New HD DA Limited lenses

**monochrome** · 10-11-2013, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by Clavius

Moreover, buying lenses is much more satisfying because they keep their money much better. The resale value of good glass is very nice. Whilst the value that is sunk into a camera is mostly a 100% loss.

I regularly use a 1975 50/1.4 on all my Pentax cameras. I am the original owner of the lens. It so happens I also still have the original camera that came with the lens.

I bet in 30 years I won't be able to say my K10D, K-01, Q, (K-3) and whatever other digital cameras I buy will still be working (but I bet the lens will be).

FWIW, I also have second-hand '50's and 60's lenses that work as they did when they were new. Same for second-hand cameras.

I don't think my grandmother wasted her money on those cameras and lenses. She could have paid far less for a simple Yashica Rangefinder and probably taken the exact same photos, but so what?

Asahiflex · 10-11-2013, 09:55 AM

Originally posted by monochrome

FWIW, I also have second-hand '50's and 60's lenses that work as they did when they were new. Same for second-hand cameras.

True. 99% of my Takumars (not the ones that were abused beyond repair) are SO GOOD mechanically that they're still focusing buttery smooth. And those are 50 year old lenses! But those were the days... Takumars were built with the tightest tolerances possible, with the very best materials, with the very best lubricants, by the very best personnel they could find, QC'd by the most strict inspectors. Otherwise I cannot think of a valid explanation proving why my Takumars do not have coating defects, oily blades, stuck diaphragms, tight or loose focusing, or even rattles. None of them! No, Takumars are truly gems.

This is in stark contrast with anything German and Russian I have ever used. There are only a few exceptions, but most of those lenses did not withstand the test of time. They ALL have issues. Finding a unabused Takumar with issues is rare, very rare!

I don't have that much faith in today's lenses because plastics and electronics do not age well. And there's no exception to the rule unless we're talking about the rare stuff like the 125mm f/2.5 Macro-Apo-Lanthar (which are very Takumar-like).

bossa · 10-11-2013, 03:15 PM

I'm just looking through some test shots online with the new HD DA 21mm and I must say the CA is really disappointing. Based on the Sigma 18-35 test shots I saw earlier over at DPR on a D7100 I'd say that lens is a no brainer instead of a few of these "limiteds".

http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/011.jpg
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/013.jpg
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/017.jpg

Andi Lo · 10-11-2013, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by bossa

I'm just looking through some test shots online with the new HD DA 21mm and I must say the CA is really disappointing. Based on the Sigma 18-35 test shots I saw earlier over at DPR on a D7100 I'd say that lens is a no brainer instead of a few of these "limiteds".

http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/011.jpg
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/013.jpg
http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/017.jpg

Again, if you'd rather carry one of the heaviest APS zoom ever, go ahead ^^; DA 21 is technically the weakest of the limiteds, but it renders scenes very well when used properly.

Sigma 18-35 is shaping up to be a stellar lens and a great addition to the pentax lineup, but it won't replace the DA Ltds for many reasons I stated above.

Also the samples you posted... is very very good actually. I really like the rendering of this particular copy, minus the obvious magenta cast. Easy fix with the "remove CA" checkbox in LR. If the sigma is even better, it gets me really excited for that lens as well.

bossa · 10-11-2013, 04:59 PM

I regard the fringing as unacceptable and I have seen none in the Sigma thus far:

http://masters.galleries.dpreview.com.s3.amazonaws.com/2718715.jpg?AWSAccess...Zozqs5wNHsM%3d

kh1234567890 · 10-11-2013, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by Andi Lo

Also the samples you posted... is very very good actually. I really like the rendering of this particular copy, minus the obvious magenta cast. Easy fix with the "remove CA" checkbox in LR.

There is something not quite right here. The examples look as if they've had the usual CA removed at some stage - the old SMC DA21 would show more CA than this in the frame corners. What is left is purple and green fringing. Strange, the EXIF shows in-camera CA as off and no post-processing software tags.

As for the magenta cast - why do all the HD examples show this ?

Andi Lo · 10-11-2013, 05:51 PM

Originally posted by kh1234567890

There is something not quite right here. The examples look as if they've had the usual CA removed at some stage - the old SMC DA21 would show more CA than this in the frame corners. What is left is purple and green fringing. Strange, the EXIF shows in-camera CA as off and no post-processing software tags.

As for the magenta cast - why do all the HD examples show this ?

