The DA limited is 20-40? and WR?!

derekkite · 11-19-2013, 08:49 PM

400 f4 is a big lens. I'd be happy with 400 5.6 at the long end for $2k ish. As long as it is sharp.

Zygonyx · 11-20-2013, 07:57 AM

As far as reliable infos can be, this lens is to be made available in Japan as from 15th of december, 2013.
No idea what will happen in other countries, nor if the typhon destructions in CEBU (lens assembled in Vietnam, but maybe transfered somewhere else before final shipping) can impact it's delivery logistics.

**Aristophanes** · 11-20-2013, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by leopold

Heie,
the Canon and Nikon 200-400mm/4 cost more than 2500-3000$, there is no way a constant f/4 lens of that focal length will cost just 2500-3000$. The newer Nikon 80-400mm/4.5-5.6 and the Sony 70-400mm/4.5-5.6 cost arount that 2500$ !!!

For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM.

If Pentax goes 120-380mm as indicated on the roadmap I suspect it could go f4/-5.6, be WR, DC, relatively small compared to the competition, and not a breaker of the budget. Add in a TC for APS-C.....

The Canon is on sale for CAN$1399. I think a sub-$1750 is about all one can hope for in the APS-C price range right now.

I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future.

If you look at the Pentax zoom lineup this is the missing piece.

ElJamoquio · 11-20-2013, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future.

DA 560 F/5.6 will become DFA 560 F/5.6?

**Digitalis** · 11-20-2013, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM.

Which should be pretty easy to beat, @ 400mm f/5.6 the canon L lens is notoriously soft.

leopold · 11-20-2013, 04:18 PM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM.

If Pentax goes 120-380mm as indicated on the roadmap I suspect it could go f4/-5.6, be WR, DC, relatively small compared to the competition, and not a breaker of the budget. Add in a TC for APS-C.....

The Canon is on sale for CAN$1399. I think a sub-$1750 is about all one can hope for in the APS-C price range right now.

I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future.

If you look at the Pentax zoom lineup this is the missing piece.

The Canon is cheap because it's an old design and old lens and it's a FF lens also. Canon is rumored to release a new version sooner or later but i'm sure the price will go up like the Nikon did!!!

**Aristophanes** · 11-20-2013, 06:03 PM

Originally posted by Digitalis

Which should be pretty easy to beat, @ 400mm f/5.6 the canon L lens is notoriously soft.

Originally posted by leopold

The Canon is cheap because it's an old design and old lens and it's a FF lens also. Canon is rumored to release a new version sooner or later but i'm sure the price will go up like the Nikon did!!!

This is exactly the FL's here APS-C can outdo FF on value. The Nikon 80-400 VR is another competitor, so looking at the Pentax roadmap I see room for a less ambitious zoom range meaning faster aperture and certainly more compact given IBIS. I still see a $1,500 price point at the counter, or less, and nowhere near the Nikon's ambitious (and much mocked) price. Knocking 60mm off the range could take it down to 1/2 the Nikon size and 1/3 off the price with maybe even an f/4 for the first 100mm.

Or... this might be a lens we see with optical stabilization. All options are on the table.

In any case, the 20-40 has a precise place in the market array of Pentax zooms once it is paired with the 55-300 or the 60-250. Now the odd one out without a pairing is the 18-135.

ElJamoquio · 11-20-2013, 06:48 PM

Originally posted by Aristophanes

This is exactly the FL's here APS-C can outdo FF on value. The Nikon 80-400 VR is another competitor, so looking at the Pentax roadmap I see room for a less ambitious zoom range meaning faster aperture and certainly more compact given IBIS. I still see a $1,500 price point at the counter, or less, and nowhere near the Nikon's ambitious (and much mocked) price. Knocking 60mm off the range could take it down to 1/2 the Nikon size and 1/3 off the price with maybe even an f/4 for the first 100mm..

How different is this proposed lens from the 55-300, though? Size/weight/cost are usually based on the longest range of a telephoto's zoom... so if you want to reduce the price and cost very much you'd need to knock off the longest focal length...

goubejp · 11-21-2013, 03:29 AM

Yes but these zooms are often used at their maximum focal length...

normhead · 11-21-2013, 06:17 AM

Having returned two Sigma 120-400s because for my purposes, their images were too soft to be useful, I can happily say, what the world needs is not another soft 400mm lens. I ended up with a 60-250, which is sharp beyond all expectation, an A-400, which is so much sharper than the Sigma 120-400 the Sigma shouldn't even be discussed as a viable option.

