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08-26-2013, 06:34 AM   #31
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then you shouldn't have copied the given link from the dutch forum ;-)

(your sigline isn't up-to-date ;-00)

08-26-2013, 07:30 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Asahiflex Quote
I saw this very interesting article on PentaxOne - Accueil, a big Pentax forum in France, written by fellow member Mistral75: PentaxOne - Rumeurs 2013

Google translation:

Ooh! It's gone away ?
08-26-2013, 07:34 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
It's mighty impressive that you can tell that from a simple rumor that doesn't even contain any technical specifications, or pictures. Brilliant engineers happen to be able to come up with very clever solutions. Often solutions that are simpler then anyone would have thought.
It is certainly more complicated than a bog standard FF OVF camera. Just count the extra bits.

That doesn't mean it is automatically too complicated. There appears to be little that hasn't been done in some form in the past. I used to lust after a Leica Visoflex camera when I was far too young to afford one! Adapters of various sorts in tube-like form have been used for decades: extension tubes, Teleconverters, AF Converters, etc.

If I were in Ricoh/Pentax, I think I would be trying to work out an incremental development and release strategy for it, rather than attempt a "big bang". If all the bits have to be released at once, problems with one could delay the whole thing. And the R&D beforehand would be massive.

Perhaps only have the second coupling ring to start with, and not have the Pentaflex at first release. But I suspect it would have to be even simpler than that.
08-26-2013, 07:39 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by MouLaG ‘fr Quote
Ooh! It's gone away ?
Still there. (That was the link to the site, not the article).

08-26-2013, 09:23 AM - 1 Like   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Maybe Mistral - if he's watching this section - could tell us what is reliable information, what is potentially reliable information and what is speculation. Is that source an insider? Are we talking about an idea discussed internally, or something evolving towards production?
(Mistral: thanks in advance)
My recent post on PentaxOne is the mere synthesis and update of two posts on the French forum Chassimages dating back to March 29th Une nouvelle monture? and May 1st Pentax au salon P&E 2013 (Chine) : 24x36, compact APS-C, etc.

My source is an Asian supplier working inter alia for camera manufacturers and, as a private person, passionate about photography and gear. We met in the course of my professional activities and our shared interests led us to discuss a lot about the photo market, the players and their strategies, photographic gear in general and Pentax gear in particular, when we met and many times since then.

I believe him to be reliable: for instance, he told me about Nikon working on an entry-level 24x36 camera months before the first rumours about what has become the D600.

He is very well connected to Pentax (and other OEMs') development teams since he is providing them with quotations on various parts and projects. In particular, he is quite close to Pentax development team, closer than what a "normal" supplier would be, in part because he is so enthusiast about Pentax gear

I sometimes hardly recognise in the Google translation what I wrote in French but the parts about the A mount and its specifications, the "base unit" (versatile body; 1/ in my text), the lenses specifications (2/ in my text), the two A to K adapters (3/ in my text) and the Pentaflex module come from information gathered by this guy from Pentax development team and correspond to what the team was working on at that time (first quarter of 2013).

The "we can imagine that the marketing could create (...)" part is pure speculation on my side and presented as such.

The part about tensions within Pentax Ricoh Imaging between the ex-Pentax guys and the ex-Ricoh guys and the various backfires is also based on what my source told me as well as actual events (name change for instance, which confirms what he told me late April).

The lack of any news on this project since early April is a simple fact. The dual conclusion (project buried by Ricoh / could reappear under the Ricoh brand name) is pure speculation on my side.
08-26-2013, 09:37 AM   #36
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thank you for clearing it up. Hopefully this 'rumor' will bury itself. And Peter as well as he likes to stir things up ;-)
08-26-2013, 09:47 AM   #37
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Thank you. You said "I sometimes hardly recognise in the Google translation what I wrote in French", and this is precisely the reason why I asked you for clarifications.

What's interesting is that such a product appears in conflict with public statements made by Pentax:
"First, there is a trend that is moving forward to higher IQ among whole this industry includes manufacturers and consumers. Meantime, mirrorless segment is moving forward to smaller size. Even though there was possibility to bring FF into this segment, it was our conclusion that APS-C should be the utmost size for mirrorless segment."
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-news-rumors/201538-dc-watch-interv...velopment.html

