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04-20-2008, 05:01 AM   #31
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Very interesting, I agree Tom.

QuoteOriginally posted by Tom Lusk Quote
"Would many of you here would pay the exact same price as a Nikon D300 if the Pentax matched it ounce for ounce on performance?"

I would have, but had to buy a D300 as Pentax has continued to place their emphasis on fashion/landscape photography, and don't seem to have the will or the $$$ to provide anything else.

Life is too short to be continually waiting and hoping they'd get their act together.
As an old film Nikon user, F-401s and all the gear from the late 90's I had form, even so was a hard choice to move. The Pentax K10D was a fine camera, I have thousands of keeper images and had some great lenses including the FA31 L 1.8, and the DA* 50-135 2.8 but...

Low light focusing and speed of focus in general, price of HSM lenses because of demand and lack of accessories such as a ring flash frustrated me.

My penchant for low light macros, wild life and bird shots mixed with candids at functions under less than adequate ambient lighting etc, showed up the main weakness in what was an otherwise excellent camera. Sorry to see it go, but I sold it all and my complaint about the shortage and cost of lenses helped the sale, as I did not lose much in the process.

I now have a D300 and it is a lot to learn, the K10D was more intuitive, but the D300 offers more user control and presets, I have a lot to learn for sure. I have resolved the low light focusing, the fast focus I needed and while I miss the in camera SR, am learning to increase the shutter speed and ISO to compensate.

I have replaced some of my favourite lenses, the Sigma 10-20 EX, Tamron 18-250 Di and Tamron 90 Di Macro 2.8 and added a Sigma EX 30mm 1.4 in place of the FA31 (Not as good for sure but is 1/3 the price). Interesting note, the Tamron 18-250 Di I now have for the Nikon is internal HSM!!, that surprised me as the same lens for the Pentax was not, nor was the DA 18-250 rebadged Tamron. The great new Tamron 17-50 Di II 2.8, Sigma 10-20 EX and 30mm EX also are HSM internal focus motor design.

In place of the Sigma 50-500 Bigma, I have a Nikkor 80-400 VR ED, which is proving to be a fantastic lens, not HSM but way faster than the Pentax focus, and quiet on the Nikon. Nikon lenses are not cheap either, but there are alternatives and I am not hung up on a name.

Added to the mix, an SB-800 Flash and a Sigma EM-140 iTTL Ring Flash for the Tamron 90 Di II.

So all in all, while a traumatic change for sure, I feel comfortable with the lens group selected, and the entire changeover cost me $485 between the sale and purchase of the new gear.

In summary? Why? many personal reasons, my son is a Nikon user and has some neat lenses I can borrow, and the annoying and niggling issues that I could not resolve. I miss the Pentax group, some fine people here whom I regret leaving, but definitely my respect for Pentax and the Pentaxians will remain in force, and I enjoy dropping in to browse.

Phil

04-20-2008, 06:26 AM   #32
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Phil:

It looks as though we made the same move for many of the same reasons. Also, I lucked upon a fellow selling the D300/$800 lens, etc. for $$2000.00- no tax, no shipping. Couldn't pass it up. It had 3 actuations on it!

I haven't sold my Pentax gear yet - still trying to see if any Pentax lens/combo will outperform the D300, but so far it looks like no contest. Based on what I paid for my Pentax gear (some of it years ago), and what I should be able to sell it for, it won't cost anything to have made the move and flesh out all my lens needs. Might even end up with some extra cash. Actually, there are so many lenses to choose from, I really doubt that.

Ken and Kent - the D300's size let's me get a better hold on the body, but those with small hands might need some time to get used to it. The weight increase is noticeable, and may be a factor for some women. The layout, with all the buttons and wheels, makes adjustments easy, once you become familiar with their placement. The only thing I keep having a problem remembering is the lens release button. After 40 years of using Pentax gear, it seems like it's on the wrong side.

The viewfinder is so good I can go back to manual focussing, which I haven't been able to do in a few years. The monitor is incredible. Oops! Better stop the praising before I get banned!

Anyways, Kent, I did pick up an AF-S Nikkor 300 and preliminary shots seem to give better results, all around, than my FA*300, which is a pleasant surprise. I've no way of knowing how much the camera contributes to the results, though.

