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04-20-2013, 01:48 PM   #181
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Pentax have never made an FF digital camera. Why anyone wanting one buying a Pentax in the first place is a mystery. Theres no net departure from Pentax. They are increasing their share - people are buying Pentax gear coming from Nikon and Canon. Some are switching to Pentax 645 from Nikon and Canon. If you want to use Sigma lenses buy a camera that take Sigma lenses. End of story...
You can say that all new Pentax users are coming from Nikon or Canon. Some could be coming from other types and brands or brand new users. Even some of the Canon/Nikon converts may have used Pentax film bodies originally. Lastly, Pentax had ff prototypes which is well known. They had a chance to and actually planned their entry into digital slr in the ff format 13 years ago which was when the FA ltds were new designs. People have been watching every since.

04-20-2013, 03:33 PM   #182
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
Absolutely outstanding! Yes, they did do something like that for Christmas and that was brilliant. Combine that with your idea (Bass Pro Shop comes to mind too BTW - broader appeal) and you have a real way to establish a niche AND broaden your base of users at the same time.
Yes - Bass Pro Shop and Cabela's would be first class targets of opportunity. Get the pattern nailed down and then go after Costco. Then if you are going to plan to bring out a FF and or K3 - keep the K30, K5II and K5IIs going. The production line is humming along, no problems - to give a larger footprint and family of cameras. Parts in volume will probably be decreasing in cost, allowing some margin expansion. Bring in new users, giving them a wider selection of products (in 3 to 5 years a percentage of them will be return users, and will have purchased additional lenses in the mean time). In this way, you can satisfy demand while you expand production in a measured way based on demand. Add the K3 and FF or whatever, when the bugs are worked out and production can be ramped up easily.

The sports shops - especially the higher end ones, are not going anywhere (like the camera stores). They also have a wider customer and product base. Leveraging into this type of retail business will provide the brick and mortar retail locations necessary to get hands on the cameras - the ergonomics will sell them. It might also attract a new clientele into the sports stores - a win/win for both the store and Pentax. I just can not understand the lack of thinking on the part of Pentax here. One foot in front of the other guys - it isn't that difficult to walk. Note - first you have to lift your head, and then master rolling over, then lifting up and getting on all fours, and try to crawl. After mastering crawling around then first steps, and walking - then comes running and hurdling. But first you have to start - with an idea and a plan. Then you need to execute to the plan, making adjustments when things run amok.

Also, toss in a flyer for the Pentax Forums with the camera - after market support.

Produce spares and get them per-positioned in order to keep repair cycles down. You do not want to give your customers the - wait the 3 to 5 weeks for "parts from Japan", song and dance.

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
If accurate, Rockville Bob's experience today is very troubling: Pentax - a No Show.
I saw that a bit earlier. There is no excuse for things like that occurring. If someone gets sick or whatever - get a replacement out FAST. If its just poor planning - get someone who can perform and carry the water. I have to ask why I am even surprised at this, after reading about the camera show a while ago, where Pentax attended but brought nothing and did nothing.

This action or inaction coupled with the above idea is death. Pentax needs to be able to support their existing camera stores who have actually maintained a business presence. Not having someone drop by in 2 years is stupid. Not supplying a representative, after the store advertises on radio that one is there is a non starter. I have to ask - if I were a sports shop, why would I want your product if you are not able to support the what - 20 locations across the US that you currently have? And I hear that you do the dead fish act at the camera shows? You are begging to fail here. Fix it - get started.

Guys - you are not selling unobtainium for heaven's sake.


Last edited by interested_observer; 04-20-2013 at 03:57 PM.
04-20-2013, 03:48 PM   #183
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Sometimes I think we care more about the brand than they do. I'd bet any one of us living within 100 miles of Ace would have stepped in if asked.

Cabellas, Bass Pro, REI, Dick's Sporting Goods (near the Scopes and Binoculars- do they have Pentax? - unless they follow through on the "No More Guns" threat). There are dozens of small outdoor chains like The Alpine Shop in Missouri. There are dozens of catalog outdoor retailers in addition to REI.
04-20-2013, 04:14 PM   #184
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Sometimes I think we care more about the brand than they do. I'd bet any one of us living within 100 miles of Ace would have stepped in if asked.

