013, 08:52 AM   #286
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Don't get me wrong here - not fanboying for Pentax. They're clearly competing for the #3 slice of the market and they'll likely never become #2. They make mistakes and have been capital-starved for years.
They're already #3, IMHO, as Sony gave up on DSLRs

I hope everything will work well and they'll close somehow the gap to a solid #3. Even making mistakes is fine, if they're trying hard enough - and succeed in most of what they'll be doing.
What do you think, will we find some interesting information about their progress in the IR reports that should be published after this FY's end?

03-10-2013, 10:45 PM   #287
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
They're already #3, IMHO, as Sony gave up on DSLRs
monochrome was talking about "#3 slice of the market", not just about DSLRs. Pentax is probably at #6 right now, after Canon, Nikon, Sony, Olympus and Panasonic. Not sure how they compare with Fuji. Really, the only brand they dominate in consumer camera sales is Sigma, which ironically makes more K mount lenses than Pentax itself.
03-11-2013, 01:00 AM   #288
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I think Pentax has about 30 K-mount lenses - how many Sigmas?
03-11-2013, 04:41 AM   #289
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
I think Pentax has about 30 K-mount lenses - how many Sigmas?
SRS Microsystems in the UK lists 28 K-mount Sigmas.

03-11-2013, 09:05 PM   #290
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
I think Pentax has about 30 K-mount lenses - how many Sigmas?
Well, B&H lists 31 of each, so it looks like things have actually improved and Pentax has reached parity.
03-12-2013, 03:13 PM   #291
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I always root for the underdog!
03-12-2013, 07:58 PM   #292
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QuoteOriginally posted by pentee Quote
Give me one reason why Pentax couldn't do the same thing in the camera world?
Easy - they don't have a Steve Jobs. None of the camera companies have such management today. Actually wait - Apple is now a camera manufacturer - the iPhone is killing compact cameras. What does it tell you when a software company eats away market from camera companies?

QuoteOriginally posted by pentee Quote
I always root for the underdog!
So which one do you root for here - Sigma or Pentax?
03-12-2013, 11:36 PM   #293
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
Easy - they don't have a Steve Jobs. None of the camera companies have such management today. Actually wait - Apple is now a camera manufacturer - the iPhone is killing compact cameras. What does it tell you when a software company eats away market from camera companies?



So which one do you root for here - Sigma or Pentax?
I hate to state the bleeding obvious but neither does Apple have a Steve Jobs.

You might find it interesting to look up the colloquial meaning of the word "Root" in an Australian slang dictionary. Every time I hear or read and American use that word I almost piss myself to death.

03-13-2013, 01:13 AM   #294
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
I hate to state the bleeding obvious but neither does Apple have a Steve Jobs.

You might find it interesting to look up the colloquial meaning of the word "Root" in an Australian slang dictionary. Every time I hear or read and American use that word I almost piss myself to death.
well, i suppose you're meaning to say someone's here is a root rat, eh? ;P
03-13-2013, 01:34 AM   #295
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
Easy - they don't have a Steve Jobs. None of the camera companies have such management today. Actually wait - Apple is now a camera manufacturer - the iPhone is killing compact cameras. What does it tell you when a software company eats away market from camera companies?
A software company? Apple has always been a software+hardware company, that's the key to their success and also their Achilles heel.
And they were a camera manufacturer already 19 years ago.
03-13-2013, 09:18 AM   #296
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
A software company? Apple has always been a software+hardware company, that's the key to their success and also their Achilles heel.
And they were a camera manufacturer already 19 years ago.
Apple is neither a hardware company nor a software company. They are incidental to the real business.

Apple is a content distributor and file warehouser. iTunes is the real mony. iCloud is the real crack pipe. iViews (first-run televison, replacing Hulu and YouTube) will change everything, starting in about 18 months. The iTV box will be a profitable sale, but incidental. Apple and Comcast, U-Verse, Charter and whoever else will form a symbiotic relationship the same way Apple and AT&T + Verizon did.
03-13-2013, 01:06 PM   #297
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QuoteOriginally posted by Heie Quote
-Heie
Hi Heie. In your conversation with Mr. Malcolm you talk about supporting talanted photographer. I think so... Sorry my bad English ))
Here is how Canon do this. Hope Pentax can do the same.
03-13-2013, 03:10 PM   #298
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
I hate to state the bleeding obvious but neither does Apple have a Steve Jobs.
Not anymore, but that's a different story. You know how it is: it's better to have had it and lose it than to not have had it at all.

QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
Every time I hear or read and American use that word I almost piss myself to death.
Thank you for the cultural exchange.
03-13-2013, 03:24 PM   #299
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
A software company? Apple has always been a software+hardware company, that's the key to their success and also their Achilles heel.
Point taken. Although, as you can see from the other reply to your post, trying to define what kind of company they really are is open to debate.

QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
And they were a camera manufacturer already 19 years ago.
Yes, you can argue that, but that is not what they were mainly known for, unlike the camera companies with which they were being compared here.

The point is that historical camera companies (and by historical, I mean those that had a significant activity during film era) are no longer innovating in this field. And that is mainly because the biggest names, Canon and Nikon, are too concerned about rocking the boat by producing radical new camera designs. So the new designs pop out from outside this restricted circle: Apple, Olympus, Panasonic, Samsung, Sony, Lytro. Or from companies that are trying to grow again, like Fuji.
03-13-2013, 04:15 PM   #300
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
The point is that historical camera companies (and by historical, I mean those that had a significant activity during film era) are no longer innovating in this field. And that is mainly because the biggest names, Canon and Nikon, are too concerned about rocking the boat by producing radical new camera designs. So the new designs pop out from outside this restricted circle: Apple, Olympus, Panasonic, Samsung, Sony, Lytro. Or from companies that are trying to grow again, like Fuji.
Maybe you can say they desperately want to enter markets they know little about?

No doubts that newcomers must try something new, but that isn't necessary an innovation they must try to survive. Apple's greatest innovation isn't its iPhone for example, but the AppStore, iTunes, iOS, OS X, etc. People are hooked to the quality of their software and service (and machines do look good too). Similarly, people are hooked to photography companies that have comprehensive lens systems. Lens system is "all or nothing" in photography, or a software equivalent. That is why Leica still has its faithful; their camera bodies are nothing special when compared to the quality of their lenses.

Players like Sony, despite buying rights for the whole A-mount, seem not to understand what's the real stake there. Sony really shines in standalone, compact cameras like the RX1, or RX100. They can build a small gadget, and ask Zeiss to supply a good lens for it. But when *they* must build a system that really makes sense, and which evolves around lenses, they become clueless because in their mind everything starts from small camera bodies, electronic miracles. Then lenses are thought about at a later stage … which we see from their offer and market behaviour.

They get things upside down, as many beginners to photography do. When beginners make a few steps, and start to think, they suddenly realise Sony isn't the best company for them. And then they switch to Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Leica …

Last edited by Uluru; 03-13-2013 at 04:22 PM.
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