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06-01-2008, 11:52 PM   #151
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QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
Hi Anastigmat

Re your statement:



Although I am in general agreement with your sentiments above, past experience has shown that where commercial organisations are concerned, no such concept as cannot exists ! Obviously as far as I am aware, Olympus presently have no immediate plans to enter into the full-frame arena, but where I beg to differ with you is when you said:



...which is PRECISELY what Olympus infamously did a decade or so ago (without the slightest compunction) to their die-hard band of loyal followers, when they ditched the 35mm OM-bayonet lens-mount ! I can personally attest to this treachery, because unfortunately I was one of those adherents !!!! So if you seriously believe that Olympus would never ditch the 4/3rds mount at some time in the future, I fear you may well be mistaken. Naturally for the sake of all current Olympus 4/3rds DSLR users out there, I hope that the 'status quo' remains, but NEVER say never......you have officially been warned !!!

Best regards
Richard
Olympus may of course abandon the 4/3 mount and lenses just as they did the OM mount and lenses. That would not surprise me. Olympus' DSLR division is in the red, so at some point they may call it quits. It would be difficult for Olympus to abandon the 4/3 format and at the same time release a full frame with a new mount, because the existing 4/3 users may not want to risk buying into a new Olympus camera system so soon after their 4/3 lenses became obsolete.

06-02-2008, 12:00 AM   #152
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anastigmat Quote
Olympus may of course abandon the 4/3 mount and lenses just as they did the OM mount and lenses. That would not surprise me. Olympus' DSLR division is in the red, so at some point they may call it quits. It would be difficult for Olympus to abandon the 4/3 format and at the same time release a full frame with a new mount, because the existing 4/3 users may not want to risk buying into a new Olympus camera system so soon after their 4/3 lenses became obsolete.
Duh? all of you have just figured this out.

Give me a reality break.

Common sense is common sense.
06-02-2008, 12:03 AM   #153
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QuoteOriginally posted by proudtoshootpentax Quote
That's the critical question for me... or in this case can you see it? Pentax claims that currently the new sensor's pixels use 40% if their area to gather light. I would say that's room for improvement right there (I know there's a lens in front of each one which also helps). I'm sticking to my belief that in a few years APS-C will come so close to what FF is today that you won't be able to tell the difference. Yes, FF will still continue to get better, but there will come a point when APS-C will more than fill the needs of most people. If you still need more improvement, then perfect the foveon sensor, or Fuji's super pixel sensor. (I'd love to see the latter in a Pentax pro body) There will always be some advantages to FF, but there will always also be some advantages to APS-C, and I think it's been shown that APS-C is capable of producing some incredibly professional looking images.

That is the hope of the APS-C sensor fans, but is it likely to come to pass?

I just saw an interesting article, comparing the 40D with the 5D. Here is what the article concluded:

'It's pretty clear that the EOS 5D delivers the higher resolution, sharper image. Contrast is s little higher and it's quite clear that the 5D image resolves line sets that the 40D image does not. Just compare the "2.8" test pattern in each image. The Siemens star is resolved all the way in to the center in the 5D image, whereas in the 40D image the lines blur towards the center.

The reason for increased sharpness and resolution is twofold. First there are more pixels, though that doesn't account for all the difference. Second, because it's bigger, for a given image view, the sensor is sampling at a slightly lower spatial frequency at the sensor and thus it's seeing a higher MTF from the lens. To put it a less technical way, the lens doesn't have to "work as hard" when it's being used with the larger sensor. The effect is images with more "snap" due to increased resolution and microcontrast. '

BobAtkins.com - Camera and lens Reviews, Canon EOS News, Photographic Optics

Larger individual pixels means that the lens does not have to be as sharp to achieve the same results. That means you would need expensive, sharp optics on an APS-C sensor just to equal the performance of an average lens on a full frame. And since the APS-C sensor will always have the disadvantage of a smaller individual pixel, it will never catch up to the full frame sensor.
06-02-2008, 12:22 AM   #154
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QuoteOriginally posted by WendyB Quote
Duh? all of you have just figured this out.

Give me a reality break.

Common sense is common sense.
Oly stepped in the ripe end of a fresh cow dropping by sticking with this format. To be quite frank they do not quite know how to wipe the defection off their shoes. I do agree that 4/3rds concept was very compelling and a great innovation. Unfortunatly they blindly stuck with it refusing to move forward with the times and innovation.

Whereas Pentax had the state of mind to incorporate a series of lenses with forward
thought that are completely compatible with the product.

Can Cannon Nikon or Olympus make this claim?

Quite frankly Pentax in the terminology of the automotive world is the Honda of all products in the camera world. One does not have to worry about it. It works and works very efficiently and very well.

Just change the oil and I think anyone who is smart can figure out the rest .

Wendy

We are less than 90 days away from FF I know about this. I test them out.

What I find interesting is. No one has asked what mount.


