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04-21-2008, 04:40 PM   #31
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That sucks...

QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Thanks..I promise that I will respond to the best of my knowledge to any queries you have. Look. I didn't make my career by using a brand. It is just a tool for creating an image. A great tool none the less the Pentax is.

Look , between my discussions and conflicts with Carole, Philippe etc. at Pentax France, I had the feeling that they really didn't quite get how to build a myth from a brand. Their creative marketing choices were not credible to my sector. Perhaps with the improvements of the Pentax line there will be more migrations.

My intention was to re-establish the pedigree that was Pentax=Fashion. Not ephemeral but deeply ensconced in Fashion and therefore cutting edge and avant garde.

I was also taken aback by a certain lobbying magazine that placed pressure on Pentax in regards to my rather unconventional approach...That is..."he is actually using a Pentax and coming out of the closet with conviction. That is dangerous." Pentax seems to need the main stream press more than they needed me it seems.

But that is between N-d, myself and and a very P-Pular magazine.

C'est la vie...

Ben
Pentax needs to fix the autofocus issue, IMMEDIATELY, way more than they need to get rid of you, Ben.

Some people are WAY too politically correct, and figure they or their company HAVE to follow the way of others, the easy path. It is really too bad, as they are losing an amazing talent, an innovator, and a great advocate for the brand, inspite of it's lacklustre performance in the recent autofocus test (simply dreadful! I am still shocked.).

Perhaps you're just too outspoken and honest, but that's what we love about you, Benjikan. They were lucky to have you as long as they did.

And as far as getting back to their iconic roots in fashion, the 67 was THE camera in the fashion industry, and was always the camera I personally lusted after; that's why I bought Pentax 35mm stuff, always having in the back of my mind to get one of those. I always wished, as still do, that they would do a digital 67, maybe a quad sensor model (stitch it together with software internally; what's the problem?). You were right in this, from the little you have told us. I once saw a high-end shoot for Toyota, with a model on the beach. He was shooting with a 67, shooting Scala (really ******* expensive) and was blasting away like freaking crazy. Had 3 bodies with identical lenses; 2 helpers, 1 loading cameras continually, the other relaying empty cameras and full ones back and forth. They blasted off at least 20 rolls of the stuff just while I was standing there, same pose, same lighting. No expense spared. I could see why they used the 67 - handled just like an SLR. Fast and efficient, and great big negatives. It would be nice if Pentax could recapture that somehow, but not if they are going to piss off great artists likes you, man. Short sighted and just plain dumb, IMHO.

I've had a few endorsements in the music industry over the years, and while some were good, and just supported me in my work, some were very problematic, troublemsome, meddling, and finicky. I guess yours got to the point where it was more trouble than it was worth.

Sorry about that; I know it hurts a bit, but stay with us, man. We love having you around, like a big brother/mentor.

Cheers,
Cameron


Last edited by Cambo; 04-21-2008 at 05:55 PM.
04-21-2008, 04:56 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by *isteve Quote
So how p-pular is this photography magazine then?
"O" I don't know. "O" I see what you are getting at. It is very P" "PULAR in an ignorant, uninformed, pedestrian, predictable, inane, dumbed down, provincial and fascistic kind of way, if you get my meaning....."How""Ard"uaous this whole thing has been...

Ben

Last edited by benjikan; 04-21-2008 at 05:07 PM.
04-21-2008, 05:25 PM   #33
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The only good thing about that magazine...

QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
"O" I don't know. "O" I see what you are getting at. It is very P" "PULAR in an ignorant, uninformed, pedestrian, predictable, inane, dumbed down, provincial and fascistic kind of way, if you get my meaning....."How""Ard"uaous this whole thing has been...

Ben
unfortunately passed away a few months ago. Now, it totally sucks. Completely, crassly, over-the-top commercialization; half the magazine is ads for schiesters like Broadway and Beach Cameras.

Cheers,
Cameron
04-21-2008, 05:49 PM   #34
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G'day Ben,
Oh well, these things happen along life's great journey, I'm pretty confident that being (or not) sponsored by Pentax or anyone else for that matter will not change the way you work.

Very glad to hear you intend continuing to contribute here as your input is (like your work) of a high quality and I, for one, appreciate that.

Cheers
Grant


Last edited by Mallee Boy; 04-21-2008 at 08:12 PM. Reason: left out word!!
04-21-2008, 06:45 PM   #35
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Thanks Ben, it has been fun having you onboard, and getting an inside to the world of fashion. Best of luck with your future work. Glad to hear you’ll still be around
04-21-2008, 08:45 PM   #36
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Ben, you will be missed by many...

