New HD DA Limited lenses

JohnBee · 08-27-2013, 05:06 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Is it safe to say that a Silver K-5IIs is about to be announced?

K-3 actually.
K-5 body size build(slightly wider) w/articulated screen.
20mp sensor with IQ improvements(RES, DR, NOISE ETC) across the board

Pentax is going to make alot of waves this year with the introduction of their new vision.

Mr Spocko · 08-27-2013, 05:11 PM

Won't matter if Pentax have awesome bodies, if they're not competitive lenses wise few will look at the brand. It's fine being an old hand with a nice bunch of limited, but for new users the prices are intimidating and off putting, even if the bodies are really good that's going to do real harm to the brand. Ricoh IMO are not right for Pentax, same failed strategy as Hoya had price gouging and it's killing K mount.

**Aristophanes** · 08-27-2013, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by Kenntak

I think this is good news. All of those limited lenses are well-appreciated already, and this would improve them even more. I want to buy some limited lenses at some point, so this is great for people like me who are just starting out. One thing though, WR was not added. I suppose that would have increased the cost and possibly weight or size.

Seems like a decent update. What is everybody griping about? I suspect WR
on these lenses is not feasible due to the compactness and quick shift.

JohnBee · 08-27-2013, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

Won't matter if Pentax have awesome bodies, if they're not competitive lenses wise few will look at the brand. It's fine being an old hand with a nice bunch of limited, but for new users the prices are intimidating and off putting, even if the bodies are really good that's going to do real harm to the brand. Ricoh IMO are not right for Pentax, same failed strategy as Hoya had price gouging and it's killing K mount.

I'm not sure what prices you're referring too, but have you priced upper lenses in other mounts lately(Sony, Nikon etc)?
I just finished putting together a Zeiss FF kit with a final cost that will likely continue to haunt me for years to come. And so I'm really not sure where your critique stands with respect to the current market personally.

Winder · 08-27-2013, 05:42 PM

Originally posted by JohnBee

K-3 actually.
K-5 body size build(slightly wider) w/articulated screen.
20mp sensor with IQ improvements(RES, DR, NOISE ETC) across the board

Pentax is going to make alot of waves this year with the introduction of their new vision.

I hope your right. The addition of the DA limited glass in Silver hints at a silver K-3 or K-5IIs. Silver has done well for Olympus and Fuji.

Mr Spocko · 08-27-2013, 05:43 PM

My views are shared by quite a few:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981

In respect of Zeiss are we talking about MF Canikon Zeiss or A mount Sony Zeiss. Either way yes they are expensive, but these makers have other offerings too which are priced better than Pentax can dream of. Only Pentax could release a 50mm f1.8 and try to charge over £210 for it!

It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings.

carrrlangas · 08-27-2013, 05:58 PM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people.

If weight and size are not restrictions, optical design gets easier (look at sigma.. or Samyang manual focus offerings). If you do want small light lenses, some sacrifices must be made. Need faster? You have acamera with clean files at ISO1600 and huge Dynamic Range... Faster for what? DoF? not much to do with aperture

**Clarkey** · 08-27-2013, 05:59 PM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

My views are shared by quite a few:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981

In respect of Zeiss are we talking about MF Canikon Zeiss or A mount Sony Zeiss. Either way yes they are expensive, but these makers have other offerings too which are priced better than Pentax can dream of. Only Pentax could release a 50mm f1.8 and try to charge over £210 for it!

It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings.

You have a point. Nice update, but currently overpriced.
Don't get me wrong, I love my DA limiteds, but the prime market is now extremely competitive (different from when these lenses were originally designed). A couple of other examples of compact, much faster lenses that are well regarded: Fuji 35mm F1.4 - ~$600, Olympus 45mm F1.8 ~$400.

Winder · 08-27-2013, 06:01 PM

Originally posted by dcshooter

Sony "Zeiss" is not Zeiss. Not even close. They just license the name. Just as Panasonic licenses the Leica name.

Actually it depends on the lens. The CZ 85 and the CZ 135 are Zeiss lenses by design. One of the problems with the E-mount system is that Zeiss has not been able to keep up and Sony is now turning to Olympus, who in reality probably makes better glass anyway.

**Aristophanes** · 08-27-2013, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

My views are shared by quite a few:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981
It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings.

You can either have fast or compact. The laws o physics prevent both. Sounds like you want much larger lenses from a different company.

Alizarine · 08-27-2013, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by carrrlangas

If weight and size are not restrictions, optical design gets easier (look at sigma.. or Samyang manual focus offerings). If you do want small light lenses, some sacrifices must be made. Need faster? You have acamera with clean files at ISO1600 and huge Dynamic Range...