Long lenses are usually only bought for their longer focal lengths. More than half my 60-250 images are taken at 250, and many of my 400 images are cropped, in other words, I could use even longer. When you buy a long zoom, most people are actually buying it for the long end, Something it would be nice for lens manufacturers to pay attention to. They should be keeping the long end sharp and compromising on the short end. Something none of them seem to have clued in to.

dankoBanana · 11-21-2013, 07:23 AM

Pentax HD DA 20-40mm F2.8-4 ED Limited DC WR Review & Rating | PCMag.com

first review?

gri · 11-21-2013, 07:56 AM

Originally posted by dankoBanana

Pentax HD DA 20-40mm F2.8-4 ED Limited DC WR Review & Rating | PCMag.com

first review?

Only two pictures

how they did this review !!!

Mr Spocko · 11-21-2013, 09:24 AM

Some sites don't have full sized samples and just give a quick review. That place isn't my favourite site by any means.
But you can't deny it's overpriced, and the point about the Sigma lens is quite a valid one. Basically all the Pentax has going for it is WR and build. The Sigma has the speed and is probably a better all round lens.

Saying that for 16/17-50mm users who might have a fast prime in that range too I can't see a whole lot of point to either the Pentax or the Sigma

Parallax · 11-21-2013, 09:37 AM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

Saying that for 16/17-50mm users who might have a fast prime in that range too I can't see a whole lot of point to either the Pentax or the Sigma

Yep. People who have that range/aperture covered probably won't be interested in duplicating it; but that applies to just about just about anything, doesn't it?
I Own a Dodge 3/4 ton diesel pickup and a Chevy Spark, so I'm not likely to add a Ford F250 or a Toyota Yaris to the fleet, but I'm not sure that means there is no point to them existing.

Franc · 11-21-2013, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by Mr Spocko

The Sigma has the speed and is probably a better all round lens.

but prone to flare!

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11-19-2013, 08:49 PM	#811
derekkite Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Nelson B.C. Posts: 3,782	400 f4 is a big lens. I'd be happy with 400 5.6 at the long end for $2k ish. As long as it is sharp.

11-20-2013, 07:57 AM	#812
Zygonyx Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Ile de France Posts: 4,033	As far as reliable infos can be, this lens is to be made available in Japan as from 15th of december, 2013. No idea what will happen in other countries, nor if the typhon destructions in CEBU (lens assembled in Vietnam, but maybe transfered somewhere else before final shipping) can impact it's delivery logistics.

11-20-2013, 11:45 AM	#813
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by leopold Heie, the Canon and Nikon 200-400mm/4 cost more than 2500-3000$, there is no way a constant f/4 lens of that focal length will cost just 2500-3000$. The newer Nikon 80-400mm/4.5-5.6 and the Sony 70-400mm/4.5-5.6 cost arount that 2500$ !!! For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM. If Pentax goes 120-380mm as indicated on the roadmap I suspect it could go f4/-5.6, be WR, DC, relatively small compared to the competition, and not a breaker of the budget. Add in a TC for APS-C..... The Canon is on sale for CAN$1399. I think a sub-$1750 is about all one can hope for in the APS-C price range right now. I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future. If you look at the Pentax zoom lineup this is the missing piece.

11-20-2013, 11:52 AM	#814
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by Aristophanes I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future. DA 560 F/5.6 will become DFA 560 F/5.6?

11-20-2013, 03:55 PM	#815
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by Aristophanes For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM. Which should be pretty easy to beat, @ 400mm f/5.6 the canon L lens is notoriously soft.

11-20-2013, 04:18 PM	#816
leopold Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: montreal Posts: 136	Originally posted by Aristophanes For APS-C the competitor and benchmark is the Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM. If Pentax goes 120-380mm as indicated on the roadmap I suspect it could go f4/-5.6, be WR, DC, relatively small compared to the competition, and not a breaker of the budget. Add in a TC for APS-C..... The Canon is on sale for CAN$1399. I think a sub-$1750 is about all one can hope for in the APS-C price range right now. I cannot see a $2,000+ APS-C lens from Pentax in the future. If you look at the Pentax zoom lineup this is the missing piece. The Canon is cheap because it's an old design and old lens and it's a FF lens also. Canon is rumored to release a new version sooner or later but i'm sure the price will go up like the Nikon did!!!