Thanks for all the tips, tweaks and advice you so freely gave out during this phase of your professional life. It is rare that enthusiasts like myself get to rub shoulders with a true pro who is willing to tell it like it is, especially when we are asking for clarification of trade secrets.

I for one learned a lot from your work, and while I may never be in the same segment of the profession as yourself, I admired your skill and appreciated your candour. You added to the richness of the Pentax Forums mosaic of personalities.

Good luck Ben, and thanks

Phil
04-21-2008, 09:20 PM   #37
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Thanks for the tips you gave me when I was starting out Ben (lighting stuff, mostly stupid, basic questions...). But you helped me along this profession I chose... thanks.

Good luck with your freelancing!
04-21-2008, 09:37 PM   #38
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Thanks for the reply, Ben. You're so kind, the only fashion pro i knew who has participated in the forum.
anyway, hope you've the best career!

04-21-2008, 10:01 PM   #39
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Yay!

You guys are so "Glass half empty" Ben, you are FREE to choose How, Where and IF you will do a shoot.

You are all carrying on like he is leaving. Ben, I know you love your Pentax stuff, you have created too many good shots with them to jump ship.

I will take this opportunity to say a few words though, Damn, Bugger, sh#t and "their loss"

I hate it when things are influenced by so called popular opinion when in actual fact it is media manipulation. VHS-Beta is a good example.

As you say, in this case a magazine has applied pressure because of their own agenda (sponsorship, bias)

I am assuming Ben, that your sponsorship didn't determine what jobs were offered to you, that you still receive jobs, but without Pentax (France) equipment support.

By your latest post you have a photo job on NOW, so work is still on going

Al
04-21-2008, 10:07 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Thanks..I promise that I will respond to the best of my knowledge to any queries you have. Look. I didn't make my career by using a brand. It is just a tool for creating an image. A great tool none the less the Pentax is.

Look , between my discussions and conflicts with Carole, Philippe etc. at Pentax France, I had the feeling that they really didn't quite get how to build a myth from a brand. Their creative marketing choices were not credible to my sector. Perhaps with the improvements of the Pentax line there will be more migrations.

My intention was to re-establish the pedigree that was Pentax=Fashion. Not ephemeral but deeply ensconced in Fashion and therefore cutting edge and avant garde.

I was also taken aback by a certain lobbying magazine that placed pressure on Pentax in regards to my rather unconventional approach...That is..."he is actually using a Pentax and coming out of the closet with conviction. That is dangerous." Pentax seems to need the main stream press more than they needed me it seems.

But that is between N-d, myself and and a very P-Pular magazine.

C'est la vie...

Ben
Ah Pentax marketing at it's finest. They have never had any idea how to promote the brand or it's great qualities. If the engineers didn't build some pretty good gear, this line would self destruct. They are loosing a fine advocate. But you have a business to run and sponsorship I'm sure conflicts with that I'm sure.

Good luck in everything you go after Ben. We'll look forward to your future activity here.
04-21-2008, 11:03 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Peacekeeper Quote
I am assuming Ben, that your sponsorship didn't determine what jobs were offered to you, that you still receive jobs, but without Pentax (France) equipment support.

Al
Ben actually answered that in a post a few months ago Al
Although I'm surprised that I actually read and remembered that one.
QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Pentax??? No way...Pentax has zero input in my getting work...

It is through a photo agent, referrals and Gallery agents. The more you get published the greater the notoriety and the greater the notoriety the greater the desirability and the greater the desirability the higher the fees etc etc etc.

Here is the standard process:

The Photo Agent represents the photographer. They are in constant communication with all of the Ad Agencies, Press Agents etc. The process kind of goes like this...

An Ad Agency will have a client and the agency will know what the client budget is for the year for Communications, Media, B to B, B to C etc. The agency will suggest certain marketing solutions to the client. Based on the analysis, decisions will be made as to which solutions best suit the clients' goals. Is it Internet, Press, PLV, Viral, Events, PLV's etc. Once the decision is made and if they decide to do an image related Ad Campaign the next steps follow suit.

