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01-29-2013, 04:09 AM   #166
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Yeah, the sky is falling

If they managed to get out the 645D and the Q after a hostile takeover, and going through cost cutting and downsizing, that means they have a good potential of doing much better, being owned by a company actually interested in them. Ricoh is not seeing Pentax as unnecessary, low margin luggage.
A medium format pro solution would be much more of a "big, bold demonstration of commitment" than a small format enthusiast solution.

Running out of ideas and/or resources? Ridiculous; at Photokina only 11 months had passed since Pentax Ricoh was founded. There simply wasn't time to solve most stringent management/integration issues, then to define a medium term strategy down to product level, then to R&D a completely new product, making it market ready in time.
Unlike with Hoya, there is not even one single negative "vibe" from Pentax Ricoh.

The DSLR market is strong and growing; and that's mostly APS-C, as FFs are still single digit.

01-29-2013, 04:57 AM   #167
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yeah, the sky is falling

If they managed to get out the 645D and the Q after a hostile takeover, and going through cost cutting and downsizing, that means they have a good potential of doing much better, being owned by a company actually interested in them. Ricoh is not seeing Pentax as unnecessary, low margin luggage.
A medium format pro solution would be much more of a "big, bold demonstration of commitment" than a small format enthusiast solution.

Running out of ideas and/or resources? Ridiculous; at Photokina only 11 months had passed since Pentax Ricoh was founded. There simply wasn't time to solve most stringent management/integration issues, then to define a medium term strategy down to product level, then to R&D a completely new product, making it market ready in time.
Unlike with Hoya, there is not even one single negative "vibe" from Pentax Ricoh.

The DSLR market is strong and growing; and that's mostly APS-C, as FFs are still single digit.
Unless you are the CEO of Pentax, I don't see how you could possibly know any of these things with regard to Pentax. However, I doubt any company in this field can afford to turn out the lights for a period of time, as seems to have happened to Ricoh cameras for a start. Not surprisingly, folks tend to fear the worst and act accordingly. What is going on inside the company is unknown to them and even if they did know it likely wouldn't make any difference because the end result is the same: empty shelves.

An indication that PRI were coming out with all guns firing and a new and much stronger product range would be a strengthened sales and marketing network around the world. So far, there is no sign of that happening? I don't think we've seen any announcements of new deals being signed with distributors in places like Brazil, India, Oceania and so forth, or new offices established there? News of new hires and expansion in established territories like Europe and the USA? Few and far between.

Low-key sales and marketing = low risk and low investment required but low growth and low expectations. That's where we are at the moment. Imho, both Pentax and Ricoh have followed this path for the past few years, judging solely by the results one can see from the outside. Whether this path will continue to be viable in the face of the relentless march of online sales over B&M stores isn't yet known, but so far they do not appear to have strayed from it. Welcome to the world of Evangelion.
01-29-2013, 05:22 AM   #168
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Are you seriously implying that only the CEO can possibly know such things? Not even the high level Pentax management? And no information whatsoever is made public?
Since you said "any of these things with regard to Pentax", I'd guess even the existence of Pentax Ricoh is secret; wow!

The funny thing is, right after the claim that I don't know anything at all you start making baseless assumptions, like "turn out the lights for a period of time, as seems to have happened to Ricoh cameras for a start".

Are you closely monitoring their sales and marketing network in several continents? Do you have inside information, or how else are you doing it?

There was a Pentax UK interview in which it was said Pentax hired/was hiring engineers, to expand their R&D capacity. I'd say that's more telling than expanding only the marketing
01-29-2013, 05:42 AM   #169
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Ricoh has struggled as a company since acquiring IKON Office Systems in 2008. The earthquake and tsunami, then Thai flooding and Yen strength further set back their recovery. Ricoh established a company-wide restructuring last year to reduce costs and prepare for long-term profit recovery (which applies to Digicam as well as Office Systems. It appears for FY3/13 Digicam will be break-even to slightly profitable versus a loss in FY3/12. Ricoh plans significant investment to increase revenue in Digicam and analysts see a rise in product development and SG&A expenses (B&M stores, etc.) permitted by this revenue increase in the coming FY that begins FY4/13.