Last edited by WendyB; 06-02-2008 at 12:43 AM.
06-02-2008, 02:25 AM   #155
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OK, what mount?
06-02-2008, 02:55 AM   #156
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Going fullframe and changing the mount so you have to use a new set of lenses?
06-02-2008, 03:19 AM   #157
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Well 3 solutions:

* new mount (but camera also supports K mount)
* K-ount
* 645 FF

Or combination of those of course.
06-02-2008, 04:12 AM   #158
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Hi Wendy

QuoteQuote:
We are less than 90 days away from FF I know about this. I test them out.
Aw, c'mon Wendy, don't be coy.....are you gonna let us in on your l'il 'ol secret and spill the beans or not ? As for changing the mount, if Pentax want to commit commercial suicide, then they can go right on ahead ! Olympus tried it a few years back and I guess their sales figures reveal it hasn't exactly been the roaring success they anticipated !

Best regards
Richard

06-02-2008, 05:50 AM   #159
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QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
Hi Wendy
As for changing the mount, if Pentax want to commit commercial suicide, then they can go right on ahead ! Olympus tried it a few years back and I guess their sales figures reveal it hasn't exactly been the roaring success they anticipated !
Not if the new mount is in addition to the current K-mount. Think at the Leica M: 39mm and M mount. The 39mm are still completely compatible with the Leica M, with coupling etc.
06-02-2008, 05:52 AM   #160
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QuoteOriginally posted by WendyB Quote
What I find interesting is. No one has asked what mount.
OK, what mount?
06-02-2008, 06:21 AM   #161
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
OK, what mount?
Mount Olympus?
Mount Fuji?
Mount St. Helens????
Anyways, if they do "change mounts" it would have to be the 645 mount or stick w/ the old K mount and completely upgrade the interface.
I'd probably not use the 645 due to the large registration distance, but that's just me. Canon shortened there's a long time ago and it was not really easy in terms of engineering. Mirror clearance problems ect. Financially it ended up working for them.
bottom line: New electronic K mount.. I see no nned to change the physical dimensions/lock unless they want to psss people off.
06-02-2008, 08:17 AM   #162
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Would be interesting if Pentax did FF. Not sure I need it though. K20D is pretty good.
I was also abandoned by Olympus going with new mount. Reason I ended up with Pentax digital. Oly finally brought out an adapter so added a few bodies to use my big teles.
Sony dealer told me the 25mp FF hits market this month. He was excited about it. Could get interesting.

Enter POINT & SHOOT CONTEST #7 in P&S forum. Any camera type except slr. Any brand. Any subject. Less than a week to go.
06-02-2008, 08:30 AM   #163
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QuoteOriginally posted by WendyB Quote
Oly stepped in the ripe end of a fresh cow dropping by sticking with this format. To be quite frank they do not quite know how to wipe the defection off their shoes. I do agree that 4/3rds concept was very compelling and a great innovation. Unfortunatly they blindly stuck with it refusing to move forward with the times and innovation.
The 4/3 format was compelling if sensor prices remain high. When a Kodak DSLR with a cropped sensor can cost $20,000, the 4/3 sensor makes sense. In a world in which a full frame DSLR costs less than $2,000, the 4/3 sensor makes no sense.

QuoteOriginally posted by WendyB Quote
Quite frankly Pentax in the terminology of the automotive world is the Honda of all products in the camera world. One does not have to worry about it. It works and works very efficiently and very well.
I think Pentax is more like Subaru than Honda. Honda is a best seller, with a luxury division called Acura, catering to upscale customers. Subaru, OTOH, is reliable, but not as refined as Honda, and Subaru has no upscale division. Pentax cameras are reliable, though not as refined as some of its competitors, and Pentax does not have high end DSLR cameras that can compete with the likes of the Nikon D3 or Canon 1DS.

QuoteOriginally posted by WendyB Quote
We are less than 90 days away from FF I know about this. I test them out.

What I find interesting is. No one has asked what mount.
He he, you did not say we are less than 90 days away from a Pentax FF, so I surmise you may mean that the camera is not a Pentax, so therefore it does not have a Pentax mount. It is early June, so we are indeed less than 90 days away from a Canon 5DMKII FF camera, since Photokina 08 is about 3 months away and Canon is expected to release the 5DMKII by September. Or perhaps the 5DMKII will debut in the Beijing Olympics in August. Everyone assumed that you are talking about a new Pentax mount, but it is unlikely since Pentax cannot possibly have a full frame ready in 90 days.
06-02-2008, 08:42 AM   #164
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anastigmat Quote
...Everyone assumed that you are talking about a new Pentax mount, but it is unlikely since Pentax cannot possibly have a full frame ready in 90 days.
It may very well have been in the works for years, for all we know. It's fun to speculate and all that, but I want results.
06-02-2008, 10:12 AM   #165
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Original Poster
I phoned Pentax and left a message with someone I communicated with often while I was sponsored by them to see if I can garner some info....

Ben
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