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10-04-2013, 03:40 AM   #376
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A headphone jack is pointless - especially one which is that bulky - on a camera that it is not focussed on video.

10-04-2013, 06:02 AM   #377
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Well, if it has a headphone jack, then the K-3 must be more centered around video then. And then option E will probably have something to do with those added video capabilities. Which, no matter how impressive those capabilities may be, are just not very interesting to photographers. So I hope Asahi man is just full of it.

Edit 1: Not only the headphone jack indicates more video-centricity. The new line of HD lenses does that too. HD is a video term for 1024p video! And the continuous LED light on the new flashes is only usefull for video. Ah no! The K-3 is really going to be a camcorder.

Then my personal prediction is that the bulge has something to do with a very quiet screwdrive motor, so the typical screwdrive noise doesn't end up in the movies.

Now... How on earth can the entire Pentax userbase of PHOTOGRAPHY enthusiasts NOT be disappointed when they are given something they're not interested in at all? Yes I know, there must be some that are interested in both, but I would guess they would prefer to use dedicated gear.
Just because Pentax is not ignoring video (they can't afford to), it doesn't mean the K-3 is centered around it.

HD is the new coating's name, period. Falsely relating it with 1024p video (which should be 1080p, but that's another story) is just making up reasons for complaining.

There is no reason to be disappointed with this yet unannounced camera, unless you're trying to push Pentax users towards another, preferred brand of cameras.
Any claim that it won't improve photographic-related features is pure BS.
10-04-2013, 06:04 AM   #378
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I am hereby launching my own, home-brewed rumour: the K-3 will enjoy native 4K video capabilities .
10-04-2013, 06:06 AM   #379
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
is just making up reasons for complaining.
Which is the norm here, isn't it?

10-04-2013, 06:39 AM   #380
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
I am hereby launching my own, home-brewed rumour: the K-3 will enjoy native 4K video capabilities .
That would be nice but I cannot imagine Ricoh teleporting Pentax this far into the future. Because who owns a 4K TV right now? The 4K market is even smaller than the FF market
10-04-2013, 07:08 AM   #381
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QuoteOriginally posted by starbase218 Quote
There is something I don't understand. People expect the AF of the supposed K-3 to be faster. But isn't it the AF motor that actually determines how fast the lens focuses? In case of screwdriven lenses, it may be faster because the focus motor is in the body. But with SDM/HSM lenses, how can focus speed be faster if you don't change anything about the AF motor?

The only other option I see is that the AF algorithm is improved. This could make the AF more confident, which may lead to somewhat faster focusing. But I don't see how Pentax AF speed can compete with eg Canon or Nikon without using a different AF motor in their SDM lenses, and this means you actually want new lenses, not a new camera.

As for accuracy, I would think that does depend on the AF system and algorithms in the camera.
Agreed, there is a limit at which the lens can focus. I suspect Pentax will get to that in time with new versions of their lenses.

There is another aspect of speed however. Say for example you have a dog running towards you, or anything approaching. On each shot the camera has to meter, find focus, then trigger the shutter mechanism to expose. What happens when I try this with my K5 is that the lens is capable of keeping up, but the shots are metered randomly and the focus is half way down the dog's body, but inconsistently. By the time the shutter is open everything has moved. A faster lens would only allow the body to hunt a couple of times before missing the shot. I see this less so with birds in flight. The body focuses and shoots, but the time lag means that the exposure is slightly out of focus as the bird is changing distance. A faster meter-focus-expose cycle would help considerably. Then we buy new lenses.
10-04-2013, 07:11 AM   #382
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Just because Pentax is not ignoring video (they can't afford to), it doesn't mean the K-3 is centered around it.
Exactly but seems difficult to understand for some.
10-04-2013, 07:25 AM   #383
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Exactly but seems difficult to understand for some.
(Dang, I can still see it if someone quotes him? Even though I ignored him. That sucks.)

Not ignoring video is what they did in the K-5 and is a very smart move. The features are already there, and they do not bother the photographer. So why shouldn't they exploit them?

But when the photographing user is going to get disadvantages because of all the video-features, then it's a completely different thing. Flashes with dedicated video features(continuous LED light), discontinueing a perfectly good lens line to replace it with a similar one especially designed for (HD: 1024p) video, and placing giant headphone jacks on cameras is total video dedication.

Most photographers can't be bother with such features, and video enthusiasts will already have their dedicated tools. So I refuse to believe Pentax is THAT stupid. All the rumors must be fake.

10-04-2013, 07:45 AM   #384
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Focus

My FF Nikon will handle that situation just fine, so why doesn't Pentax simply copy their focus system instead of struggling trying to fix the system they presently are using?

FWIW, my MZ-S film camera focus far faster than my K5 does in all situations using the same lenses!

QuoteOriginally posted by derekkite Quote

There is another aspect of speed however. Say for example you have a dog running towards you, or anything approaching. On each shot the camera has to meter, find focus, then trigger the shutter mechanism to expose. What happens when I try this with my K5 is that the lens is capable of keeping up, but the shots are metered randomly and the focus is half way down the dog's body, but inconsistently. By the time the shutter is open everything has moved. A faster lens would only allow the body to hunt a couple of times before missing the shot. I see this less so with birds in flight. The body focuses and shoots, but the time lag means that the exposure is slightly out of focus as the bird is changing distance..
10-04-2013, 07:48 AM   #385
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Derek, I'm struggling with this too (K5). Looking back at my "experience" with this camera I think it's the one big frustration, I can't wait to give the K3 a test ride! (keeping the K5II in mind as an alternative)
10-04-2013, 08:01 AM   #386
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
(Dang, I can still see it if someone quotes him? Even though I ignored him. That sucks.)

