Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
02-21-2013, 03:08 AM   #121
Site Supporter
Cynog Ap Brychan's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gloucester
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,091
QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
A format in its own right with no complete lens lineup.
What would you call a complete lens line up? What do you think is missing from the Pentax range, for example? I'm interested in your views on this.

02-21-2013, 04:30 AM   #122
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,253
An m4/3 fan would probably say "5 almost identical normal zooms"
02-21-2013, 07:52 AM   #123
Pentaxian
Pål Jensen's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Norway
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,139
QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
He did say "from now on".



A format in its own right with no complete lens lineup. And once you start buying FF lenses for an APS-C camera, you can just as well get a FF camera as well (*) - after all, most of the money you'll spend building a system will go into lenses (**).

(*) except if you're stuck waiting for one - such situations do happen for some brands.
(**) unless you just stick with kit lenses, which is what most of the APS-C customers do, which is why there are still more FF lenses than APS-C lenses despite more APS-C cameras being sold than FF ones. I am curious how the FF lens market share looks like - I bet it's not at 5-7% of the DSLR lens market.

People have been saying from now on for a decade. Last it was after the D600 release and the 6D release; neither have increased FF marketshare visibily.

The lens line-up is pretty complete. FF lenses is no problem for APS; only make the lenses a bit more expensive than otherwise (depending on type). They (FF lenses that is) just turn into something diferent when used on APS. The lens diametre of APS and FF are the same. EG. my FA* 200/4 Macro have turned into something totally wonderful when used on APS: It now goes to 50% larger than life size (compared to FF) for Macro. It have the magnification of a 300mm lens (on FF) which I find much more useful generally than the 200mm. I can shoot one stop faster for the same DOF; particularly fantastic for macro. A 300/4 Macro that goes 50% larger than lifesize at the size of a 200mm lens and the DOF characteristics of the 200mm lens do not exist for FF and never will! Using FF lenses on APS is not a disadvantage neccessarily...

You seem to asume that most people want and would buy an FF camera. This is not the case. Most don't care about the size of the sensor and have no wish for lenses physically 50% longer for the same magnification (and longer close focus distance for the same magnification or one stop longer shutterspeed for the same DOF), not to mention the extra cost, as long as the output quality is good enough. And smaller sensors are only getting better making them more relevant.

BTW Canon will attempt to make their lens line "complete" by releasing more APS lenses.

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 02-21-2013 at 08:22 AM.
02-21-2013, 07:55 AM   #124
Pentaxian
Clavius's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: De Klundert
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,118
Now with the new highly featured, high built quality and CHEAP Nikon D7100, what features would make the upcoming K-3(s) attractive?

02-21-2013, 08:03 AM   #125
Pentaxian
Pål Jensen's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Norway
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,139
QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Now with the new highly featured, high built quality and CHEAP Nikon D7100, what features would make the upcoming K-3(s) attractive?
The fact that it is a Pentax will make it attractive

Anyway, this new Nikon will make APS even more popular and making 24mp FF camera, whose output will be practically identical to the 24mp APS in most cases, even harder to sell to the general consumer...

Theres also a Nikon D400 coming this summer according to rumors. The K3 should probably be compared to this one...

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 02-21-2013 at 08:16 AM.
02-21-2013, 08:06 AM - 1 Like   #126
Veteran Member
froeschle's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Germany
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 552
QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Now with the new highly featured, high built quality and CHEAP Nikon D7100, what features would make the upcoming K-3(s) attractive?
A full frame sensor ...
02-21-2013, 08:11 AM   #127
Pentaxian
jeffshaddix's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 1,371
QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
That the 24 Mpixels Sony sensor suffers from crosstalk is a fact confirmed by the test of many non-retrofocus wide angles and ultra fast standard to short telephoto lenses with symmetrical design (aka double Gauss).

That Pentax abandoned the "original" K-3 with 24 Mpixels Sony sensor in favour of K-5 II when they discovered, quite late during the development phase, how poorly the prototype behaved with some prestigious lenses (FA Limited) was indicated to me by a very reliable source whose identity I cannot disclose here.

That the new Sony SLT Alpha 58, supposedly announced on or before next Monday, will feature a 20 Mpixels sensor is an insistent rumour, probably true since we are so close to announcement -answer in a few days.

[Edit on 20th February: Sony Alpha 58 was announced today. It features a brand new Exmor APS HD 20.1 Mpixels CMOS sensor]

That Pentax K-3 will feature the same sensor is pure guess on my side.
I wonder if that crosstalk is the reason they released the D7100 without an AA filter...

I'd still much prefer the 20MP version, there's a large difference in the non-extended ISO range (100-6400 24MP, 100-16000 20MP), which I expect bodes well for low-light/high-DR shooters like myself.
02-21-2013, 08:25 AM   #128
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,253
QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Now with the new highly featured, high built quality and CHEAP Nikon D7100, what features would make the upcoming K-3(s) attractive?
The D7100 is not that highly featured, its build quality seems similar to its predecessor and it's not exactly cheap. I'd say a K-3 would have no problem being upper class.

