New PENTAX K-50

ElJamoquio · 06-07-2013, 07:56 AM

Gack!

No green button! What a world!

**Rondec** · 06-07-2013, 07:59 AM

Originally posted by ElJamoquio

Yup.

I guess I'm glad Pentax is doing marketing gimmicks rather than nothing at all. I think a lot of the angst on this board is because most of the people here can see through the gimmicks and were assuming Pentax would do something to move the 'state of the art' in their next camera.

But we'll see. Maybe the AF-C will be better than the 7D or D7000. Maybe the dynamic range, will improve. Etc., etc.

It's not a camera for me but it could be an OK camera for the market depending on price and performance.

I agree. First of all, I am glad to hear something from Pentax -- better that than nothing at all. Secondly, specs don't tell you about performance and that is what I wonder about -- are video modes improved? Is there manual control of video? Is tracking auto focus better? I just don't know. I doubt the sensor shows any big changes, but a few tweaks to the K30 could improve it (understanding that current K30 users probably won't be tempted to go to it).

IchabodCrane · 06-07-2013, 08:06 AM

Originally posted by boriscleto

On all Pentax cameras that have TAv mode, AutoISO is automatically turned off when you set the dial to M mode. The K-01 was the first camera to have a pseudo-TAv mode by allowing AutoISO in M mode. The K-30 uses the K-01 firmware and Pentax didn't change that behavior even though the K-30 has TAv mode.

Never thought about this question before so I just checked it on my K-30. When I go into M mode, the camera does not employ AutoISO. It seems to select that last known fixed ISO setting. Conversely, in TAv mode, it does employ AutoISO. I don't see any bug -- isn't this the way it should be? Am I misunderstanding?

**Aristophanes** · 06-07-2013, 08:53 AM

M mode is supposed to be ALL Manual, including ISO.

This was a digital thing. On film ISO was either DX coded or preset with a few buttons to change on AF cameras (mostly to protect slide shooters from messing with things they should not alter).

Both users and manufacturers seen to be confused about exactly how constrained M mode should be. On Pentax, M mode with auto ISO is TAv.

IchabodCrane · 06-07-2013, 08:59 AM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

M mode is supposed to be ALL Manual, including ISO.

This was a digital thing. On film ISO was either DX coded or preset with a few buttons to change on AF cameras (mostly to protect slide shooters from messing with things they should not alter).

Both users and manufacturers seen to be confused about exactly how constrained M mode should be. On Pentax, M mode with auto ISO is TAv.

I agree which is why I don't understand what this K-30 "AutoISO in M mode bug" mentioned in post #259 and #284 is all about. Mine appears to work just as expected.

**Aristophanes** · 06-07-2013, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by Uluru

All right, what about this: who ever said that K50 is an entry level camera from Pentax? Had Pentax ever stated this?

They don't have to. It's the only low-end camera they have. So, by default, it is their entry-level.

**Aristophanes** · 06-07-2013, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by IchabodCrane

I agree which is why I don't understand what this K-30 "AutoISO in M mode bug" mentioned in post #259 and #284 is all about. Mine appears to work just as expected.

Historically M mode meant no change to ISO. Of the trifecta for exposure, ISO was not user defined but (literally) defined at the Kodak factory. You could change it, but off manufacturer spec, and pretty much the same as EV. Dead wrong for most slide shooting, but OK for colour negs.

With digital, there is no consensus that M mode from any manufacturer means ISO should not float or be fixed. Floating is actually more traditional from the user perspective because aperture and shutter speed are all they had available anyway.

Pentax digital saw the floating ISO as a mode unto itself, so TAv. In Pentax digital M mode is more rigid (and IMO complex) because now you have to worry about 3 exposure settings and not just the traditional 2. So for users who want it, M mode is now configurable to emulate TAv mode.

On the K-30 M or TAv mode with twin dials appears ideal. Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm......

Nothing has changed photography more (since the advent of AF) than digital's floating, fungible, ISO.

One thing I liked from my MZ-S (sadly, sold) was the ability to lock the minimum shutter speed regardless of mode on a separate switch.

IchabodCrane · 06-07-2013, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

Historically M mode meant no change to ISO. Of the trifecta for exposure, ISO was not user defined but (literally) defined at the Kodak factory. You could change it, but off manufacturer spec, and pretty much the same as EV. Dead wrong for most slide shooting, but OK for colour negs.

With digital, there is no consensus that M mode from any manufacturer means ISO should not float or be fixed. Floating is actually more traditional from the user perspective because aperture and shutter speed are all they had available anyway.

Pentax digital saw the floating ISO as a mode unto itself, so TAv. In Pentax digital M mode is more rigid (and IMO complex) because now you have to worry about 3 exposure settings and not just the traditional 2. So for users who want it, M mode is now configurable to emulate TAv mode.