11-20-2013, 06:03 PM	#817
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by Digitalis Which should be pretty easy to beat, @ 400mm f/5.6 the canon L lens is notoriously soft. Originally posted by leopold The Canon is cheap because it's an old design and old lens and it's a FF lens also. Canon is rumored to release a new version sooner or later but i'm sure the price will go up like the Nikon did!!! This is exactly the FL's here APS-C can outdo FF on value. The Nikon 80-400 VR is another competitor, so looking at the Pentax roadmap I see room for a less ambitious zoom range meaning faster aperture and certainly more compact given IBIS. I still see a $1,500 price point at the counter, or less, and nowhere near the Nikon's ambitious (and much mocked) price. Knocking 60mm off the range could take it down to 1/2 the Nikon size and 1/3 off the price with maybe even an f/4 for the first 100mm. Or... this might be a lens we see with optical stabilization. All options are on the table. In any case, the 20-40 has a precise place in the market array of Pentax zooms once it is paired with the 55-300 or the 60-250. Now the odd one out without a pairing is the 18-135.

11-20-2013, 06:48 PM	#818
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by Aristophanes This is exactly the FL's here APS-C can outdo FF on value. The Nikon 80-400 VR is another competitor, so looking at the Pentax roadmap I see room for a less ambitious zoom range meaning faster aperture and certainly more compact given IBIS. I still see a $1,500 price point at the counter, or less, and nowhere near the Nikon's ambitious (and much mocked) price. Knocking 60mm off the range could take it down to 1/2 the Nikon size and 1/3 off the price with maybe even an f/4 for the first 100mm.. How different is this proposed lens from the 55-300, though? Size/weight/cost are usually based on the longest range of a telephoto's zoom... so if you want to reduce the price and cost very much you'd need to knock off the longest focal length...

11-21-2013, 03:29 AM	#819
goubejp Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: France Photos: Albums Posts: 804	Yes but these zooms are often used at their maximum focal length...

11-21-2013, 06:17 AM	#820
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Having returned two Sigma 120-400s because for my purposes, their images were too soft to be useful, I can happily say, what the world needs is not another soft 400mm lens. I ended up with a 60-250, which is sharp beyond all expectation, an A-400, which is so much sharper than the Sigma 120-400 the Sigma shouldn't even be discussed as a viable option. Long lenses are usually only bought for their longer focal lengths. More than half my 60-250 images are taken at 250, and many of my 400 images are cropped, in other words, I could use even longer. When you buy a long zoom, most people are actually buying it for the long end, Something it would be nice for lens manufacturers to pay attention to. They should be keeping the long end sharp and compromising on the short end. Something none of them seem to have clued in to.

11-21-2013, 07:23 AM	#821
dankoBanana Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Zagreb, Croatia Posts: 533	Pentax HD DA 20-40mm F2.8-4 ED Limited DC WR Review & Rating \| PCMag.com first review?

11-21-2013, 07:56 AM	#822
gri Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 25	Originally posted by dankoBanana Pentax HD DA 20-40mm F2.8-4 ED Limited DC WR Review & Rating \| PCMag.com first review? Only two pictures how they did this review !!!

11-21-2013, 09:24 AM	#823
Mr Spocko Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 254	Some sites don't have full sized samples and just give a quick review. That place isn't my favourite site by any means. But you can't deny it's overpriced, and the point about the Sigma lens is quite a valid one. Basically all the Pentax has going for it is WR and build. The Sigma has the speed and is probably a better all round lens. Saying that for 16/17-50mm users who might have a fast prime in that range too I can't see a whole lot of point to either the Pentax or the Sigma

11-21-2013, 09:37 AM	#824
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	Originally posted by Mr Spocko Saying that for 16/17-50mm users who might have a fast prime in that range too I can't see a whole lot of point to either the Pentax or the Sigma Yep. People who have that range/aperture covered probably won't be interested in duplicating it; but that applies to just about just about anything, doesn't it? I Own a Dodge 3/4 ton diesel pickup and a Chevy Spark, so I'm not likely to add a Ford F250 or a Toyota Yaris to the fleet, but I'm not sure that means there is no point to them existing.

11-21-2013, 09:39 AM	#825
Franc Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Hoevelaken Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,213	Originally posted by Mr Spocko The Sigma has the speed and is probably a better all round lens. but prone to flare!