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09-16-2013, 11:01 PM   #511
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
Why? The world has resoundingly moved on. Even film is harder to obtain now (along with questions of how environmentally sound film manufacturing and developing is).

There are still millions of film cams out there that hit the selling block for cheap on fleabay, for instance, so we'll all do ok.

Not everything needs to be preserved.
Oh, call it nostalgia, call it that I get a sense of enjoyment from holding a piece of precision mechanics.

Call it "emotions"

Otherwise, why don't we just burn all museums....photography is clearly progress over the paint that was used for the Mona Lisa, and sculptures that, at best, approximate reality....c'mon, now we have 3D scanners and printers

Some things need to be preserved just because their very existence produces emotions

09-16-2013, 11:10 PM   #512
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
Why? The world has resoundingly moved on. Even film is harder to obtain now (along with questions of how environmentally sound film manufacturing and developing is)..
Considering that film will be used for mostly art photography by the talented few, for all analog traditional picture making (tiring for many) and as an once-in-bluemoon respite from digital (only those serious to learn more), chemicals used in its production and development will pose insignificant threat to the environment.

Especially when compared to overproduction of digital cameras and gizmos that fill up landfills daily.
True real innovation in digital photography will come that day when our primary concern is making a digital cameras usable as longer and possible.
09-17-2013, 10:34 AM   #513
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QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote
In the case of the Sigma 28/1.8 EX it brings excellent IQ, with very close focusing ability and full-frame capability.
This is one of my most used and most loved lenses.

I'm rather sure that if there were a way to get the same results (e.g., regarding vignetting) by using less material or making the lens smaller then Sigma's engineers would have grabbed the chance.

Do you know more about lens design than Sigma's engineers do?
I know the 28/1.8 has its use, I have one. I also know it is a very nice pot of Vaseline. It is nowhere near excellent IQ. Never. No way.
Think what you want, but keep your condescending tone for you.
09-17-2013, 10:40 AM   #514
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
Why? The world has resoundingly moved on. Even film is harder to obtain now (along with questions of how environmentally sound film manufacturing and developing is).

There are still millions of film cams out there that hit the selling block for cheap on fleabay, for instance, so we'll all do ok.

Not everything needs to be preserved.
Yeah, digital camera (and its replacing every couple years) manufacturing is clearly an ecological achievement.

Come on...

09-17-2013, 10:59 AM   #515
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Yeah, digital camera (and its replacing every couple years) manufacturing is clearly an ecological achievement.

Come on...
Judging from the stats of a slowdown in the industry, perhaps people are doing like with their computers and holding onto them longer? Don't know, but photo development chemicals and the films aren't really good for the health, nor environment.

How many cams have you turned over in the last few years?

How sound is it to blame upgraditis for getting the new-look DA Limiteds?
09-17-2013, 11:11 AM   #516
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
Judging from the stats of a slowdown in the industry, perhaps people are doing like with their computers and holding onto them longer? Don't know, but photo development chemicals and the films aren't really good for the health, nor environment.
Did I say film chemicals were good for the health?
Do you have any idea of the waste generated by microprocessors and sensors manufacturing (same of course for everything electronics) ? Seems you don't even want to bother asking the question.
I don't even say film is low waste tech, certainly not but neglect the waste of digital is very short sighted.

QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
How many cams have you turned over in the last few years?
Let's say I'm at my 4th DSLR (not counting the wife's of course) and each of'me was indeed a big tech change, so it's not as if I bought as an impulsive buyers. But earlier ones are all gone. Completely outdated. Film ones still run happily. I'm not sure how many. Around 8 I think not counting the 4x5.

QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
How sound is it to blame upgraditis for getting the new-look DA Limiteds?
I didn't blame anybody about any lens. Blame yourself for not being able to read.
09-17-2013, 11:25 AM   #517
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Did I say film chemicals were good for the health?
Do you have any idea of the waste generated by microprocessors and sensors manufacturing (same of course for everything electronics) ? Seems you don't even want to bother asking the question.
I don't even say film is low waste tech, certainly not but neglect the waste of digital is very short sighted.


Let's say I'm at my 4th DSLR (not counting the wife's of course) and each of'me was indeed a big tech change, so it's not as if I bought as an impulsive buyers. But earlier ones are all gone. Completely outdated. Film ones still run happily. I'm not sure how many. Around 8 I think not counting the 4x5.


I didn't blame anybody about any lens. Blame yourself for not being able to read.
Yes, I do know what electronics wastes are created. In fact, intimately as part of an industry. I was involved in recycling of items, rather than scrapping, for industry, despite the longer leadtimes it might cause.
09-17-2013, 01:19 PM - 1 Like   #518
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Let this be a warning to a number of you here posting personal attacks. Please stick to discussions of these lenses and avoid denigrating or snide remarks. Thank you.


Ash.