It's taken by the same reviewer I think, same K5IIs that has that magenta-ish WB

Urkeldaedalus · 10-12-2013, 05:28 AM

Originally posted by Andi Lo

It's taken by the same reviewer I think, same K5IIs that has that magenta-ish WB

Codename: Mister Magenta.

Mistral75 · 10-12-2013, 06:50 AM

There are pictures taken with HD DA Limiteds on Pentax Photo Gallery and they show the same colour shift towards magenta:

- DA 15 mm f/4 PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model
- DA 35 mm f/2,8 Macro PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model
- DA 40 mm f/2,8 PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model

gazonk · 10-12-2013, 07:00 AM

I wouldn't worry that this is the lens. The K-5 AWB is very fond of magenta, I almost always have to correct it.

Mistral75 · 10-12-2013, 07:09 AM

I think it might also have to do with the firmware of the K-5IIs used to take these pictures being the 1.04 version and not 1.05, the latter being said to be optimized for HD DA Limiteds.

Cynog Ap Brychan · 10-13-2013, 11:57 PM

I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale.

Caat · 10-14-2013, 12:13 AM

Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan

I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale.

SRS might have just got some actually in stock? When I spoke to them once about lens prices they said that they always try to adjust prices down once they have the items as they can actually then work out their profit margins without risk. However, that wouldn't explain why the old 15mm is more expensive.

Jonathan Mac · 10-14-2013, 03:33 AM

Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan

I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale.

Yes, I was very surprised to see that too. I believe all the others are still more expensive than their original versions though.

Andi Lo · 10-14-2013, 04:50 AM

Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan

I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale.

SRS is weird like that sometimes. I bought the DA 1855 WR from them for around $100 usd right when it first came out (super super cheap), and had my UK friend help me send it to Canada.

Either way, just like expected the price of the lens is already coming down

Good time to buy the DA 15 for europeans?

10-11-2013, 03:15 PM	#738
bossa Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Adelaide Posts: 4,546	I'm just looking through some test shots online with the new HD DA 21mm and I must say the CA is really disappointing. Based on the Sigma 18-35 test shots I saw earlier over at DPR on a D7100 I'd say that lens is a no brainer instead of a few of these "limiteds". http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/011.jpg http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/013.jpg http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/017.jpg Last edited by bossa; 10-11-2013 at 03:37 PM.

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10-11-2013, 09:33 AM	#736
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by Clavius Moreover, buying lenses is much more satisfying because they keep their money much better. The resale value of good glass is very nice. Whilst the value that is sunk into a camera is mostly a 100% loss. I regularly use a 1975 50/1.4 on all my Pentax cameras. I am the original owner of the lens. It so happens I also still have the original camera that came with the lens. I bet in 30 years I won't be able to say my K10D, K-01, Q, (K-3) and whatever other digital cameras I buy will still be working (but I bet the lens will be). FWIW, I also have second-hand '50's and 60's lenses that work as they did when they were new. Same for second-hand cameras. I don't think my grandmother wasted her money on those cameras and lenses. She could have paid far less for a simple Yashica Rangefinder and probably taken the exact same photos, but so what?

10-11-2013, 09:55 AM	#737
Asahiflex Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,795	Originally posted by monochrome FWIW, I also have second-hand '50's and 60's lenses that work as they did when they were new. Same for second-hand cameras. True. 99% of my Takumars (not the ones that were abused beyond repair) are SO GOOD mechanically that they're still focusing buttery smooth. And those are 50 year old lenses! But those were the days... Takumars were built with the tightest tolerances possible, with the very best materials, with the very best lubricants, by the very best personnel they could find, QC'd by the most strict inspectors. Otherwise I cannot think of a valid explanation proving why my Takumars do not have coating defects, oily blades, stuck diaphragms, tight or loose focusing, or even rattles. None of them! No, Takumars are truly gems. This is in stark contrast with anything German and Russian I have ever used. There are only a few exceptions, but most of those lenses did not withstand the test of time. They ALL have issues. Finding a unabused Takumar with issues is rare, very rare! I don't have that much faith in today's lenses because plastics and electronics do not age well. And there's no exception to the rule unless we're talking about the rare stuff like the 125mm f/2.5 Macro-Apo-Lanthar (which are very Takumar-like).

