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03-29-2014, 06:00 AM   #481
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
I very much prefer the viewfinder over live view.
I very much prefer an optical VF over a digital VF for critical shooting and framing. I can use LV and an EVF when necessary, but I find them to have overall a lower quality feedback loop. Useful sometimes (video).

03-29-2014, 08:38 AM   #482
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I tried to use an IR converted Olympus PEN without a VF for about six months. I was hoping to go without an accessory EVF to keep the size of the camera down. In the end, it just proved too frustrating of an experience. I ended up breaking and getting an accessory EVF. With the viewfinder, the output I got out of the camera improved dramatically. The experience left me with a strong prejudice against VF-less cameras—so much so, that I have difficulty taking seriously any camera that lacks a VF. I just can't see well enough what I'm doing in LV. I end up committing compositional blunders.
03-29-2014, 09:42 AM   #483
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
I very much prefer an optical VF over a digital VF for critical shooting and framing. I can use LV and an EVF when necessary, but I find them to have overall a lower quality feedback loop. Useful sometimes (video).
That is exactly the way I feel about them as well.
03-29-2014, 08:28 PM   #484
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QuoteOriginally posted by northcoastgreg Quote
I tried to use an IR converted Olympus PEN without a VF for about six months. I was hoping to go without an accessory EVF to keep the size of the camera down. In the end, it just proved too frustrating of an experience. I ended up breaking and getting an accessory EVF. With the viewfinder, the output I got out of the camera improved dramatically. The experience left me with a strong prejudice against VF-less cameras—so much so, that I have difficulty taking seriously any camera that lacks a VF. I just can't see well enough what I'm doing in LV. I end up committing compositional blunders.
I eagerly await Ricoh's GR remake (speculation alert). I predict/hope it will feature:
  1. Plug-in EVF option like the Sony RX1
  2. Weather resistant
  3. Much improved video
  4. Much faster AF
  5. Rear tilt LCD
  6. 24 MP APS-C sensor with 12-16-20 MP "zoom" (crop) feature for quick framing emulating what the current 35mm crop effect does
  7. 28mm lens as now with the same 21mm add-on (but an 18mm equivalent add-on lens would be a stunner)
    Smaller, tilt/swivel external flash option

I think that would complement the Pentax DSLR line nicely sustaining the OVF as an SLR sales draw and creating the EVF and LCD option as a second camera or compact, tough, travel system.

I would have bought a GR by now but the current video quality is sub-par for the price and I shoot enough video for that to matter.

So I hope such a GR is in the works, perhaps for a late 2014 entry.

03-30-2014, 10:35 AM   #485
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What if you had BOTH an optical and an electronic view finder? They could be mounted right next to each other or work on some kind of flip up mechanism inside the ovf.
03-30-2014, 10:43 AM   #486
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QuoteOriginally posted by vimbuza Quote
What if you had BOTH an optical and an electronic view finder? They could be mounted right next to each other or work on some kind of flip up mechanism inside the ovf.
A more practical method would be the Fuji implementation for the X-series.

But those add substantial size, like wight he X100S and the Ricoh GR:

http://j.mp/12mxo5n

The optical path preserved without digital interpolation will always require considerable design real estate.
03-30-2014, 12:06 PM   #487
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
A more practical method would be the Fuji implementation for the X-series.

But those add substantial size, like wight he X100S and the Ricoh GR:

Compare camera dimensions side by side

The optical path preserved without digital interpolation will always require considerable design real estate.
Yep, but if this the price to pay for the 'real thing', I'll pay.
(I'm totally conscious that that real thing I'm talking about is absolutely personnal )
03-30-2014, 03:40 PM - 1 Like   #488
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QuoteOriginally posted by vimbuza Quote
What if you had BOTH an optical and an electronic view finder? They could be mounted right next to each other or work on some kind of flip up mechanism inside the ovf.
Better will be the Pentax Patent with optical finder and a digital overlay finder to have both in one optical system
Nikon has a similar older patent.
Best regards

03-30-2014, 04:15 PM   #489
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Yes, as I learned, the overlay can be of two kinds:
One that dynamically shows clipping areas alone over the normal OVF view, and
A complete EVF overlay.
03-30-2014, 04:20 PM   #490
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
Better will be the Pentax Patent with optical finder and a digital overlay finder to have both in one optical system
Nikon has a similar older patent.
Best regards
Yeah, I was thinking something along the lines of a hybrid overlay of optical and EV...
03-30-2014, 04:55 PM   #491
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
Better will be the Pentax Patent with optical finder and a digital overlay finder to have both in one optical system
Nikon has a similar older patent.
Best regards
Is this an existing patent, or are you speculating? I understand from others here that you're well-connected...

I suspect the current OVF in the K-3 is about as big and bright as we're going to get from an APS-C DSLR, so we'd have to be prepared to lose some brightness with an EVF overlay, which would be a pity. An EVF overlay on a (dare I say it) 35FF DSLR OVF would be a better proposition for those of us who hanker for a better experience. Of course, if the EVF overlay could be mechanically moved away when not needed, that'd be a different matter: it would presumably be at the eyepiece end of the viewfinder, which possibly means that physically sliding it to one side would be the most practical way of doing it. On the other hand, if the light loss could be limited to (say) 5%, none of this would be absolutely necessary.

Nice concept, though.
03-30-2014, 07:22 PM   #492
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As I have heard the same or very similar account, I believe it is inevitable to come — rather sooner than later. Nikon is also into this same game of advancement. I expect nothing but an onslaught of thoroughly evolved DSLRs this coming Fotokina, with EVF overlays, more advanced metering, WiFi support, etcetera. And the FF coming further down the line in Nikon’s and Canon’s lineups.
DSLR bashers will have no idea what struck them.
03-30-2014, 08:43 PM   #493
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Maybe they are putting the final touches on the 645D replacement by marketing it as a "FAFF" sensor based camera: Fuller Area Full Frame.
03-30-2014, 08:45 PM   #494
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QuoteQuote:
I do use Live View for critical focus of stationary objects. Having both is the best solution, and to me any smaller or thinner is not as good as the present Pentax K3.
I agree! What is inivaluable in my way of photography is the possibility of composing a picture through an optical viewfinder without consuming battery. Therefore an 'optical' will always be an advantage to me.
03-30-2014, 09:31 PM   #495
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An optical viewfinder gives you a three point stability in holding the body. Anything long just won't work with holding the body with two hands. For wide or short tele lenses, maybe.

Is there any EVF on the market yet that you can put a 300mm + on it, find and follow a fast moving subject, or try to pick out a small subject in a busy background? It is challenging with a good ovf.
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