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10-07-2013, 04:33 PM   #151
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Would love to find out if there's expandable ISO or not. Adorama is listing the K-3 with "ISO range 80-51,200" in their first look. I hope it isn't just a typo, but why retype something instead of copy paste?

10-07-2013, 04:54 PM   #152
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Some specsheet files on my blog

http://www.priyantha.nl/?p=572

And also some pictures of the new kit including some pictures which are supposed to be made by the K3 itself
http://www.priyantha.nl/?p=462
10-07-2013, 10:19 PM   #153
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An ISO of 51k isn't needed and could've been replaced with both ISO's 50 and 25. Why wouldn't you raise the synch speed to at least 1/200th?

Last edited by tabl10s; 10-08-2013 at 08:32 AM.
10-07-2013, 10:24 PM   #154
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unregistered Quote
Hooray 2x!

First, it's a major win for Pentax and Ricoh! Hopefully the online reviews and tests will show this camera beating the competition to a fine dry dust.

Second, I can't wait for the used market to fill up with previous generation bodies! Ahh, a dedicated body for M42 lenses, another for B&W...

10-07-2013, 11:41 PM   #155
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QuoteOriginally posted by halfspin Quote
Would love to find out if there's expandable ISO or not. Adorama is listing the K-3 with "ISO range 80-51,200" in their first look. I hope it isn't just a typo, but why retype something instead of copy paste?
Maybe it's a copy/paste from K-5 specs?
10-08-2013, 12:01 AM - 1 Like   #156
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QuoteOriginally posted by tabl10s Quote
An ISO of 51k isn't needed and could've been replaced with both ISO's of 50 and 25. Why wouldn't you raise the synch speed to at least 1/200th?
I agree about the sync speed, but that is only one problem with P-TTL. Pentax really needs a new flash system, obviously we aren't getting that in K-3. Maybe they are saving that for K-1 FF?

But, obviously a lot of people don't understand image sensors and ISO. Forcing a low ISO on a sensor that does not perform well at that speed isn't going to help you get better pictures. If the lowest ISO of the 24mp sensor is 100, then that is the lowest ISO where it performs to spec. Pentax, nor any other camera maker, aren't going to enable ISO modes that result is lower quality images. Lower ISO is NOT always better in dealing with sensors. Sensors can saturate very easily at lower ISO's, unless the sensor has been specifically designed for low ISO, but then don't expect a high ISO range out of that sensor. We are not dealing with film here, sensors need to perform well at a very wide range of ISO's.

I believe we were very fortunate when Pentax selected the 16mp Sony sensor which actually performs very well outside it's designed ISO range, especially ISO 80. There is a reason why there's a function to enable these "expanded" ISO ranges in the firmware, and they are not enabled by default. For the computer geeks out there, Pentax is essentially giving you the ability to "overclock" the sensor and use it outside its design range, because they found that it works well. That may or may not be true of any other sensor, including the 24mp used in K-3.

Bottom line, I won't miss ISO 80 if the sensor performance of K-3 at ISO 100 is already able to beat the Sony 16mp sensor in my K-5.
10-08-2013, 01:58 AM - 1 Like   #157
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
No language support for Tagalog or Visayan. The K-3 is a piece of junk!
The specs say language is "dependent on market" so you never know......

Anyway, I won't be buying it because it doesn't have Welsh!!
10-08-2013, 05:35 AM   #158
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbope Quote
I agree about the sync speed, but that is only one problem with P-TTL. Pentax really needs a new flash system, obviously we aren't getting that in K-3. Maybe they are saving that for K-1 FF?

....
From the K-3 product page:

"By detecting the type of scene or subject using the light sensor, the K-3 also can not only select the exposure settings that are more consistent with the photographer’s creative intentions, but also it can make more precise distinction between the main subject and the background to improve the accuracy of flash discharge level."

The proof is yet to come, I suppose.

10-08-2013, 05:46 AM   #159
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbope Quote
I believe we were very fortunate when Pentax selected the 16mp Sony sensor which actually performs very well outside it's designed ISO range
From what I understood I thought the 16mp Sony was used in other cameras but didn't come close to the K-5 as far as dynamic range. I just assumed Pentax worked some sort of dark magic on it and would do the same with the K-3. I spose I'll wait and see what the DxOMark score for DR is when it gets tested. If it's not much better than the K-5 I'll have to Spinal Tap the K-3 when I get my hands on it.
10-08-2013, 05:54 AM   #160
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbope Quote
I agree about the sync speed, but that is only one problem with P-TTL. Pentax really needs a new flash system, obviously we aren't getting that in K-3. Maybe they are saving that for K-1 FF?

But, obviously a lot of people don't understand image sensors and ISO. Forcing a low ISO on a sensor that does not perform well at that speed isn't going to help you get better pictures. If the lowest ISO of the 24mp sensor is 100, then that is the lowest ISO where it performs to spec. Pentax, nor any other camera maker, aren't going to enable ISO modes that result is lower quality images. Lower ISO is NOT always better in dealing with sensors. Sensors can saturate very easily at lower ISO's, unless the sensor has been specifically designed for low ISO, but then don't expect a high ISO range out of that sensor. We are not dealing with film here, sensors need to perform well at a very wide range of ISO's.

I believe we were very fortunate when Pentax selected the 16mp Sony sensor which actually performs very well outside it's designed ISO range, especially ISO 80. There is a reason why there's a function to enable these "expanded" ISO ranges in the firmware, and they are not enabled by default. For the computer geeks out there, Pentax is essentially giving you the ability to "overclock" the sensor and use it outside its design range, because they found that it works well. That may or may not be true of any other sensor, including the 24mp used in K-3.

