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07-22-2013, 10:36 AM   #316
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another review of the 18-35, with hands-on video review and lots of downloadable sample photos:
Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 HSM Lens Review

07-22-2013, 02:02 PM   #317
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The famous designer of several FA* and FA ltd lenses, Jun Hirakawa, is now filing patents for Tamron. Guess re-hiring those lens designers back failed.

LOL! Maybe those designers refused to have their jobs back, once they discovered what their first task would be: "re-designing" the FA ltds to be produced in a wide variaty of stylish colours? (AKA re-painting old stock.)?
This is a myth probably from rice high. I was told about 1998 that Hirakawa was only working for Pentax on a project basis. He may have been employed at Tamron for decades...
07-23-2013, 12:56 AM   #318
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
This is a myth probably from rice high. I was told about 1998 that Hirakawa was only working for Pentax on a project basis. He may have been employed at Tamron for decades...
The list of lenses that Mr. Jun Hirakawa designed for Pentax is very long. At least eleven that I care to know of. See this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/107233-jun-hirakawa.html (I see you made the same uninformed and unargumented appearence there.) That last one he designed for Pentax was the DA*55, which is much later that that 1998 of yours.

And it's not a myth that he was layed off. At the time that he would have "retired" he would have been 47; not really an age to retire at. And secondly, this new patent shows he has not retired but still needs to earn his money somewhere. So he was layed off.

[sarc]
This Sigma 18-35 smells awefully much like the DA wideangle limited from the roadmap that fails to appear. Maybe other lens designers had to find work somewhere else too, the same way Mr. Hirakawa had to, and took the designs of the DA limited wideangle zoom with them?
[/sarc]
07-23-2013, 06:14 AM   #319
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
This Sigma 18-35 smells awefully much like the DA wideangle limited from the roadmap that fails to appear. Maybe other lens designers had to find work somewhere else too, the same way Mr. Hirakawa had to, and took the designs of the DA limited wideangle zoom with them?
This is a historically significant lens, so it would be interesting to know its back story. Too bad there's no Sigma insiders around here.

07-23-2013, 07:08 AM   #320
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The list of lenses that Mr. Jun Hirakawa designed for Pentax is very long. At least eleven that I care to know of. See this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/107233-jun-hirakawa.html (I see you made the same uninformed and unargumented appearence there.) That last one he designed for Pentax was the DA*55, which is much later that that 1998 of yours.

And it's not a myth that he was layed off. At the time that he would have "retired" he would have been 47; not really an age to retire at. And secondly, this new patent shows he has not retired but still needs to earn his money somewhere. So he was layed off.

[sarc]
This Sigma 18-35 smells awefully much like the DA wideangle limited from the roadmap that fails to appear. Maybe other lens designers had to find work somewhere else too, the same way Mr. Hirakawa had to, and took the designs of the DA limited wideangle zoom with them?
[/sarc]
There's less point in Pentax producing a DA wide-angle zoom with the Sigma now around? Pentax could add WR and one-touch, which would be very nice to have, but even if it was an f2.8 or f4 the price would struggle to compete with the Sigma due to a much much smaller production run and "own brand pricing up", I'd have thought? That said, if a Pentax wide-angle zoom was much small and lighter than the Sigma, one or two stops slower and cost no more than the Sigma, I would be tempted on convenience grounds if the image quality was there. The Sigma does look a very hefty beast.

The eye-watering price of the DA* 16-50mm and some other lenses shows what happens when production runs are small, though maybe sharing a design with Tokina might defray some of the damage.

I'm surprised really that Pentax haven't concentrated on more obvious things in their catalogue, such as adding both WR and lens motors to their most popular offerings such as the three kit lenses and the most popular primes. A kit lens with a screw drive is a little retro these days.

Last edited by mecrox; 07-23-2013 at 07:22 AM.
07-23-2013, 07:28 AM   #321
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
I'm surprised really that Pentax haven't concentrated on more obvious things in their catalogue, such as adding both WR and lens motors to their most popular offerings such as the three kit lenses and the most popular primes. A kit lens with a screw drive is a little retro these days.
"Retro" is a nice way to put it.
07-23-2013, 09:23 AM - 1 Like   #322
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
[sarc]
This Sigma 18-35 smells awefully much like the DA wideangle limited from the roadmap that fails to appear. Maybe other lens designers had to find work somewhere else too, the same way Mr. Hirakawa had to, and took the designs of the DA limited wideangle zoom with them?
[/sarc]
I know this was tagged as sarcasm, but the day Pentax releases a "Limited" that's the size and weight of a San Francisco Mission-style Super Burrito is the day the word "Limited" loses all meaning.
07-23-2013, 10:59 AM   #323
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So, does this mean there will be a flood of used f/2.8 zooms on the market soon?