This is actually what I have a hard time dealing with Canikon friends about Pentax lenses. Sure, they got 1.8's and we only got 2.4's, but look at the size and handling differences, they don't get it. The space they have for one lens in a bag I can put two Pentaxes in (except the DA* lol), True, it's a half-stop difference, but for optimum sharpness I stop down half at least anyway. Lastly, in the world of amateur photography, I think bokeh is overrated. K-5 IIs ISO is superb enough to warrant me not needing an 85 f1.4... little FA77 can do the job well, just foot-zoom my way to get the 85 FL lol

back to topic though, yeah I think red ring makes it look daring and bold, but maybe too Canon-L, yes. Green is too friendly a color though. The seemingly-CenturyGothic font looks nice and makes the lens overall look more formal, "Zeiss"-y even, as someone else said.

I'd daresay red+silver with the "Limited" label on it is a hot, hot thing to look at though. Might make my previously-unattractive Pentax set suddenly a thief magnet

JinDesu · 08-27-2013, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by Clarkey

You have a point. Nice update, but currently overpriced.
Don't get me wrong, I love my DA limiteds, but the prime market is now extremely competitive (different from when these lenses were originally designed). A couple of other examples of compact, much faster lenses that are well regarded: Fuji 35mm F1.4 - ~$600, Olympus 45mm F1.8 ~$400.

Which is why I'm waiting for the sales.

Franky2step · 08-27-2013, 06:32 PM

FWIW, it looks like Pentax is here to stay, at least in aps-c arena. There is no way Ricoh would launch these new lenses and not have a long term plan for the Pentax line. Unfortunately it looks like a full frame is not coming....unless they announce new HD coatings for the FA Ltd's. Now that would be very interesting.

**Clarkey** · 08-27-2013, 06:43 PM

Originally posted by JinDesu

Which is why I'm waiting for the sales.

As am I

But will there be any, given the pricing strategy?
I anticipate rebates, rather than massive deals, unless bundled with bodies (I anticipate the APS-C replacement for the K5II(s) should be announced next week to go with these).

Mr Spocko · 08-27-2013, 07:32 PM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

You can either have fast or compact. The laws o physics prevent both. Sounds like you want much larger lenses from a different company.

Not exactly massive IMO
Stuff like this makes it more appealing

http://www.voigtlaender.de/cms/voigtlaender/voigtlaender_cms.nsf/gfx/objekti..._40mm_frei.jpg

f2 v f2.8 is significant to some, this is just one example

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08-27-2013, 05:06 PM	#151
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Originally posted by Winder Is it safe to say that a Silver K-5IIs is about to be announced? K-3 actually. K-5 body size build(slightly wider) w/articulated screen. 20mp sensor with IQ improvements(RES, DR, NOISE ETC) across the board Pentax is going to make alot of waves this year with the introduction of their new vision.

08-27-2013, 05:11 PM	#152
Mr Spocko Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 254	Won't matter if Pentax have awesome bodies, if they're not competitive lenses wise few will look at the brand. It's fine being an old hand with a nice bunch of limited, but for new users the prices are intimidating and off putting, even if the bodies are really good that's going to do real harm to the brand. Ricoh IMO are not right for Pentax, same failed strategy as Hoya had price gouging and it's killing K mount.

08-27-2013, 05:19 PM	#153
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by Kenntak I think this is good news. All of those limited lenses are well-appreciated already, and this would improve them even more. I want to buy some limited lenses at some point, so this is great for people like me who are just starting out. One thing though, WR was not added. I suppose that would have increased the cost and possibly weight or size. Seems like a decent update. What is everybody griping about? I suspect WR on these lenses is not feasible due to the compactness and quick shift.

08-27-2013, 05:25 PM	#154
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Originally posted by Mr Spocko Won't matter if Pentax have awesome bodies, if they're not competitive lenses wise few will look at the brand. It's fine being an old hand with a nice bunch of limited, but for new users the prices are intimidating and off putting, even if the bodies are really good that's going to do real harm to the brand. Ricoh IMO are not right for Pentax, same failed strategy as Hoya had price gouging and it's killing K mount. I'm not sure what prices you're referring too, but have you priced upper lenses in other mounts lately(Sony, Nikon etc)? I just finished putting together a Zeiss FF kit with a final cost that will likely continue to haunt me for years to come. And so I'm really not sure where your critique stands with respect to the current market personally.

08-27-2013, 05:42 PM	#155
Winder Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by JohnBee K-3 actually. K-5 body size build(slightly wider) w/articulated screen. 20mp sensor with IQ improvements(RES, DR, NOISE ETC) across the board Pentax is going to make alot of waves this year with the introduction of their new vision. I hope your right. The addition of the DA limited glass in Silver hints at a silver K-3 or K-5IIs. Silver has done well for Olympus and Fuji.

08-27-2013, 05:43 PM	#156
Mr Spocko Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 254	My views are shared by quite a few: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981 In respect of Zeiss are we talking about MF Canikon Zeiss or A mount Sony Zeiss. Either way yes they are expensive, but these makers have other offerings too which are priced better than Pentax can dream of. Only Pentax could release a 50mm f1.8 and try to charge over £210 for it! It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings.