It would have been nice if Pentax could have produced an equal camera, but I don't think they have the resources. My guess is that Samsung will be putting out good stuff in the near future that they develop themselves, so all is not lost for those with a collection of Pentax glass.

Off to the "Post your Photos" section to post possibly my last Pentax shots.
04-20-2008, 06:33 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom Lusk Quote
It looks as though we made the same move for many of the same reasons. Also, I lucked upon a fellow selling the D300/$800 lens, etc. for $$2000.00- no tax, no shipping. Couldn't pass it up. It had 3 actuations on it!

I haven't sold my Pentax gear yet - still trying to see if any Pentax lens/combo will outperform the D300, but so far it looks like no contest. Based on what I paid for my Pentax gear (some of it years ago), and what I should be able to sell it for, it won't cost anything to have made the move and flesh out all my lens needs. Might even end up with some extra cash. Actually, there are so many lenses to choose from, I really doubt that.

Ken and Kent - the D300's size let's me get a better hold on the body, but those with small hands might need some time to get used to it. The weight increase is noticeable, and may be a factor for some women. The layout, with all the buttons and wheels, makes adjustments easy, once you become familiar with their placement. The only thing I keep having a problem remembering is the lens release button. After 40 years of using Pentax gear, it seems like it's on the wrong side.

The viewfinder is so good I can go back to manual focussing, which I haven't been able to do in a few years. The monitor is incredible. Oops! Better stop the praising before I get banned!

Anyways, Kent, I did pick up an AF-S Nikkor 300 and preliminary shots seem to give better results, all around, than my FA*300, which is a pleasant surprise. I've no way of knowing how much the camera contributes to the results, though.

It would have been nice if Pentax could have produced an equal camera, but I don't think they have the resources. My guess is that Samsung will be putting out good stuff in the near future that they develop themselves, so all is not lost for those with a collection of Pentax glass.

Off to the "Post your Photos" section to post possibly my last Pentax shots.
Yup that D300 sure does stomp the snot out of your K100D... You even try a K20D? Walter gets some amazing shots with it and even BIF which I thought was impossible from what many people have proclaimed over the years.

Oh the FA*300 f4.5 is not going to compete with the Nikkor 300, you're talking apples to oranges. Bargain 300 versus a top Nikon lens????
04-20-2008, 06:37 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Hi everybody.

*snip*
- Good choice of gear
(e.g.: K20D with DA* 50-135mm f/2.8 SDM lens -- first K20D/SDM AF test ever!)
*snip*
This is a bad choice in gear and actually the worst they could have picked.

The focus throw on the 50-135 is probably twice as far as either of the lenses they probably chose for the other cameras. If they wanted a real speed test you have to also consider the focus throw which Canon has by far the shortest throws for their top glass.

04-20-2008, 06:40 AM   #35
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Tom,
Thank you very much for your comments on the D300. Pretty much what I figured. I did pick up an old use nikon D2H to shoot my sports action with. Blazing fast and excellent at tracking. Oh one more thing, Chris, I think Tom was talking about the Nikon AFS 300mm f4.0 lens which actually sells for less than the Pentax DA* 300 f4.0. If you read my original post thats what I asked Tom about.
04-20-2008, 12:51 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by mutley Quote
Oh, Pentax engineers should just take apart a D300 and A700 to see exactly how their autofocus works, and what parts are involved, then just combine and change it enough to avoid copyright issues.
Do you really think algorythms are written by hands on the chips or you're really trolling just as usual ??
04-20-2008, 12:53 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by deejjjaaaa Quote
you do not know what it costs to get AF... you are arbitrary, oh well - in fact intentionally, using "$1000" and "4" to come up
with "$250"... we can as well use "4000" instead of "4" and come up w/ increase of just "$0.25"... the point is - you do not know the cost, you just assuming that it is big... we can
as well assume that Pentax just lacks the skill in AF department

PS: "If you need it in simple terms then." - yes, please... but stop cooking numbers first to suit your needs.
You're goin' a contest with Mutley to know who's the more stupid?
Go buy a D300 and troll on DPR.
04-20-2008, 01:00 PM   #38
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I hate measurebators.

