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06-12-2013, 03:05 AM   #1201
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You are missing the point.

Most people in the market will have only a tablet or smartphone in the future. Their limited storage means connectivity to the network is a must. Or the camera will not sell. Making cameras reliant on the PC darkroom is a path to shrinking sales.
Finally I agree with you. At least a built-in Wifi connection is a *must* for upcoming Pentax DSLR', starting with the cheaper models.

06-12-2013, 03:35 AM   #1202
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Most people in the market will have only a tablet or smartphone in the future. ... Making cameras reliant on the PC darkroom is a path to shrinking sales.
Once again, reading too many sales brochures. How many times have I heard 'the PC is dead' line before over the last 20 years. Games consoles didn't kill it, tablets haven't killed it, smart-phones wont kill it, cloud computing won't kill it. Even Apple is selling more Macs than ever before. A general purpose, flexible tool like the PC desktop/laptop/netbook isn't going away anytime soon.
06-12-2013, 04:34 AM   #1203
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You cannot have photographic excellence without great optics. Canon, Nikon, and, yes, Pentax, are at heart optical companies. They spin glass.

They also engineer bodies, but those are increasingly a computing platform. And computing means connectivity. Pentax and the DSLR'S makers are not "getting it" yet, and it will/is costing sales.
06-12-2013, 04:37 AM   #1204
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I never said the PC is dead. I just purchased a brand me Mac Mini loaded.

But I know that majority of use in the future will NOT be the desktop PC. The majority of the CPU market is heading away from that, and even away from laptops. While this is more for consumption than production, having your camera sales strategy totally tied to the PC darkroom is a sales killer.

06-12-2013, 04:47 AM   #1205
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I don't care if Pentax sticks Wifi in their newest cameras, but I would never use it to upload files directly to the internet. Any image worth posting, is worth post processing a little bit. I guess you have all these filters in your camera already, it is sort of like instagram, if that is what works for you.
06-12-2013, 04:48 AM   #1206
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The secret of success is to give the consumers what they want, or what they think they want. Or, to paraphrase Steve Jobs, what they never knew they wanted.
06-12-2013, 04:50 AM   #1207
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You cannot have photographic excellence without great optics. Canon, Nikon, and, yes, Pentax, are at heart optical companies. They spin glass.
Maybe you can't today but that is no guarantee of tomorrow. It's not that hard to foresee a lens which takes an excellent overall image but the particular image qualities are dialed in using software. Depending on the sensor, that may be anything from a Zeiss or Nikon wide-angle effect to a Leica or Pentax portrait lens effect, with bokeh and cropping to match. The result will never be exactly the same as the real deal, but for the majority of folks the law of "good enough" will kick in. So, before long, folks may be saying "you cannot have photographic excellence without a good enough lens and great software".

I'm with you on the IT stuff. I'd guess the answer is to build enough of it into the camera to satisfy most folks. There will always be some for whom there is no substitute for a digital darkroom. Fine, but increasingly it will come at a pricing premium as we can already see from Adobe's latest moves.
06-12-2013, 05:32 AM   #1208
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I don't care if Pentax sticks Wifi in their newest cameras, but I would never use it to upload files directly to the internet. Any image worth posting, is worth post processing a little bit. I guess you have all these filters in your camera already, it is sort of like instagram, if that is what works for you.
Some people buy cameras with two card slots so they can have an instant backup of their shots. Imagine files being automatically uploaded so you don't need that dual-card protection anymore.