On the K-30 M or TAv mode with twin dials appears ideal. Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm......

Nothing has changed photography more (since the advent of AF) than digital's floating, fungible, ISO.

One thing I liked from my MZ-S (sadly, sold) was the ability to lock the minimum shutter speed regardless of mode on a separate switch.

I clearly must be failing to grasp something. On my camera, M mode fixes ISO and TAv mode floats the ISO. I don't see any "bug". Maybe boriscleto can re-explain. I gathered from his/her last post on this, he/she thinks K-30 ISO floats in both M and TAv because there's a similarity to the K-01 firmware -- but that's not what my K-30 is doing. Might it have been an early bug that was fixed with one of the firmware updates?

jcdoss · 06-07-2013, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm......

I really like TAV mode, and use it most of the time. However, I've always wondered why no one at all has introduced a camera with three dials... one for aperture, one for shutter, and one for ISO. Spin to adjust, press to make automatic.

GearHead · 06-07-2013, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by ElJamoquio

Gack!

No green button! What a world!

I see a green button in the picture. What are you referring to?

ElJamoquio · 06-07-2013, 11:09 AM

Perhaps I just missed it. One of the pictures online didn't have it (I think).

ElJamoquio · 06-07-2013, 11:10 AM

Ah, I did miss it. It's on top in the front. I don't like that as much as the K-5 but it seems OK.

**BigDave** · 06-07-2013, 11:22 AM

Looking at these preliminaries, I do like the green button next to the shutter release. It makes it easier to find when shooting!

Regards,

jcdoss · 06-07-2013, 12:59 PM

Originally posted by ElJamoquio

Ah, I did miss it. It's on top in the front. I don't like that as much as the K-5 but it seems OK.

It's right where it is on my K30.

Sol Invictus · 06-07-2013, 01:01 PM

Originally posted by jcdoss

I really like TAV mode, and use it most of the time. However, I've always wondered why no one at all has introduced a camera with three dials... one for aperture, one for shutter, and one for ISO. Spin to adjust, press to make automatic.

That's a fantastic idea!

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06-07-2013, 07:56 AM	#331
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Gack! No green button! What a world!

06-07-2013, 07:59 AM	#332
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,651	Originally posted by ElJamoquio Yup. I guess I'm glad Pentax is doing marketing gimmicks rather than nothing at all. I think a lot of the angst on this board is because most of the people here can see through the gimmicks and were assuming Pentax would do something to move the 'state of the art' in their next camera. But we'll see. Maybe the AF-C will be better than the 7D or D7000. Maybe the dynamic range, will improve. Etc., etc. It's not a camera for me but it could be an OK camera for the market depending on price and performance. I agree. First of all, I am glad to hear something from Pentax -- better that than nothing at all. Secondly, specs don't tell you about performance and that is what I wonder about -- are video modes improved? Is there manual control of video? Is tracking auto focus better? I just don't know. I doubt the sensor shows any big changes, but a few tweaks to the K30 could improve it (understanding that current K30 users probably won't be tempted to go to it).

06-07-2013, 08:06 AM	#333
IchabodCrane Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,728	Originally posted by boriscleto On all Pentax cameras that have TAv mode, AutoISO is automatically turned off when you set the dial to M mode. The K-01 was the first camera to have a pseudo-TAv mode by allowing AutoISO in M mode. The K-30 uses the K-01 firmware and Pentax didn't change that behavior even though the K-30 has TAv mode. Never thought about this question before so I just checked it on my K-30. When I go into M mode, the camera does not employ AutoISO. It seems to select that last known fixed ISO setting. Conversely, in TAv mode, it does employ AutoISO. I don't see any bug -- isn't this the way it should be? Am I misunderstanding?

06-07-2013, 08:53 AM	#334
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	M mode is supposed to be ALL Manual, including ISO. This was a digital thing. On film ISO was either DX coded or preset with a few buttons to change on AF cameras (mostly to protect slide shooters from messing with things they should not alter). Both users and manufacturers seen to be confused about exactly how constrained M mode should be. On Pentax, M mode with auto ISO is TAv.

06-07-2013, 08:59 AM	#335
IchabodCrane Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,728	Originally posted by Aristophanes M mode is supposed to be ALL Manual, including ISO. This was a digital thing. On film ISO was either DX coded or preset with a few buttons to change on AF cameras (mostly to protect slide shooters from messing with things they should not alter). Both users and manufacturers seen to be confused about exactly how constrained M mode should be. On Pentax, M mode with auto ISO is TAv. I agree which is why I don't understand what this K-30 "AutoISO in M mode bug" mentioned in post #259 and #284 is all about. Mine appears to work just as expected.