04-20-2008, 01:49 PM   #39
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Here's a bigger picture, longer term, question.
If Pentax doesn't get better/faster focusing to equal Canikon, can
Pentax survive another 5 years?
Third party lenses are coming with HSM, which will help.
They are already a small player in the market.
Will we see 2-3 brands left in 5 years?
I've been wondering this for awhile.
04-20-2008, 02:43 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Film2Digital Quote
If Pentax doesn't get better/faster focusing to equal Canikon, can
Pentax survive another 5 years?
Do you really think a company survival depends on the the AF speed? Are you serious???

K20D AF system is right up with the peers, as shown in this test - only 1 to 2 out of focus shots in each test run; fully expected as most AF tracking takes one to two shots to get up to speed. So where's the problem?

And how many consumers outside this and dpreview forum even care about the minute AF speed difference in their purchase decision? It is plenty fast enough for most people.

Last edited by nosnoop; 04-20-2008 at 02:49 PM.
04-20-2008, 03:33 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
(for some reason, your quoted results are quite different from another users' quote in dpreview, where he said 1DSMkIII came out on top with 94% accuracy).
1DSMkIII (1Ds in my OP) has 14.3% misses (my post) and 18.7% misses with multi AF. Trust me, not dpreview The 94% figure is Canon 40D.

I have added the multi-field results for Nikon D80 though, because those have been significantly better. Canon 40D multi AF is better too, but only by 0.1% difference. All other multi AF are worse.
04-20-2008, 03:43 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by codiac2600 Quote
This is a bad choice in gear and actually the worst they could have picked.
codiac, I admit I don't fully understand your argument.

As for the gear, they used the only 200mm equivalent lens with SDM motor available with Pentax (and luckily there was one!). So what to complain about?
04-20-2008, 04:39 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Film2Digital Quote
Here's a bigger picture, longer term, question.
If Pentax doesn't get better/faster focusing to equal Canikon, can
Pentax survive another 5 years?
Third party lenses are coming with HSM, which will help.
They are already a small player in the market.
Will we see 2-3 brands left in 5 years?
I've been wondering this for awhile.
LOL
How many years have I been hearing that one; Pentax is going to die if they don't have more mega pixels, Pentax is going to die if they don't have long glass blah, blah, blah....

The reality is Pentax is actually growing, there AF system in bright light is right up there with Canikon it is only when you get into low light that the Pentax slows down considerably.

As you state 3rd party lenses are increasingly available, this isn't because they feel sorrow for us poor pentaxians, Sigma, Carl Zeiss et al do their research and see that the Pentax market share has reached a critical mass that makes it a viable proposition to offer lenses in K mount.

Pentax is aimed squarely at the new entry market. This market will do all of their research read all about fast fps, fast AF, Mega pixels etc - then march into the camera store to buy a Nikon D3. Then see the price and walk out with either a Pentax, Olympus a Nikon D40 or a Canon Xsi.

Pentax gets a fair % of this market and it is growing.

The Pentax AF is more than adequate for 99% of the users on this site. If you are a serious sports pro then really you need a camera and lenses that suit - be prepared to spend in the tens of thousands though.
If you are just a wealthy hobbyist though - do what ever makes you happy.

Seriously take a look at the photos in the gallery on this site and on PPG and ask yourself are these photographs so poor due to slow AF in low light.
04-20-2008, 05:08 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom Lusk Quote
Off to the "Post your Photos" section to post possibly my last Pentax shots.
Congrats Tom! This displeases me a great deal. I will miss your photos as well as your posts.

Ken
04-20-2008, 05:29 PM   #45
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Ken,
Amen to that! This is the sad thing about Pentax to me. When a photographer reaches for a higher level Pentax doesn't have the camera there. If the K20 had 6fps and improved af tracking they would have sold more than they did of the K10., and about a dozen photographers that post here and other forums would have stayed with Pentax. I am trying to hold off till this fall to see what happens. I want to keep my Pentax lenses and gear but I had to add a used nikon D2H to do my sports action shots. I just keep hopeing.
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