Cabellas, Bass Pro, REI, Dick's Sporting Goods (near the Scopes and Binoculars- do they have Pentax? - unless they follow through on the "No More Guns" threat). There are dozens of small outdoor chains like The Alpine Shop in Missouri. There are dozens of catalog outdoor retailers in addition to REI.
Sounds great. However, they all are not photo proficient people. What would the say, if asked about details on Pentax gears? They may hurt the brand even more.

04-20-2013, 04:20 PM   #185
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QuoteOriginally posted by Greyser Quote
Sounds great. However, they all are not photo proficient people. What would the say, if asked about details on Pentax gears? They may hurt the brand even more.
Maybe - but 1. I bought a Yakima rooftop basket for my Subaru at my Outdoor Shop and the college-student saleswoman was very informed, voluntarily showing me in her dealer manual which one is within my warranty (not the more expensive Thule model that I originally wanted) - it is just training. How many B&M camera store salesmen are really informed about Pentax? Nearly none, I'd bet, because Pentax haven't trained them.
04-20-2013, 04:28 PM   #186
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Sometimes I think we care more about the brand than they do. I'd bet any one of us living within 100 miles of Ace would have stepped in if asked.

Cabellas, Bass Pro, REI, Dick's Sporting Goods (near the Scopes and Binoculars- do they have Pentax? - unless they follow through on the "No More Guns" threat). There are dozens of small outdoor chains like The Alpine Shop in Missouri. There are dozens of catalog outdoor retailers in addition to REI.
I have a Pentax rifle scope purchased locally from Sports Authority. At any given time they have 2 to 4 models in their case. In fact, I have a set of compact binoculars that are weather sealed and use them on the water for birds, turtles etc.
04-20-2013, 04:40 PM   #187
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QuoteOriginally posted by Greyser Quote
However, they all are not photo proficient people. What would the say, if asked about details on Pentax gears? They may hurt the brand even more.
Not sure it is possible to hurt it more at this point.

But I do shop Cabella's and if they stock something they KNOW it. Very rare to see a store that still has real salespeople. The kind of people that make that a good word not a bad one. Take a look at the spotting scope section. Scope after scope on display with price tags ranging from $2,000 - $5,000 and a guy behind the counter ready and willing to help you decide which one is best FOR YOU.

I posted over a year ago in a marketing thread that the best thing Pentax could do would be to get into Cabella's if they had to rent space. WR cameras being sold to guys who love to spend money on gear that works in the outdoors in a class act store that knows how to sell. The connection is so obvious it makes my brain hurt to think Pentax has not jumped all over this. Instead we get WG's in Target, sort of.

I am positive that things are going on in the background that we will never see, Ricoh is a solid, smart company. But it sure is frustrating listening to the deafening silence.
04-20-2013, 04:47 PM   #188
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QuoteOriginally posted by interested_observer Quote
The sports shops - especially the higher end ones, are not going anywhere (like the camera stores). They also have a wider customer and product base. Leveraging into this type of retail business will provide the brick and mortar retail locations necessary to get hands on the cameras - the ergonomics will sell them. It might also attract a new clientele into the sports stores - a win/win for both the store and Pentax. I just can not understand the lack of thinking on the part of Pentax here.
Point 1: Yea, that seems a perfect symbiotic outlet.

Point 2: I don't really know much about retail, but I bet it would take a remarkably convincing presentation to sway Cabella's buyer to replace a profitable product already on the shelves with cameras. A completely new product line. And Pentax? They still make cameras? (Chances would be much better if he has a Pentax camera now [very unlikely], or shot Pentax in the 70's [a bit less unlikely]).

Point 3: We don't really know that Pentax USA hasn't tried to get product in the sporting goods dealers' stores.

Point 4: Regardless if they've tried or not, I agree they should (continue to) pursue it. Aggressively.