10-11-2013, 04:51 PM	#739
Andi Lo Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia Posts: 2,924	Originally posted by bossa I'm just looking through some test shots online with the new HD DA 21mm and I must say the CA is really disappointing. Based on the Sigma 18-35 test shots I saw earlier over at DPR on a D7100 I'd say that lens is a no brainer instead of a few of these "limiteds". http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/011.jpg http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/013.jpg http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/dcw/docs/618/866/017.jpg Again, if you'd rather carry one of the heaviest APS zoom ever, go ahead ^^; DA 21 is technically the weakest of the limiteds, but it renders scenes very well when used properly. Sigma 18-35 is shaping up to be a stellar lens and a great addition to the pentax lineup, but it won't replace the DA Ltds for many reasons I stated above. Also the samples you posted... is very very good actually. I really like the rendering of this particular copy, minus the obvious magenta cast. Easy fix with the "remove CA" checkbox in LR. If the sigma is even better, it gets me really excited for that lens as well.

10-11-2013, 04:59 PM	#740
bossa Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Adelaide Posts: 4,546	I regard the fringing as unacceptable and I have seen none in the Sigma thus far: http://masters.galleries.dpreview.com.s3.amazonaws.com/2718715.jpg?AWSAccess...Zozqs5wNHsM%3d

10-11-2013, 05:43 PM	#741
kh1234567890 Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Manchester, UK Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,653	Originally posted by Andi Lo Also the samples you posted... is very very good actually. I really like the rendering of this particular copy, minus the obvious magenta cast. Easy fix with the "remove CA" checkbox in LR. There is something not quite right here. The examples look as if they've had the usual CA removed at some stage - the old SMC DA21 would show more CA than this in the frame corners. What is left is purple and green fringing. Strange, the EXIF shows in-camera CA as off and no post-processing software tags. As for the magenta cast - why do all the HD examples show this ?

10-11-2013, 05:51 PM	#742
Andi Lo Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia Posts: 2,924	Originally posted by kh1234567890 There is something not quite right here. The examples look as if they've had the usual CA removed at some stage - the old SMC DA21 would show more CA than this in the frame corners. What is left is purple and green fringing. Strange, the EXIF shows in-camera CA as off and no post-processing software tags. As for the magenta cast - why do all the HD examples show this ? It's taken by the same reviewer I think, same K5IIs that has that magenta-ish WB

10-12-2013, 05:28 AM	#743
Urkeldaedalus Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Iowa Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,369	Originally posted by Andi Lo It's taken by the same reviewer I think, same K5IIs that has that magenta-ish WB Codename: Mister Magenta.

10-12-2013, 06:50 AM	#744
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527 Original Poster	There are pictures taken with HD DA Limiteds on Pentax Photo Gallery and they show the same colour shift towards magenta: - DA 15 mm f/4 PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model - DA 35 mm f/2,8 Macro PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model - DA 40 mm f/2,8 PENTAX : Select a PENTAX interchangeable lens camera or a lens model

10-12-2013, 07:00 AM	#745
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	I wouldn't worry that this is the lens. The K-5 AWB is very fond of magenta, I almost always have to correct it.

10-12-2013, 07:09 AM	#746
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527 Original Poster	I think it might also have to do with the firmware of the K-5IIs used to take these pictures being the 1.04 version and not 1.05, the latter being said to be optimized for HD DA Limiteds.

10-13-2013, 11:57 PM	#747
Cynog Ap Brychan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Gloucester Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,199	I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale.

10-14-2013, 12:13 AM	#748
Caat Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: United Kingdom Photos: Albums Posts: 927	Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale. SRS might have just got some actually in stock? When I spoke to them once about lens prices they said that they always try to adjust prices down once they have the items as they can actually then work out their profit margins without risk. However, that wouldn't explain why the old 15mm is more expensive.

10-14-2013, 03:33 AM	#749
Jonathan Mac Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Madrid, Spain Posts: 10,911	Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale. Yes, I was very surprised to see that too. I believe all the others are still more expensive than their original versions though.

10-14-2013, 04:50 AM	#750
Andi Lo Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia Posts: 2,924	Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan I don't know what's happening, but the price of at least some of the HD Limited's has come down a little in SRS Microsystems (UK). The 15 mm f4 is now listed at £70 less than the old, green band, version, which is currently still on sale. SRS is weird like that sometimes. I bought the DA 1855 WR from them for around $100 usd right when it first came out (super super cheap), and had my UK friend help me send it to Canada. Either way, just like expected the price of the lens is already coming down Good time to buy the DA 15 for europeans?