[tclausen]

They do, but that is a film era lens. When was the last time Pentax introduced a new lens like that?

So, there's something to be said for "it's hard to beat perfection" - and also that it takes a good while to creat perfection. I'd wager that the Hoya years were not conductive to such perfection happening - but I am more optimistic now that we're (back?) in the era of Ricoh.

Honestly, I suspect strongly that when we've seen the current FA Ltd's updated, we're going to -1-2 years out - see another addition to the FA Ltd series.

[Fogel70]

They do, but that is a film era lens. When was the last time Pentax introduced a new lens like that?

It depends on what you mean, but IMO DA Ltd belongs to this category too. Pentax just have a ldifferent priority than Fuji, and Pentax is limited on lenses by the DSLR design.

[ElJamoquio]

It should be directed at Pentax USA and the falsely low prices set under Hoya

Dunno, about 50% of the price hike is 'warranted' in the market and the other 50% is complete pull-of-of-the-posterior wishful thinking in my view.

Heck, 18-270... sells for almost twice the Tamron, or something like that, right?
How does the 31mm F/1.8 compare to the 28mm 1.8 Nikon? I'd rather have the Pentax of course, but is it worth twice as much?
What about the Tokina 35mm? Heck, ALL the Tokina lenses which are also kinda Pentax lenses?

Or in summary... $600 for a 16-50 is perhaps too low but $1400 or whatever is also silly.

[ElJamoquio]

Full Frame Myth

"Then, and even now, full frame was very expensive"

For me it was less expensive. YMMV.

[Winder]

It depends on what you mean, but IMO DA Ltd belongs to this category too.

My original comment was:
"I just hope Pentax is taking a good look at what Fuji is doing with lenses. Fuji is designing some high quality, modern primes that are fast and compact. Lenses like the 23mm that have the aperture ring on the lens, are fast, and compact."

Which DA LTD has the characteristics of having the "aperture ring, are fast, and compact"?

None of them are very fast. None of them have the aperture ring. They are compact.

[Fogel70]

But how much use do you have of an aperture ring on an AF lens used on a Pentax DSLR?

The problem with DSLR is that it's not possible to get both fast and compact when it comes to wide angle lenses.
And the problem get even more extreme for DSLR with APS-C sensor.
*
So the choice for Pentax is either large and fast or compact and slow. They usually choose the latter.
What you're asking for is just not possible.

[krebsy75]

Has anyone ever sacrificed $1,400 for the 16-50?

Speak now or...

[starjedi]

Has anyone ever sacrificed $1,400 for the 16-50?

Speak now or...

Pentax/Ricoh in no doubt overprices 2x comparing to other competitors for many of its lens. It is just a joke for 16-50 once priced at $1500 and 50-135 priced at $1600. That kind of price seems to be set for APS-C F1.8 zoom (think about Sigma 18-35 F1.8 :-))

[Winder]

But how much use do you have of an aperture ring on an AF lens used on a Pentax DSLR?

The problem with DSLR is that it's not possible to get both fast and compact when it comes to wide angle lenses.
And the problem get even more extreme for DSLR with APS-C sensor.
*
So the choice for Pentax is either large and fast or compact and slow. They usually choose the latter.
What you're asking for is just not possible.

I would use the aperture ring quit a bit. It would free up the other wheel so I could customize it for ISO. This would do away with the need for the exposure compensation button and dial and allow you to do it all at once. I could set it to Automatic like I do now with my 31mm or I could actually use it. Fuji is bring it back, while Samsung had added the i-function. A USB dock would be another nice advancement I would like to see from Pentax.

[Zygonyx]

The fun thing is that there is not a whole lot of more space behind the sensor on a Pentax DSLR than on Panasonic GM-1.
It's probably 5-7mm difference, which SR probably take half of that distance. And cameras like Sony A7/A7r has more space behind the sensor than a Pentax DSLR.

Possibly so for GM-1, that has no sensor stabilisation. But still the same electronics than its brother GX-7, about two times bigger.

As far as A7 is concerned, i guess the "over-thikness" compared to K-5/K-3 is due to mobile/tilt rearsreen, and nothing else.