There is a briefing by the agency with the commercial side of the clients sector. Based on that the Creative Director and Account Executive will discuss the client needs. Based on the briefing the CD will speak with internal traffic of the Ad Agency to find an Art Director or Director's based on the size of the budget and Copy-writing team to work with the AD. They always work in couples AD & CW. The CD will brief them vaguely to give them a lot of latitude but based on the client briefing. Once a concept is accepted by the agency they present it to the client. If it is accepted the next step follows. An Art Buyer will be shown the layout that was accepted by the client. Based on the style of the layout the Art Buyer will start to contact talent that will be able to fulfill that criteria. She/He will contact the Photographer Agents to call in books of Photographers that might relate to the style being sought. This is the same for Still Life, Autos, Beauty, Fashion, Architecture, Tourism etc.

After looking at several books, three to five are chosen by the agency. These books will go with the CD, AD AE to the client. The AD will generally have a preference and fight for it on occasion. The client has the final say, with some diplomatic coaxing. Now prior to that meeting the AB knew the daily rate of the photographer. This doesn't include royalties.

Once the photographer has been chosen the Photographer and the Photographer Agent will come to the agency to be briefed by the AB, AD and often CD. The AB will ask which team they wish to work with. I.e, Model agency (model or model's), hair, make-up, fashion/beauty stylist, set designer, retoucher, studio, lights etc. The AB will negotiate with the agents of all of the above talent in a similar fashion as was done with the photographer. Dates for the shoot are coordinated and confirmed. On the day of the shoot a team of up to twenty people may be on the set. Agency, Client and Team. Payment is 90 days from presentation of final image..

Hope this was helpful.

Ben
found here

I should probably read more of Ben's posts than I do, since I always either learn something or have a good chuckle from it.
04-22-2008, 12:04 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by matix Quote
Thanks for all the tips, tweaks and advice you so freely gave out during this phase of your professional life. It is rare that enthusiasts like myself get to rub shoulders with a true pro who is willing to tell it like it is, especially when we are asking for clarification of trade secrets.

I for one learned a lot from your work, and while I may never be in the same segment of the profession as yourself, I admired your skill and appreciated your candour. You added to the richness of the Pentax Forums mosaic of personalities.

Good luck Ben, and thanks

Phil
Phil.......Earth to Phil...PHIL...I am not leaving the Forum! I have ended my sponsorship with Pentax and not Pentax Forums.

But Thanks for the heads up though.

Ben
04-22-2008, 12:07 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Peacekeeper Quote
You guys are so "Glass half empty" Ben, you are FREE to choose How, Where and IF you will do a shoot.

You are all carrying on like he is leaving. Ben, I know you love your Pentax stuff, you have created too many good shots with them to jump ship.

I will take this opportunity to say a few words though, Damn, Bugger, sh#t and "their loss"

I hate it when things are influenced by so called popular opinion when in actual fact it is media manipulation. VHS-Beta is a good example.

As you say, in this case a magazine has applied pressure because of their own agenda (sponsorship, bias)

I am assuming Ben, that your sponsorship didn't determine what jobs were offered to you, that you still receive jobs, but without Pentax (France) equipment support.

By your latest post you have a photo job on NOW, so work is still on going

Al
PENTAX never got me a job. I have always been freelance. The only thing that has changed is there are no more free bees. They can't use my stuff to promote their products. As simple as that.

Ben
04-22-2008, 12:28 AM   #44
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Hi Ben,

I can understand a little bit why you ended the sponsorship w/Pentax.
Recently I just posted a thread in the other forum concerning Pentax marketing especially in US.
I don't doubt Pentax products but rather their marketing/management...or else. I'm not sure which but I guess something complicated must be going on inside their company.
Sometimes we as outsiders cannot really see the real reason behind a company's policy until we jumped in and find out ourselves.

BTW, I like the way you made us all here so excited before K20D launch.
You have a good talent to promote things up. Too bad Pentax don't want to listen.
04-22-2008, 12:42 AM   #45
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Ha, call me a Space Cadet will you?

QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Phil.......Earth to Phil...PHIL...I am not leaving the Forum! I have ended my sponsorship with Pentax and not Pentax Forums.

But Thanks for the heads up though.

Ben
Yeah Ben, I know.. and it is good to see, but I was just dropping in to say Hi... and caught the thread. I did make a change, to what some may call, 'the Dark Side..', but would never bad mouth the Pentax or the members. It has been at times painful to change but it is working out for me, so really cannot contribute here anymore except to say Hi.. so, Hi!

Hope to see you around here, or somewhere... maybe in Paris, heading over next year for a while.

Phil, aka Matix
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