06-12-2013, 06:11 AM   #1209
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
Some people buy cameras with two card slots so they can have an instant backup of their shots. Imagine files being automatically uploaded so you don't need that dual-card protection anymore.
That's assuming you have a fast upload capability available. If I were to upload full res files from camera to, say, Flickr it would take me a couple of hours to upload 40 or 50 RAW images. Not everywhere has fast internet available and I don't think this would take the place of having a second card. Particularly not if you are a professional doing out door photography, shooting weddings, etc.
06-12-2013, 07:49 AM   #1210
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Once again, reading too many sales brochures. How many times have I heard 'the PC is dead' line before over the last 20 years. Games consoles didn't kill it, tablets haven't killed it, smart-phones wont kill it, cloud computing won't kill it. Even Apple is selling more Macs than ever before. A general purpose, flexible tool like the PC desktop/laptop/netbook isn't going away anytime soon.
You are not considering upcoming markets like India where they skipped this PC revolution altogether and moved directly to smartphone + tablet revolution. You won't find a PC in every house in India, but I bet you'd find cameras in every house in next 5 years. Smartphones are already there with everyone.

These people need a way to directly share/upload photos to social networking/backup websites. I can't comment about other upcoming markets, but this is the trend in India at least.
06-12-2013, 07:49 AM   #1211
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Tablets are taking over from laptops and PC's at lower price points.

Yet cameras can hardly access them (or smarptphones). It's as if the camera makers WANT you to go to a PC at home to PP.

Dumb strategy. the tablet should be able to access the images perhaps without full download, for quick toss and edits and posting. but the camera makers still see the camera as a discrete environment, the PC darkroom as another, and online as yet another.

I predict that as people realize they will use their tablets more than their (older) PC they will curtail their DSLR and big sensor camera use and purchases correspondingly until the camera makers get their image transfer and editing over to where the market is going.

1 hour minilabs in the film days were faster than the PC SD card data dump swap edit convert resize export upload process we have now!

I should be able to process my files in-camera or on a WiFi linked tablet and upload them directly from either the camera or tablet/smartphone directly to the Pentax Gallery or even Pentax Forums Gallery. as well as Flickr. I should be able to do that while waiting for my kid to finish gymnastics club. Select images for PP can be set aside fro better revision from RAW later on the PC as desired, but for the vast majority of the future market, this will never happen.
06-12-2013, 07:52 AM   #1212
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I challenge Pentax that for 2014 all models have a direct WiFi to Flickr, Pentax Gallery, and Pentax Forums from in-camera or from iOS and Android apps.
06-12-2013, 08:05 AM   #1213
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
I challenge Pentax that for 2014 all models have a direct WiFi to Flickr, Pentax Gallery, and Pentax Forums from in-camera or from iOS and Android apps.
Thom Hogan predicts that is how cameras are heading. It would be nice if Pentax actually lead the market for once.
06-12-2013, 08:05 AM   #1214
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QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Are those really /pro/ features?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy my WiFi SD cards, it's just that I am not convinced that a large number of pros would do "direct-to-facepintgram" without any kind of inspection on a larger screen and PP.

I'm no pro, and I don't use "direct-to-facepintgram" but simply the WiFi cards to dump the data off the camera to a secondary storage (for backup & upload to my personal WebDAV off-site backup). I'd imagine that an integrated non-hosted solution for that would be more in the veins of what a pro would need (backup to home, ship off to image/news editor automatically).
A friend of mine asisted her husband who was taking photos for Sports Illustrated of the NCAA basketball games. Her job was to take memory cards from her husband camera and upload them to SI site for the SI editors to use. With built-in WIFI he could have sent them directly from the camera to the SI editors.

So there is a need for some photographers to have built-in WIFI. The reasons could be the following:
1. Uploading to a social media site for everyone to view
2. Uploading to the editor's site for him to use
3. Uploading to your own site for your own personal off-site backup
4. Quick review of the photo on a large screen tablet.
5. With the proper app you can totally control the camera remotely from your smartphone or tablet. So you can mount the camera on a long pole and take overhead shots and be able to zoom, focus and all other controls directly on your handheld smartphone. So far the Panasonic camera like the GH3 is the best for this type of use.

Anyhow, there are numerous uses for built-in wifi and I can see it becoming a standard feature in cameras.
06-12-2013, 09:21 AM   #1215
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
What if I don't have a Facebook or twitter or tumblr? All I have is a flickr and my own sites....

I know that the Eye-Fi card allows uploading directly to Flickr via direct connection to a smart phone.
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