Be of good cheer, Pentaxians. James Malcolm has a plan and you will be happy.

01-29-2013, 05:54 AM - 1 Like   #170
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Pentax released four K-mount models in 2012, compared to none in 2011 and a total of ten cameras in 2012 compared to six in 2011. I thought the range of products they announced before Photokina was pretty impressive.

It's also interesting that the K-5 II is being cited as evidence of Pentax's lack of innovation, even though every review I've seen has been very positive. Meanwhile its main competitors, the Nikon D7000, Sony A77 and Canon 7D, have not been updated at all and the K-5 was always better than them anyway.

As for Ricoh, they haven't released anything this year, but their cameras haven't disappeared. They are still on the shelves. I'd expect to hear about something soon.

Where is the panic coming from?
01-29-2013, 05:56 AM   #171
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Ricoh has struggled as a company since acquiring IKON Office Systems in 2008. The earthquake and tsunami, then Thai flooding and Yen strength further set back their recovery. Ricoh established a company-wide restructuring last year to reduce costs and prepare for long-term profit recovery (which applies to Digicam as well as Office Systems. It appears for FY3/13 Digicam will be break-even to slightly profitable versus a loss in FY3/12. Ricoh plans significant investment to increase revenue in Digicam and analysts see a rise in product development and SG&A expenses (B&M stores, etc.) permitted by this revenue increase in the coming FY that begins FY4/13.

Be of good cheer, Pentaxians. James Malcolm has a plan and you will be happy.

As for the earthquake and tsunami thing in relation to business in that region... Now this comes from all sorts of media throughout the region there. That the businesses were all highly insured against just about anything. Most used their insurance as a type of upgrade.

The only real larger scaled businesses that were effected were computer chip companies. Almost all of the others considered is as not much more than a bump in the road
01-29-2013, 05:57 AM   #172
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Are you seriously implying that only the CEO can possibly know such things? Not even the high level Pentax management? And no information whatsoever is made public?
Since you said "any of these things with regard to Pentax", I'd guess even the existence of Pentax Ricoh is secret; wow!

The funny thing is, right after the claim that I don't know anything at all you start making baseless assumptions, like "turn out the lights for a period of time, as seems to have happened to Ricoh cameras for a start".

Are you closely monitoring their sales and marketing network in several continents? Do you have inside information, or how else are you doing it?

There was a Pentax UK interview in which it was said Pentax hired/was hiring engineers, to expand their R&D capacity. I'd say that's more telling than expanding only the marketing
Don't worry, I'm not implying that you concoct your posts while wearing a tricorn hat, a top coat and tails and carrying a sword (success with this method is patchy at best because on the internet no one knows you're Napoleon Bonaparte). I'm just pointing out that no news is no news. Like others, perhaps, I hope that the current expo will bring news of a new Ricoh camera.
01-29-2013, 06:04 AM   #173
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
As for the earthquake and tsunami thing in relation to business in that region... Now this comes from all sorts of media throughout the region there. That the businesses were all highly insured against just about anything. Most used their insurance as a type of upgrade.

The only real larger scaled businesses that were effected were computer chip companies. Almost all of the others considered is as not much more than a bump in the road
The point about insurance is probably true, but I did hear that the Q10's introduction was delayed four months by supply issues caused by the tsunami. It's quite possible that other releases were delayed too.

01-29-2013, 06:51 AM   #174
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
As for the earthquake and tsunami thing in relation to business in that region... Now this comes from all sorts of media throughout the region there. That the businesses were all highly insured against just about anything. Most used their insurance as a type of upgrade.

The only real larger scaled businesses that were effected were computer chip companies. Almost all of the others considered is as not much more than a bump in the road
I've read that the emergence of consumer FF is a result of the early de-capitalization of some of the APSc fab lines post-tsunami (IOW, while those lines had not yet earned back their planned return on invested capital, that plan was accelerated by the business disruption- or at least by the need to re-table the entire fab shop).