That would be fantastic, because I don't have $800 for one of these...

07-23-2013, 04:47 PM   #324
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The list of lenses that Mr. Jun Hirakawa designed for Pentax is very long. At least eleven that I care to know of. See this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/107233-jun-hirakawa.html (I see you made the same uninformed and unargumented appearence there.) That last one he designed for Pentax was the DA*55, which is much later that that 1998 of yours.

And it's not a myth that he was layed off. At the time that he would have "retired" he would have been 47; not really an age to retire at. And secondly, this new patent shows he has not retired but still needs to earn his money somewhere. So he was layed off.

[sarc]
This Sigma 18-35 smells awefully much like the DA wideangle limited from the roadmap that fails to appear. Maybe other lens designers had to find work somewhere else too, the same way Mr. Hirakawa had to, and took the designs of the DA limited wideangle zoom with them?
[/sarc]


...and what makes it more uninformed that than the claims you make? Did you know Hirakawa had a mailing list back then?

The rumors spread by Rice High, the least credible source of Pentax in the known universe, is pure bull.

The idea of the 18-35/1.8 as a Limited lens is ludicrous. It is against all what Limited lenses stand for.

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 07-23-2013 at 04:58 PM.
07-23-2013, 05:46 PM   #325
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QuoteOriginally posted by Quicksand Quote
San Francisco Mission-style Super Burrito
Best metaphor EVER!
07-23-2013, 06:40 PM   #326
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The famous designer of several FA* and FA ltd lenses, Jun Hirakawa, is now filing patents for Tamron. Guess re-hiring those lens designers back failed.
I still have patents going through for an employer from a few years back.
07-24-2013, 12:12 AM   #327
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
The idea of the 18-35/1.8 as a Limited lens is ludicrous. It is against all what Limited lenses stand for.
+1!

It's like a sports car company building a SUV!! (oh, wait, I guess Porsche is actually doing that )
07-24-2013, 12:33 AM   #328
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QuoteOriginally posted by Quicksand Quote
I know this was tagged as sarcasm, but the day Pentax releases a "Limited" that's the size and weight of a San Francisco Mission-style Super Burrito is the day the word "Limited" loses all meaning.
Ohw... So with Pentax the term "limited" stands for "limited in size" then? I thought it just stood for high quality build/optics and limited production runs.

That 18-35 looks awfully sweet and it's size is to be expected from any 1.8 with that zoom range. I don't see how the Pentax WA zoom ltd could ever fit the "size requirements" of the ltd series. So I honestly didn't think there were any size requirements.
07-24-2013, 01:22 AM   #329
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Ohw... So with Pentax the term "limited" stands for "limited in size" then? I thought it just stood for high quality build/optics and limited production runs.

That 18-35 looks awfully sweet and it's size is to be expected from any 1.8 with that zoom range. I don't see how the Pentax WA zoom ltd could ever fit the "size requirements" of the ltd series. So I honestly didn't think there were any size requirements.
AFAIK, Pentax "Limited" lenses are not "Limited production runs" as in "we're making 437 copies, and that's it folks!".

IIRC, some local Pentax rep told me, when the first FA Limited came about, that they were "limited" as in "Limited by our ability to source the highest quality glass, machine the different metal pieces to the highest precision, and limited in how many we can produce per day by the fact that we use only highly skilled technicians for hand-assembling, tuning and tweaking each lens individually".

Whatever it is, the "Limited" series is special, and I consider them high-end. Their compactness is part of what makes them special, but the "pixie dust" in IQ is the real kicker for me.


07-24-2013, 02:42 AM   #330
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QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Whatever it is, the "Limited" series is special, and I consider them high-end. Their compactness is part of what makes them special, but the "pixie dust" in IQ is the real kicker for me.
I guess the terms "DA" and "Limited" have become a little stretched over the years. Strictly speaking, at least going from the Ricoh Japan site, the term "Limited" applies only to the FA 31mm, 43mm and 77mm and to the original all-metal DA primes from 15mm to 70mm. Everything else may be D FA, DA or DA* but is not called "Limited".

I believe the K7 was originally designed with the Limited primes specifically in mind, which could also be said of the K5 given how similar its body is. The primes do make an amazing set, even all together hardy more weighty and possibly less so than a monster zoom from the usual suspects.

As others have pointed out, in theory at least this does mean Pentax is well set up already to produce a very compact APS-C DSLR to go with the Limiteds, more so than the other K-series bodies - following the introduction of the Canon 100D/SL1. Of course, there is nothing to prevent lenses of any size being introduced to the catalogue, but it would be quite hard to called them "Limited" unless they were a prime, very compact and all-metal.
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