04-20-2013, 05:35 PM   #189
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
I am positive that things are going on in the background that we will never see, Ricoh is a solid, smart company. But it sure is frustrating listening to the deafening silence.
+1 to this. But as many depressed posts as I ahve made the last few days, Pentax Ricoh Americas is actually trying. JC and James Malcolm have given interviews to DigitalPhotograhyInfo and have done at least two digital voice interviews that I know of. I just want more.
04-20-2013, 05:38 PM   #190
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Maybe - but 1. I bought a Yakima rooftop basket for my Subaru at my Outdoor Shop and the college-student saleswoman was very informed, voluntarily showing me in her dealer manual which one is within my warranty (not the more expensive Thule model that I originally wanted) - it is just training. How many B&M camera store salesmen are really informed about Pentax? Nearly none, I'd bet, because Pentax haven't trained them.
You drive a Subaru too? Great cars!

04-20-2013, 05:45 PM   #191
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I should've known

QuoteOriginally posted by Racer X 69 Quote
You drive a Subaru too? Great cars!
Nice Car. Nice View!

Outback H-6 3.0. I love this car. Looked at a new one today - but WTH, the one I have is ...... great.
04-20-2013, 05:54 PM   #192
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
You can say that all new Pentax users are coming from Nikon or Canon. Some could be coming from other types and brands or brand new users. Even some of the Canon/Nikon converts may have used Pentax film bodies originally. Lastly, Pentax had ff prototypes which is well known. They had a chance to and actually planned their entry into digital slr in the ff format 13 years ago which was when the FA ltds were new designs. People have been watching every since.
Thats well and good, but the point I was trying to make is that the end of the world whining regarding Pentax and FF is misguided. What Pentax needs least of all is an FF body in spite those who have been waiting for one. What they need is a more complete APS line-up (where 95% of the sales volume are), filling some holes in the K lens line-up, a more up to date 645D and lenses, and a Q wide angle. If all this is sucessfully implemented they could think about an FF camera....
04-20-2013, 06:31 PM   #193
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Nice Car. Nice View!
Thanks!

Went for a drive on the Mount Loop Highway a few winters back. It was closed at Barlow Pass near Monte Christo, so we drove up this forest service road near Big Four Mountain. Went as far as I dared in the now then turned around and stopped to take this picture.

It was almost dark.

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Outback H-6 3.0. I love this car. Looked at a new one today - but WTH, the one I have is ...... great.
Yes, mine is paid for, and hopefully the last new car I will buy.

But I am still hoping Pentax will release a DSLR soon that will be worth spending some money on!
04-20-2013, 07:06 PM   #194
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QuoteOriginally posted by cfraz Quote
Point 1: Yea, that seems a perfect symbiotic outlet.

Point 2: I don't really know much about retail, but I bet it would take a remarkably convincing presentation to sway Cabella's buyer to replace a profitable product already on the shelves with cameras. A completely new product line. And Pentax? They still make cameras? (Chances would be much better if he has a Pentax camera now [very unlikely], or shot Pentax in the 70's [a bit less unlikely]).

Point 3: We don't really know that Pentax USA hasn't tried to get product in the sporting goods dealers' stores.

Point 4: Regardless if they've tried or not, I agree they should (continue to) pursue it. Aggressively.
I absolutely agree. Having said that, I am sure that Cabella's or Bass Pro Shops or even REI, could find room. REI use to carry camera accessories aimed at backpacking. Returning to your observations, making a remarkably convincing presentation would start with what are they currently doing to move their own products - well currently not much. No Shows and lack of enthusiasm on the part of the marketing staff is not helping a bit. You need a good first step. They have a good product - support it and go sell it!

They might have already tried - who knows. If you were in charge of a retail operation, would you bring in a product that the vendor was not providing any marketing support for? Believe in your product, support it and sell it.

They need to start somewhere, and the first step is to support and promote their own product - along with their marketing and sales force enthusiastically supporting and promoting it.

They have some additional unique qualities other than WR - AstroTracking, Shift Sensor (ala a shift lens), and at least one other feature that has temporary escaped my mind. White Papers! they are cheap, and easily produced. Get them out - press releases. There are astronomy groups that they can target. Promote the K5/II/IIs bodies with built in shift lens capabilities. No one else can claim these features.

There are things that can be done, that do not cost money. They do require some imagination and thinking, coupled with follow through and execution.

04-20-2013, 07:15 PM   #195
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Nice Car. Nice View!

Outback H-6 3.0. I love this car. Looked at a new one today - but WTH, the one I have is ...... great.
What do you like about it exactly? (I'm considering Subaru.)
.
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