02-21-2013, 08:27 AM   #129
Pentaxian
audiobomber's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6,677
QuoteOriginally posted by jeffshaddix Quote
I'd still much prefer the 20MP version, there's a large difference in the non-extended ISO range (100-6400 24MP, 100-16000 20MP), which I expect bodes well for low-light/high-DR shooters like myself.
I read rumours yesterday that the new Sony 20mp has a stop higher SNR than the 24mp. That's hard to believe, but any improvement in SNR with more megapixels sounds juicy to me.
02-21-2013, 08:30 AM   #130
Pentaxian
audiobomber's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6,677
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The D7100 is not that highly featured, its build quality seems similar to its predecessor and it's not exactly cheap. I'd say a K-3 would have no problem being upper class.
The DPR preview says it has much improved AF:

"Compared to its predecessor the D7000, the D7100 doesn't just offer an upgraded sensor with a higher pixel-count. It also features a significantly upgraded AF system, with 51 AF points (15 cross type) as opposed to 39 in the older model. It shares these specifications, and the Multi-Cam 3500DX designation with the D300S, but Nikon promises the autofocus algorithms from the D4 which could, in part, explain the extended sensitivity range (with the D7100 able to focus in light as low as -2EV, according to its specifications)."
02-21-2013, 08:39 AM   #131
Pentaxian
mecrox's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Oxford, UK
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 2,104
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The D7100 is not that highly featured, its build quality seems similar to its predecessor and it's not exactly cheap. I'd say a K-3 would have no problem being upper class.
Being upper class and being upper class and profitable are two different things. In addition, the D7100 is very highly featured indeed compared to cameras of 3-4 years ago. Some of the things in the D7100 - tweaked 51-point AF system down to f8, dual card slots, wifi, iphone/android apps, OVF information overlays, different crop modes - are a serious challenge to competitors and I don't think competitors can afford to ignore them, least of all at this sticker price. But if Nikon have got this camera right, it will sell in stupendous quantities and be a bread and butter mainstay for them for a couple of years, just like the D7000 and D90 before it. With every iteration of the APS-C cycle, the stakes get higher, the tech and software requirements become more and more involved, the investment needed increases. We may hope Ricoh is prepared to stand behind their share of this market, but the truth is we don't know and we won't know until a couple more APS-C Pentax DSLRs are out there. I think we can say that maintaining a hold in this market just got even more challenging.
02-21-2013, 08:50 AM   #132
Pentaxian
Clavius's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: De Klundert
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,118
QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
The fact that it is a Pentax will make it attractive
I'm glad you put that smily there.


QuoteOriginally posted by froeschle Quote
A full frame sensor ...
You are probably right. If it's considerably more affordable then any of the competition, it might attract new customers.


QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The D7100 is not that highly featured,
Have you seen the sensor? The 51 point AF system? (vs 11 point in Pentax.) Dual card slots? Processor? We can only wish Pentax will issue something almost as wel featured.


QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
and it's not exactly cheap.
Now I'm convinces you're not being serious. The MSRP of the K5IIs is $1299,95 whilst the D7100 is announced to be only $1200,-.

What are the chances of the K-3 being equally or better specced at an equal or better price? This is a headshot to Pentax.
02-21-2013, 08:53 AM   #133
Veteran Member




Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,893
QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
I can shoot one stop faster for the same DOF; particularly fantastic for macro....

have no wish for lenses physically 50% longer for the same magnification
I don't mind the physical effort of changing my ISO. Sometimes, when I set my camera to TAv mode, changing ISO is automatically done for me.

I also don't mind the effort of cropping in post-processing. In fact it usually makes things easier, as I don't have to frame things 100% correctly - whether hand-held macro or wildlife, this makes my life easier.


So in sum total, neither of your two objections applies to me.
02-21-2013, 08:57 AM   #134
ogl
Pentaxian
ogl's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,220
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The D7100 is not that highly featured, its build quality seems similar to its predecessor and it's not exactly cheap. I'd say a K-3 would have no problem being upper class.
How to be better than D7100?

Highly featured. No doubt.
OLED overlay in VF
Multi-CAM 3500DX with 3D Color Matrix Metering II 2,016 pixel RGB sensor and Scene Recognition System, 51-Point AF
Autofocus
Contrast Detect (sensor)
Phase Detect
Multi-area
Center
Selective single-point
Tracking
Single
Continuous
Face Detection
Live View

Release time lag of 0.052s
The new, wide and bright LCD screen is 3.2-inches and features a super high resolution of 1,229K dots
Big VF
Shutter has been tested to withstand 150,000 cycles

Weather resist

and e.t.c

How to be better?

Price - 1199 USD for body...
02-21-2013, 08:59 AM   #135
ogl
Pentaxian
ogl's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,220
Original Poster
K-3 could be close to D7100...But higher class? If only K-3 has FF sensor ...
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
pentax cameras, pentax news, pentax rumors
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Minikina 2013 vsl 01/02.06.2013 in Wiesbaden veraikon General Talk 9 05-27-2013 10:37 AM
Weekly Challenge POTW #251 27 Jan 2013 through 10 Feb 2013 Dr Orloff Weekly Photo Challenges 54 02-10-2013 11:59 AM
Weekly Challenge POTW #250 20 Jan 2013 through 3 Feb 2013 Douge Weekly Photo Challenges 43 02-03-2013 09:45 PM
PENTAX Introduces New K-5 II & K-5 IIs DSLR Cameras Versatile cameras feature newly d Adam Homepage & Official Pentax News 18 09-13-2012 07:14 AM
NEW Pentax Lens Roadmap 2012/2013 oddesy Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 331 04-07-2012 02:42 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:25 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top