Not ignoring video is what they did in the K-5 and is a very smart move. The features are already there, and they do not bother the photographer. So why shouldn't they exploit them?

But when the photographing user is going to get disadvantages because of all the video-features, then it's a completely different thing. Flashes with dedicated video features(continuous LED light), discontinueing a perfectly good lens line to replace it with a similar one especially designed for (HD: 1024p) video, and placing giant headphone jacks on cameras is total video dedication.

Most photographers can't be bother with such features, and video enthusiasts will already have their dedicated tools. So I refuse to believe Pentax is THAT stupid. All the rumors must be fake.
I don't understand why Pentaxians are so quick to stick their heads in the sand with regard to new features of any kind. No EVF. No video. Just give me a stripped down K1000 digital camera and I'm good to go. That's just crazy in today's market.

Video features do not impede the ability to use a camera for still photography and in general, they do not increase cost. Video lights are often used by photographers who only do still photography. Improvements in engines that improve video, often improve frames per second and other processing.

I just don't see that adding video features does anything negative, while it expands the brand to a new group of people. That's all good, from my perspective.
10-04-2013, 08:03 AM   #387
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
The focussing motors, as I understand it, are piezo-electric drives (with the exception of the DC drive in the 18-135), which rely on the applied pulse rate for their maximum speed, just like the synchronous speed for an a.c. motor. The load will then determine the slip, or the amount by which the actual speed falls below the maximum. Increasing the pulse rate will increase the maximum speed, but that will generally require the power source to increase the supplied current, because the load on the motor tends to increase with speed. So, theoretically, you can increase the focussing speed by increasing the pulse rate, assuming the power supply can provide the increased current, and the motor can withstand the increased load. Increasing the pulse rate is the easiest part of the process. Of course, the algorithm used to achieve focus is the other part of the process.
Interesting. But, considering that SDM uses the same contacts as powerzoom or indeed the DC motor such as found in the 18-135, maybe these contacts just carry DC that is converted to pulses by electronics within the lens(?)
10-04-2013, 08:09 AM   #388
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I don't understand why Pentaxians are so quick to stick their heads in the sand with regard to new features of any kind. No EVF. No video. Just give me a stripped down K1000 digital camera and I'm good to go. That's just crazy in today's market.

Video features do not impede the ability to use a camera for still photography and in general, they do not increase cost. Video lights are often used by photographers who only do still photography. Improvements in engines that improve video, often improve frames per second and other processing.

I just don't see that adding video features does anything negative, while it expands the brand to a new group of people. That's all good, from my perspective.
I think what people are wary about is the camera being a jack of all trades, or if movie mode compromises the still part (which as you said, it likely won't).

I haven't seen any manufacturer other than sony said firmly that "this is a stills camera through and through, which video mixed in just for kicks" for any camera models yet.

Personally I'd love to see a hybrid EVF, as long as it's good. Being able to see bokeh composition in real time is really a wonderful thing.
10-04-2013, 08:17 AM   #389
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QuoteOriginally posted by derekkite Quote
Agreed, there is a limit at which the lens can focus. I suspect Pentax will get to that in time with new versions of their lenses.

There is another aspect of speed however. Say for example you have a dog running towards you, or anything approaching. On each shot the camera has to meter, find focus, then trigger the shutter mechanism to expose. What happens when I try this with my K5 is that the lens is capable of keeping up, but the shots are metered randomly and the focus is half way down the dog's body, but inconsistently. By the time the shutter is open everything has moved. A faster lens would only allow the body to hunt a couple of times before missing the shot. I see this less so with birds in flight. The body focuses and shoots, but the time lag means that the exposure is slightly out of focus as the bird is changing distance. A faster meter-focus-expose cycle would help considerably. Then we buy new lenses.
A faster meter-focus-expose cycle is definitely not the solution for the problem - or a very primitive and limited one. The key to solving this issue is predicting the motion of the subject and the algorithm used for this. The cam would have to measure the speed of focus changes (i.e., actually, the speed of the dog - but this is done much easier by measuring the internal focus changes). From these changes the cam could predict where it will have to focus after a certain time span (this would be a first order approximation). To get higher accuracy the cam could also measure the speed of changes of the speed of focus changes (or, in simpler words, the acceleration of the focus changes/the dog - this would be called a second order approximation). And so on. - And I guess it is something like this what elaborate continuous/predictive AF-systems like Nikon's do.
10-04-2013, 08:28 AM   #390
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QuoteOriginally posted by JanG Quote
A faster meter-focus-expose cycle is definitely not the solution for the problem - or a very primitive and limited one. The key to solving this issue is predicting the motion of the subject and the algorithm used for this. The cam would have to measure the speed of focus changes (i.e., actually, the speed of the dog - but this is done much easier by measuring the internal focus changes). From these changes the cam could predict where it will have to focus after a certain time span (this would be a first order approximation). To get higher accuracy the cam could also measure the speed of changes of the speed of focus changes (or, in simpler words, the acceleration of the focus changes/the dog - this would be called a second order approximation). And so on. - And I guess it is something like this what elaborate continuous/predictive AF-systems like Nikon's do.
Yes, any changes the Pentax has made for tracking moving subjects, especially those coming towards the camera will be limited without some fancy new predictive algorithms built-in. All the new focus points and smaller focus points in the world will only help so much without some brains behind the system. If they do have some more sophisticated predictiveness built-in, I would also expect a series of firmware updates tweaking it as all the user reports and complaints come in -- mass real-world testing is the only way to uncover all the flaws and blind-spots in such a system, and no doubt there will be glitches. Hopefully they've beefed up their software engineering dept as well and will be responsive to user feedback.
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