The thought at the time was, why bother reinvesting in mature fab tech when you can push the envelope with insurance money?
01-29-2013, 07:45 AM   #175
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
Whether this path will continue to be viable in the face of the relentless march of online sales over B&M stores isn't yet known, but so far they do not appear to have strayed from it. Welcome to the world of Evangelion.
I hope you're not thinking of a Third Impact scenario for Pentax somewhere down the road... if we're on the same page that is.
01-29-2013, 08:29 AM   #176
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
Don't worry, I'm not implying that you concoct your posts while wearing a tricorn hat, a top coat and tails and carrying a sword (success with this method is patchy at best because on the internet no one knows you're Napoleon Bonaparte). I'm just pointing out that no news is no news. Like others, perhaps, I hope that the current expo will bring news of a new Ricoh camera.
Oh, boy...we're not in kindergarten...
There is some publicly available information. No news is something you've made up, basically denying the available information. Jonathan Martin saying that Ricoh planned to re-hire engineers fired by Hoya is news. Pentax talking about doubling their sales in 2013 is news. The interviews with Kitazawa-san are news.
You should read what monochrome said; he's not making things up.

JPT: of course, it's not only the companies with factories in the affected areas that had to suffer.

QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
I hope you're not thinking of a Third Impact scenario for Pentax somewhere down the road... if we're on the same page that is.
I think Pentax is preparing to make an impact on the market, but with less serious consequences
01-29-2013, 08:39 AM   #177
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Oh, boy...we're not in kindergarten...
There is some publicly available information. No news is something you've made up, basically denying the available information. Jonathan Martin saying that Ricoh planned to re-hire engineers fired by Hoya is news. Pentax talking about doubling their sales in 2013 is news. The interviews with Kitazawa-san are news.
You should read what monochrome said; he's not making things up.
I'm afraid you are confusing talking and talking about talking with action, doing stuff, what happens not what is said, things on shelves or in your hand, staff hired, offices opened, etc. That's been my point all along. Sorry you missed it, mon corporal. Carry on.
01-29-2013, 08:47 AM   #178
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
I'm afraid you are confusing talking and talking about talking with action, doing stuff, what happens not what is said, things on shelves or in your hand, staff hired, offices opened, etc. That's been my point all along. Sorry you missed it, mon corporal. Carry on.
Hey, cool down guys, CP+ is less than two days away, let's wait and see if Pentax/Ricoh shows some serious strength then! If they have nothing more to offer than Beyblade-inspired WG's and Anime Q10s, I'll join the whining crowd
01-29-2013, 09:22 AM   #179
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gazonk, I am quite impatient myself, but I won't get angry if their good stuff isn't ready for CP+

QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
I'm afraid you are confusing talking and talking about talking with action, doing stuff, what happens not what is said, things on shelves or in your hand, staff hired, offices opened, etc. That's been my point all along. Sorry you missed it, mon corporal. Carry on.
I'm not confusing anything; and I'd appreciate if you'd stop being rude. Breaking news: people can disagree with you, and shouldn't be insulted for that.

Things already happened, new products were being launched (based on Pentax-Hoya projects, since in less than 11 months that's all it could be done), staff was hired (Jonathan Martin's AP interview), marketing campaigns started to appear (e.g. the Q campaign in Japan, Pentax Meet Britain). It's not their fault, nor mine if you chose to ignore such things.

And some people would actually feel their "talk" means assuming some responsibilities. For example, if they say they plan to double sales in 2013 but won't do anything to make it happen, their investors would not be happy.
01-29-2013, 09:40 AM   #180
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
gazonk, I am quite impatient myself, but I won't get angry if their good stuff isn't ready for CP+
If they can't show a new APS-C body or bodies yet, which is quite likely, I expect at least a product announcement and a mock-up. If nothing is announced now, I won't be switching brands, I will wait and get to know my new K-01.
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