But maybe it was (or is) an internal project, inspired by GXR's modularity; or your source is not that accurate after all.
08-26-2013, 10:42 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
The part about tensions within Pentax Ricoh Imaging between the ex-Pentax guys and the ex-Ricoh guys and the various backfires is also based on what my source told me as well as actual events (name change for instance, which confirms what he told me late April).
We can lend some credence to that story based on Jim Malcolm's spring 2013 interview with DigitalCameraInfo, in which he stated that it took him longer to integrate the two engineering teams than he had originally envisioned it would. In his conferencec all with the Q Users Group we asked about that statement. He was very circumspect, but more or less implied they had differing views of the "main channel" of future technology. Interpret that as you will.
The end users want to see the change. ďWhat is the value that Ricoh is going to bring and when are we going to see it?Ē Iíve had the benefit of kind of ďlooking under the kimonoĒ so Iíve got a different level of excitement. But itís taken more time than anybody expected to really integrate two working teams, to develop leadership within each of those teams, and kind of set the direction and the tone and be able to share some of that core competency that Ricoh has in the imaging and the optics together with the Pentax engineers and turn it into one team and build roadmaps and be able to bring the products to market.


08-26-2013, 11:50 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Asahiflex Quote
Neither do I but the Q uses the same focus by wire system. And of course the Q's mount is 100% electronic too. Maybe the A mount will be the same as the Q mount, only bigger (and probably with more contacts if the system needs it)?
I have and like the Q. But I really hate focus by wire.
08-26-2013, 11:58 AM   #40
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As a former Ricoh GXR owner, this seems like a very "Ricoh" idea, so I could see that team at least proposing it. I also think either coming up with a modernized version of the K-mount or a completely new mount with K-mount compatibility would serve Pentax well going into the future. I'm excited to eventually see what they've been working on all this time whatever it is lol.
08-26-2013, 12:32 PM   #41
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Small correction: Mr. Malcolm did not carry out the integration of product strategy or engineering. Those are headquarters functions and are performed in Japan by HQ staff.

Jim will always have enough criticism here in America(s) without being held responsible for running Ricoh/Pentax/Acme. (The latter is a joint venture with Warner Brothers to develop optical gear for spotting and photographing the Greater Roadrunner.) Yes, I am showing both my age and lack of maturity .....
08-26-2013, 12:49 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by glanglois Quote
Small correction: Mr. Malcolm did not carry out the integration of product strategy or engineering. Those are headquarters functions and are performed in Japan by HQ staff.

Jim will always have enough criticism here in America(s) without being held responsible for running Ricoh/Pentax/Acme. (The latter is a joint venture with Warner Brothers to develop optical gear for spotting and photographing the Greater Roadrunner.) Yes, I am showing both my age and lack of maturity .....
Malcolm's first job at Ricoh was to integrate the Pentax team. His appointment as PRIAC VP came after that.
08-26-2013, 12:58 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by glanglois Quote
Small correction: Mr. Malcolm did not carry out the integration of product strategy or engineering. Those are headquarters functions and are performed in Japan by HQ staff.
Small correction correction. Before he was made Executive Vice President of Ricoh Imaging Americas he was a consultant to Ricoh, charged with integrating Pentax into the Ricoh camera division. One of his tasks, as he stated himself, was to integrate the two design and engineering teams.

RICOH Press Release

Last edited by monochrome; 08-26-2013 at 01:04 PM.
08-26-2013, 02:24 PM   #44
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I stand corrected. Thanks for pointing it out.
08-26-2013, 02:44 PM   #45
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So now they are gambling with names, which concept will be baptised as Pentax and which as Ricoh. And, in practical terms, there is no clear decision which way to go because the corporate ego battles with practical comon sense.

To me this Ace project as described above sounds all too complicated and very GXR like.

Now, re GXR, despite Ricoh's "famous historic sales channels", that concept intrigued only rare photo gear geeks and GXR doesn't cut it as the future's mainstream or a big exciting thing. Because if there was any value in it, it would be as popular as NEX or other mainstream mirrorless, and Ricoh would have no excuse to buy Pentax.

Thus if new project is really as such, then perhaps it needs to be simplified, but which is presumably hard to do in such a complicated company.

I'm guessing that whatever course they do with it it will fail:

If they put a Pentax badge on it, it will have a wider reach but still too complicated to be meaningful. Plus a need to explain people all new mount in addition to previous three.

If they put a Ricoh badge on it, it will be characteristically complicated, intertwined with K-mount in weird ways and will have similar reach and appeal as GXR — as long as you need to explain to everyday people that a Ricoh branded product can use all K-mount lenses made for Pentax, they will stare, try connect three separate idioms and not understand a thing. That same moment Ricoh will compete in people's heads with its own brand.

Last edited by Uluru; 08-26-2013 at 10:41 PM.
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