Some are convinced, and me too, that you actually should be able to insert FF sensor and SR in K-3 body let appart bigger bump for a bright and bigger pentaprism.
And with the 3 FA limiteds, updated or not, you still have a clear "compactness competitive advantage" over any other FF system.... for now and at least a few months, maybe a few years to come...

@Winder : fortunately for Ricoh, the Fuji X-mount is not FF compatible ; Fuji has also recently declined having FF plans at the moment.

Has anyone ever sacrificed $1,400 for the 16-50?

Speak now or...

I understand some eagerness taking into account the 2013 price increases for some Pentax lenses.
I don't excuse Ricoh and would rather blame them on this.
But remember the DA* are weathersealed... not exactly the case of any competition equivalent standards, Sigma first.
In my case i got a "like-new" SDM-repaired 16-50mm for 500€, at a time when it was available new for less than 900€...
If i was to buy it new today, i think i wouldn't for sure.

[Fogel70]

I would use the aperture ring quit a bit. It would free up the other wheel so I could customize it for ISO. This would do away with the need for the exposure compensation button and dial and allow you to do it all at once. I could set it to Automatic like I do now with my 31mm or I could actually use it. Fuji is bring it back, while Samsung had added the i-function. A USB dock would be another nice advancement I would like to see from Pentax.

But what you suggest it that Pentax has to uncrippple the K-mount, which might never happen. If to get a dedicated aperture ring to work well Pentax has to completely redesign it's control interface. Not something everybody would like, and it might make Pentax DSLR even more niched products.

Fuji has gone for retro controls, and aperture ring on some of the lenses, but they might not use that forever.
Who knows the next hot trend might be futuristic design with all controls on a touch screen.

[Zygonyx]

Samsung's way...

[bossa]

Ricoh just wants to get their name on the products and is doing the bare minimum to "revamp" the line-up. I was hoping they would take the opportunity to make some real improvements to the older lenses.

Exactly. Purple fringing, no QS and no WR would seem to be the major issues with these lenses right now. If they don't tweak the optical formula to eradicate PF then what's the point? It's just window dressing - all FA lenses were designed for film cameras NOT DSLR's. If Ricoh can't be bothered doing real work on the optics are they merely getting ready to sell Pentax?

[Fogel70]

Exactly. Purple fringing, no QS and no WR would seem to be the major issues with these lenses right now. If they don't tweak the optical formula to eradicate PF then what's the point? It's just window dressing - all FA lenses were designed for film cameras NOT DSLR's. If Ricoh can't be bothered doing real work on the optics are they merely getting ready to sell Pentax?

The major point is to implement HD coating, which will improve manufacturing process of the glass. This will lead to better quality control, and lower reject rate on produced glass. And in the long run it will make the glass cheaper to produce.

The redesign of the lenses is just a way of promoting this, and a possibility to make more profit.

[mecrox]

Exactly. Purple fringing, no QS and no WR would seem to be the major issues with these lenses right now. If they don't tweak the optical formula to eradicate PF then what's the point? It's just window dressing - all FA lenses were designed for film cameras NOT DSLR's. If Ricoh can't be bothered doing real work on the optics are they merely getting ready to sell Pentax?

No, I don't think so. Some say that much of the work done since the acquisition has been behind the scenes, integrating the Ricoh and Pentax camera operations into a single unit. If that is true, then there is no longer a Pentax to sell. Ricoh could sell the whole of their camera division or close down the Pentax brand, but disassembling the two parts with a view to selling one might be as difficult as uniting them in the first place. Just a guess.

A couple of years ago, some on here were lamenting Pentax's timidity, lack of new products, lack of investment and their search for little niches as the result of Hoya's mean and inept stewardship. Now the same voices are saying that lack of new products, lack of investment to do much more than maintain the status quo (there has clearly been more investment in the lenses but not that much more to judge from the results) and concentration on niches is a strategic masterstroke thanks to Ricoh.

Maybe Ricoh have decided to run Pentax as a small and pricey boutique brand offering a select range of high-end classics for a certain kind of customer, perhaps mainly in Japan? it looks a bit like it. (Quite similar to the path taken by Ricoh's own camera brand which has a small but very loyal and keen following in Japan, apparently.) The new DA Limited 20-40mm makes a perfect fit for that approach. Tweaking the D-FA Limiteds would fit with that approach too, but redesigning them would not.

Strange world, very strange.