06-07-2013, 09:33 AM	#336
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by Uluru All right, what about this: who ever said that K50 is an entry level camera from Pentax? Had Pentax ever stated this? They don't have to. It's the only low-end camera they have. So, by default, it is their entry-level.

06-07-2013, 09:45 AM	#337
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by IchabodCrane I agree which is why I don't understand what this K-30 "AutoISO in M mode bug" mentioned in post #259 and #284 is all about. Mine appears to work just as expected. Historically M mode meant no change to ISO. Of the trifecta for exposure, ISO was not user defined but (literally) defined at the Kodak factory. You could change it, but off manufacturer spec, and pretty much the same as EV. Dead wrong for most slide shooting, but OK for colour negs. With digital, there is no consensus that M mode from any manufacturer means ISO should not float or be fixed. Floating is actually more traditional from the user perspective because aperture and shutter speed are all they had available anyway. Pentax digital saw the floating ISO as a mode unto itself, so TAv. In Pentax digital M mode is more rigid (and IMO complex) because now you have to worry about 3 exposure settings and not just the traditional 2. So for users who want it, M mode is now configurable to emulate TAv mode. On the K-30 M or TAv mode with twin dials appears ideal. Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm...... Nothing has changed photography more (since the advent of AF) than digital's floating, fungible, ISO. One thing I liked from my MZ-S (sadly, sold) was the ability to lock the minimum shutter speed regardless of mode on a separate switch.

06-07-2013, 10:04 AM	#338
IchabodCrane Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,728	Originally posted by Aristophanes Historically M mode meant no change to ISO. Of the trifecta for exposure, ISO was not user defined but (literally) defined at the Kodak factory. You could change it, but off manufacturer spec, and pretty much the same as EV. Dead wrong for most slide shooting, but OK for colour negs. With digital, there is no consensus that M mode from any manufacturer means ISO should not float or be fixed. Floating is actually more traditional from the user perspective because aperture and shutter speed are all they had available anyway. Pentax digital saw the floating ISO as a mode unto itself, so TAv. In Pentax digital M mode is more rigid (and IMO complex) because now you have to worry about 3 exposure settings and not just the traditional 2. So for users who want it, M mode is now configurable to emulate TAv mode. On the K-30 M or TAv mode with twin dials appears ideal. Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm...... Nothing has changed photography more (since the advent of AF) than digital's floating, fungible, ISO. One thing I liked from my MZ-S (sadly, sold) was the ability to lock the minimum shutter speed regardless of mode on a separate switch. I clearly must be failing to grasp something. On my camera, M mode fixes ISO and TAv mode floats the ISO. I don't see any "bug". Maybe boriscleto can re-explain. I gathered from his/her last post on this, he/she thinks K-30 ISO floats in both M and TAv because there's a similarity to the K-01 firmware -- but that's not what my K-30 is doing. Might it have been an early bug that was fixed with one of the firmware updates?

06-07-2013, 10:04 AM	#339
jcdoss Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Ingelheim am Rhein, Germany Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,765	Originally posted by Aristophanes Now look at the Ricoh GR where ISO has the rear dial to itself. Hmmmm...... I really like TAV mode, and use it most of the time. However, I've always wondered why no one at all has introduced a camera with three dials... one for aperture, one for shutter, and one for ISO. Spin to adjust, press to make automatic.

06-07-2013, 11:05 AM	#340
GearHead Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Oregon Photos: Gallery Posts: 82	Originally posted by ElJamoquio Gack! No green button! What a world! I see a green button in the picture. What are you referring to?

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06-07-2013, 11:09 AM	#341
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Perhaps I just missed it. One of the pictures online didn't have it (I think).

06-07-2013, 11:10 AM	#342
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Ah, I did miss it. It's on top in the front. I don't like that as much as the K-5 but it seems OK.

06-07-2013, 11:22 AM	#343
BigDave Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Hudson Valley, NY Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,626	Looking at these preliminaries, I do like the green button next to the shutter release. It makes it easier to find when shooting! Regards,

06-07-2013, 12:59 PM	#344
jcdoss Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Ingelheim am Rhein, Germany Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,765	Originally posted by ElJamoquio Ah, I did miss it. It's on top in the front. I don't like that as much as the K-5 but it seems OK. It's right where it is on my K30.

06-07-2013, 01:01 PM	#345
Sol Invictus Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Calgary, Alberta Photos: Gallery Posts: 392	Originally posted by jcdoss I really like TAV mode, and use it most of the time. However, I've always wondered why no one at all has introduced a camera with three dials... one for aperture, one for shutter, and one for ISO. Spin to adjust, press to make automatic. That's a fantastic idea!