09-18-2013, 01:26 PM   #519
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fogel70 Quote
The Leica M (240) is marketed as splash-proof. Leica Camera AG - Photography - LEICA M
That's quite interesting. Wouldn't doubt it, in fact, as the body design is fairly simple and body seams seem to be sort of a tongue in groove type. For instance, the Nikon D7000 and Olympus E-5 seal in places in this manner, without sealing materials.
09-18-2013, 01:52 PM - 1 Like   #520
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
That's quite interesting. Wouldn't doubt it, in fact, as the body design is fairly simple and body seams seem to be sort of a tongue in groove type. For instance, the Nikon D7000 and Olympus E-5 seal in places in this manner, without sealing materials.
Sure, the Nikon magicians can do that, while Pentax needs profane things like rubber seals *bfg*
Oh, the referenced Leica page states
QuoteQuote:
Its top and base plates are machined from solid brass, and its full-metal body is manufactured in one piece from high-strength magnesium alloy. Specially designed rubber seals protect the camera body against dust and water spray.
Well, no magic super high precision from Solms, sorry :-)
09-18-2013, 10:16 PM   #521
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QuoteOriginally posted by snake Quote
Why? The world has resoundingly moved on. Even film is harder to obtain now (along with questions of how environmentally sound film manufacturing and developing is).

There are still millions of film cams out there that hit the selling block for cheap on fleabay, for instance, so we'll all do ok.

Not everything needs to be preserved.
Not sure if I would argue that the manufacturing of digital cameras or the products that go with them are totally green, some of the more nasty stuff is in their manufacurer. The only advantage is that the pollution is made some where else so we can pretend to not contribute. Disclaimer I still shoot film and have my own darkroom but work in the envrionmental field. Most household cleaners are more hazardous than black and white chemicals especially if fixer is excluded. Just cause the pollutants are left some where else does not make the product clean or green. Both systems cause hazmat by products as does most of the stuff we buy.

Film is very easy to find on line which seems to be where most people are buying their digital cameras as well. How much harder is it ordering a couple of bricks of film from B&H than a Pentax K50 from them? In fact new emulsions have appeared, along with old favorites dissiapearing and even 110 has made a return. Most of the better film cameras at least those in formats larger than 35mm have increased in the last couple of years.

AS far as totally mechanical cameras out there still being made, the Hasselblad V system just went out last year, but Vivitar sells a K mount camera, Nikon sells the FM10, Fuji has several medium format ones, Rollei is talking about re-introducing the TLR, all large format cameras are totally mechancial or at least manual and there are more manufacturers and models now than thirty years ago and how many models does Holga and Lomography make now?

I thought I had a deal on a DA 15 a couple of days ago however the owner changed his mind. I will keep looking.
09-19-2013, 06:05 AM   #522
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QuoteOriginally posted by shiner Quote
It's been said before in this thread, but if you're plodding around in inclement conditions, why do you have a prime lens mounted to your sensitive electronic camera anyway? Aren't the odds excellent that you'll want/need to change lenses at some point, thus exposing everything to the elements? WR seems mostly useful for zooms or macros, to me. Could they keep the DA35 Ltd tiny and light with all the internal seals (not to mention a motor)? Keep these wonderful lenses small, light, and somewhat affordable, please.
I currently have 3 WR bodies. Of course I only have the DA 300/4 prime.
09-21-2013, 05:10 AM   #523
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Street prices are starting to come in and they're really bad in the UK for these "new" lenses:
Pentax HD PENTAX-DA 35mm F2.8 Macro Limited Lens - Black - Only 639.00 - SRS Microsystems

That's a really crazy price for that lens v the older one.

Pentax K Mount Lenses - Digital SLR Camera Lenses - Page 2 - SRS Microsystems

The level of price increases is just dramatic and surely throws the warning flags up for new users. I can't really see people paying these prices they will just look at other makers and wander off there.
Ricoh are destroying K mount in an orgy of insane price increases.

Even the 40mm f2.8 gets a hefty price rise
Pentax HD PENTAX-DA 40mm F2.8 Limited Lens - Black - Only 439.00 - SRS Microsystems
09-21-2013, 05:29 AM   #524
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I'm glad I'm not living there (though I'm sure that from many other points of view it's a very nice country).
520 instead of 639 for the HD DA 35mm Limited, and 357 instead of 439 for the HD DA 40mm Limited, and Romania doesn't have particularly low prices. Let's face reality, you are being ripped off.
09-21-2013, 06:09 AM   #525
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mr Spocko Quote
..
Ricoh are destroying K mount in an orgy of insane price increases.
That's debatable.
Only reason people don't see the value in new lenses is because there are no updated and no new generation cameras that justify the use of such lenses. K5 was good, but an old song, and no one is excited into buying new lenses knowing that the camera tech is very old.
Let them release two really good brand new cameras, update a few problematic lenses (fix the perception problem), and people will finally see the value — as opposed to now, when they need to imagine it, and still be unsure.
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