08-27-2013, 05:58 PM	#157
carrrlangas Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Joensuu (Finland) Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,761	Originally posted by Mr Spocko It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. If weight and size are not restrictions, optical design gets easier (look at sigma.. or Samyang manual focus offerings). If you do want small light lenses, some sacrifices must be made. Need faster? You have acamera with clean files at ISO1600 and huge Dynamic Range... Faster for what? DoF? not much to do with aperture

08-27-2013, 05:59 PM	#158
Clarkey Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brampton, ON, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,376	Originally posted by Mr Spocko My views are shared by quite a few: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981 In respect of Zeiss are we talking about MF Canikon Zeiss or A mount Sony Zeiss. Either way yes they are expensive, but these makers have other offerings too which are priced better than Pentax can dream of. Only Pentax could release a 50mm f1.8 and try to charge over £210 for it! It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings. You have a point. Nice update, but currently overpriced. Don't get me wrong, I love my DA limiteds, but the prime market is now extremely competitive (different from when these lenses were originally designed). A couple of other examples of compact, much faster lenses that are well regarded: Fuji 35mm F1.4 - ~$600, Olympus 45mm F1.8 ~$400.

08-27-2013, 06:01 PM	#159
Winder Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by dcshooter Sony "Zeiss" is not Zeiss. Not even close. They just license the name. Just as Panasonic licenses the Leica name. Actually it depends on the lens. The CZ 85 and the CZ 135 are Zeiss lenses by design. One of the problems with the E-mount system is that Zeiss has not been able to keep up and Sony is now turning to Olympus, who in reality probably makes better glass anyway.

08-27-2013, 06:16 PM	#160
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by Mr Spocko My views are shared by quite a few: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/52047981 It's not just high end stuff, the limited lenses are too slow for many people. They are nice but they're not winning over the bread and butter Canikon offerings. You can either have fast or compact. The laws o physics prevent both. Sounds like you want much larger lenses from a different company.

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08-27-2013, 06:16 PM	#161
Alizarine Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Manila Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,185	Originally posted by carrrlangas If weight and size are not restrictions, optical design gets easier (look at sigma.. or Samyang manual focus offerings). If you do want small light lenses, some sacrifices must be made. Need faster? You have acamera with clean files at ISO1600 and huge Dynamic Range... This is actually what I have a hard time dealing with Canikon friends about Pentax lenses. Sure, they got 1.8's and we only got 2.4's, but look at the size and handling differences, they don't get it. The space they have for one lens in a bag I can put two Pentaxes in (except the DA* lol), True, it's a half-stop difference, but for optimum sharpness I stop down half at least anyway. Lastly, in the world of amateur photography, I think bokeh is overrated. K-5 IIs ISO is superb enough to warrant me not needing an 85 f1.4... little FA77 can do the job well, just foot-zoom my way to get the 85 FL lol back to topic though, yeah I think red ring makes it look daring and bold, but maybe too Canon-L, yes. Green is too friendly a color though. The seemingly-CenturyGothic font looks nice and makes the lens overall look more formal, "Zeiss"-y even, as someone else said. I'd daresay red+silver with the "Limited" label on it is a hot, hot thing to look at though. Might make my previously-unattractive Pentax set suddenly a thief magnet

08-27-2013, 06:17 PM	#162
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,632	Originally posted by Clarkey You have a point. Nice update, but currently overpriced. Don't get me wrong, I love my DA limiteds, but the prime market is now extremely competitive (different from when these lenses were originally designed). A couple of other examples of compact, much faster lenses that are well regarded: Fuji 35mm F1.4 - ~$600, Olympus 45mm F1.8 ~$400. Which is why I'm waiting for the sales.

08-27-2013, 06:32 PM	#163
Franky2step Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Niagara Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 793	FWIW, it looks like Pentax is here to stay, at least in aps-c arena. There is no way Ricoh would launch these new lenses and not have a long term plan for the Pentax line. Unfortunately it looks like a full frame is not coming....unless they announce new HD coatings for the FA Ltd's. Now that would be very interesting.

08-27-2013, 06:43 PM	#164
Clarkey Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brampton, ON, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,376	Originally posted by JinDesu Which is why I'm waiting for the sales. As am I But will there be any, given the pricing strategy? I anticipate rebates, rather than massive deals, unless bundled with bodies (I anticipate the APS-C replacement for the K5II(s) should be announced next week to go with these).

08-27-2013, 07:32 PM	#165
Mr Spocko Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 254	Originally posted by Aristophanes You can either have fast or compact. The laws o physics prevent both. Sounds like you want much larger lenses from a different company. Not exactly massive IMO Stuff like this makes it more appealing http://www.voigtlaender.de/cms/voigtlaender/voigtlaender_cms.nsf/gfx/objekti..._40mm_frei.jpg f2 v f2.8 is significant to some, this is just one example