Bottom line, I won't miss ISO 80 if the sensor performance of K-3 at ISO 100 is already able to beat the Sony 16mp sensor in my K-5.
I don't even use ISO 100 as I always have highlight protection on (min ISO 160 on my K-5)...ISO 80 or lower may not be useful for me...
10-08-2013, 06:36 AM   #161
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QuoteOriginally posted by halfspin Quote
From what I understood I thought the 16mp Sony was used in other cameras but didn't come close to the K-5 as far as dynamic range. I just assumed Pentax worked some sort of dark magic on it and would do the same with the K-3. I spose I'll wait and see what the DxOMark score for DR is when it gets tested. If it's not much better than the K-5 I'll have to Spinal Tap the K-3 when I get my hands on it.
Image quality and dynamic range are not only a result of the sensor. The whole signal processing chain starts with the sensor and includes also the chip and software (firmware) which provides "instructions" how to process data from the sensor in a certain way. The chip and firmware are typically referred to as the "processing engine" in a camera. Every camera manufacturer develops these to suit their own designs. The same sensor with a different processing engine can have different image characteristics. For example, look at the difference in performance between the original K-5 and the Nikon D7000, both are reported to use the same sensor. In almost every case, the Pentax outperforms the Nikon in pure image quality measurements.

The so-called "dark magic" you speak of lives in the processing engine, not the sensor. Obviously, you need a good sensor to start with.
10-08-2013, 06:42 AM   #162
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbope Quote
Image quality and dynamic range are not only a result of the sensor.
Ah...thanks. That's a helpful explanation.
10-08-2013, 07:02 AM   #163
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I'm really happy for Pentax. This is a camera that looks like is going to be a big improvement over the K-5. I can certainly use those extra megapixels for nearly 100% crops.

I'm glad there isn't to much negativity around here. I will say it once just to get it off my mind. The two main photography places I visit are this forum and flickr. I see people complain about things around here even when Ricoh/Pentax come out with what looks like an engineering masterpiece.

On the other hand, on flickr you get people who have posted badly edited photos (that even get explored) and even fake ones who try to pass them off for being real and it seems nobody says anything negative about them. The disparity drives me kind of crazy but there are reasons for it.

Good photographers find ways to deal with obstacles such as what they see as to many megapixels. Not so good photographers complain about them and do nothing. Such is life. A friend of mine found a way to compress the images of the Sony A77 into about 16 megapixels in Photoshop and it reduces or eliminates the noise.

I typically go to places where there are other good and not so good photographers around. Some of them are cool to talk to and I hear things about the competition and some of their cameras and lenses have a few weaknesses compared to what I use and what I try to do. I talk to a machinist who occasionally complains about his FF cameras. He says he creates things that are accurate to 1/1000th of an inch and he says his brand doesn't use that sort of accuracy in all areas.

http://500px.com/AndrewsWildlife

Last edited by traderdrew; 10-08-2013 at 07:11 AM.
10-08-2013, 07:53 AM   #164
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QuoteOriginally posted by traderdrew Quote
I'm really happy for Pentax. This is a camera that looks like is going to be a big improvement over the K-5. I can certainly use those extra megapixels for nearly 100% crops.

I'm glad there isn't to much negativity around here. I will say it once just to get it off my mind. The two main photography places I visit are this forum and flickr. I see people complain about things around here even when Ricoh/Pentax come out with what looks like an engineering masterpiece.

On the other hand, on flickr you get people who have posted badly edited photos (that even get explored) and even fake ones who try to pass them off for being real and it seems nobody says anything negative about them. The disparity drives me kind of crazy but there are reasons for it.

Good photographers find ways to deal with obstacles such as what they see as to many megapixels. Not so good photographers complain about them and do nothing. Such is life. A friend of mine found a way to compress the images of the Sony A77 into about 16 megapixels in Photoshop and it reduces or eliminates the noise.

I typically go to places where there are other good and not so good photographers around. Some of them are cool to talk to and I hear things about the competition and some of their cameras and lenses have a few weaknesses compared to what I use and what I try to do. I talk to a machinist who occasionally complains about his FF cameras. He says he creates things that are accurate to 1/1000th of an inch and he says his brand doesn't use that sort of accuracy in all areas.

500px / Andrew Richardson / Photos
Well said. I do think Ricoh has invested a lot into the K-3 and it really looks like it could be a big hit if the specs translate into real-world top-class performance. Unfortunately, we'll have to wait until a few reviews are available to see how close they have been able to get. I have a lot of confidence in Ricoh/Pentax and it seems that Ricoh is really interested to push Pentax forward and take back some market share from CaNikon.

I know that a lot of people on PF are disappointed in the new focus on video, but for a DSLR to have a real chance in the mainstream market, it has to have at least competent video functionality, something Pentax has so far been unable to do (before K-3) for whatever reasons. Remember, increased market share means increased visibility for Pentax as a brand and increased visibility and availability in more camera shops. More gear in camera shops leads to better competition and better prices for everyone. We can only benefit if Pentax gear is more widely available.
10-08-2013, 08:36 AM   #165
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan Quote
The specs say language is "dependent on market" so you never know......

Anyway, I won't be buying it because it doesn't have Welsh!!

I'm part Scottish on my father's side. i don't think I'll get it either. Now, if I were only Irish...
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