[ElJamoquio]

It seems too optimistic (to me) to assume Pentax will get a sensor that no one else has used yet.

Thus far the 24MP sensors have never shown better high ISO than 36MP stuff. So the only benefit would be the buffer size. That isn't worth it IMO, especially when the D610 is selling with (presumably) the same or a similar sensor for less than $2k.

[Sandy Hancock]

Buffer size would be crucial, and I did say 24 *or less*
Needless to say, two high quality, fast, silent AF zooms would also have to appear at the same time....

[robjmitchell]

Pentax has been successful (ie survived) because they were smart enough to carve out some niches where canikon didn't tread. Ie affordable weather sealing, coloured bodies, Q system and least importantly the wonderful ltd lenses! Canikon instead used the tried and tested method of trying to make people feel insecure by claiming bigger is better. Of course now that camera phones have 40 Mp, their P&S feeder marked has dried up and the mirrorless crowd are marketing the virtues of smaller size, the big boys are finding themselves in a pickle!
As much as I would love to connect a sweet FA ltd to a pentax FF body, Pentax would probably make more money producing a weather sealed ultrawide zoom!

[JimmyDranox]

Pentax would better DO something, anything. And more they do, better they will be perceived by current and potential consumers. One DSLR and one lens per year is not enough, in a market where things are moving very fast, in all it's components, and by all their competitors.

[JPT]

I used to think that Ricoh should make a full frame mirrorless system because by the time it has built up into a viable system, mirrorless technology would be taking over.

Then I changed my mind and thought they should just make a Pentax K-mount full frame DSLR camera and lenses because many of those lens would be attractive to APS-C users regardless of how many full frame DSLRs they would sell. I'm thinking fast 24/28/35/50/85 and 70-200. It almost feels like they've been deliberately avoiding some of these focal lengths because they have always a had full frame camera on the drawing board.

Now I think they should do both. It has been very quiet for Ricoh cameras since they effectively gave up on the GXR but the Ricoh interface works really well for small cameras (better than Pentax IMO). If Ricoh designed a mirrorless system aimed at their typical user base, they wouldn't need that many lenses to keep the faithful happy. Something like 21/28/35/50, a M-mount adapter and a K-mount adapter would probably suffice. It would be viable in itself in the short term and a contingency for a future where DSLR sales really did collapse.

At the same time, I think they should press ahead with full frame K-mount. And I think the first model should be like a D810 in terms of spec and price. A 36mp sensor would mean that all those expensive DA* lenses they've been selling as high end would least yield a 15mp image in crop mode. Using a 24mp sensor and sending everyone back to 10mp in crop mode would be a bit of a betrayal to those who invested serious money in lenses in the digital era in my opinion. I also think they'll try to hit more of a mid-point between APS-C and MF with their full frame system, not a point only slightly above the K-3, like the D610 represents.

[rawr]

A D4/1Dx competitor would be a better fit

That would be nice. I've often thought it would be great if Pentax made a camera basically dedicated to sports and action shooting.

While a FF version would be optimal for low-light, they could even do it with an existing camera - eg a K-3 Sports, with a few more AF points spread across more of the frame, some tweaked AF.C behaviour options and tracking algorithms, face detection while in PDAF, improved UI features tuned for action (easier AF point selection, quicker AF mode selection, menu packages for different sports scenarios), deepen the buffer further, dedicate a chip just to do AF, maybe even have a built-in battery grip. Would be awesome.

[Sandy Hancock]

I also would not mind if it were APS-C. Not one bit.

[Ben78]

If a Pentax/Ricoh FF DOES come out at Photokina, Who will buy it and who will wait till next year for version 2.

I will, but unlike the K5 I won't be paying the early adopter tax, nor playing the part of 'sensor beta tester'. I have no need for FF, just 'want'.

[Mistral75]

Please. We've been over that ground. A company is its traditions and its employees. I don't care who owns it or what the name is, the company is Pentax.

I totally agree with "A company is its traditions and its employees" but there is no such thing as a 'Pentax' company any more. 'Pentax' is a mere brand name used, among others, by the Ricoh Imaging company and its local subsidiaries.

Which doesn't subtract anything from Pentax-branded products, of course. Nor does it add anything to them.

[Daikokuya]

It's kinda trivial argument, though I find it interesting in terms of Japan's business culture. I'm sure most employees in the current Ricoh Imaging are from the former Pentax. As long as you keep a job in Ricoh Imaging, you end up being there until retirement. No transfer between Ricoh's other sections and Ricoh Imaging. I'm not in an inner circle, but I'm sure about it. That's the way Japanese companies operate. So, Ricoh Imaging guys would keep Pentax mind for so long, resisting or at least hesitating to call themselves as a member of Ricoh. Some says that it takes at least 10 years for a Japanese company to be in full harmony with another. A CEO may come from Ricoh, but a daily operation would be very much like the way Pentax has done so far.

Just my rambling.

[Mistral75]

It's kinda trivial argument, though I find it interesting in terms of Japan's business culture. I'm sure most employees in the current Ricoh Imaging are from the former Pentax. As long as you keep a job in Ricoh Imaging, you end up being there until retirement. No transfer between Ricoh's other sections and Ricoh Imaging. I'm not in an inner circle, but I'm sure about it. That's the way Japanese companies operate. So, Ricoh Imaging guys would keep Pentax mind for so long, resisting or at least hesitating to call themselves as a member of Ricoh. Some says that it takes at least 10 years for a Japanese company to be in full harmony with another. A CEO may come from Ricoh, but a daily operation would be very much like the way Pentax has done so far.

Just my rambling.

No rambling but interesting thoughts, thank you.

[Class A]

I believe that more than 10% of Pentax DSLR users will buy a FF camera.

I wouldn't want to speculate about percentages, but I'd be happy to bet on the fact that Pentax will sell more FF cameras than copies of the Pentax DA 560mm f/5.6 ED AW.

If a 560/5.6 for $7000 makes sense in terms of sales volume then surely an FF camera will.

[MMVIII]

Hoya did the same with K-7 and 645D.

Pentax did the same with Mz-5 and 645NII, and beforw that... That is exactly what they do and therefore the 645 line always attracted people stepping up from 35mm for higher IQ and keeping usability and costs still acceptabe, especially in comparison to their peers in this field.

[Kunzite]

I totally agree with "A company is its traditions and its employees" but there is no such thing as a 'Pentax' company any more. 'Pentax' is a mere brand name used, among others, by the Ricoh Imaging company and its local subsidiaries.

What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

Does it matter that Pentax Ricoh Imaging Company was renamed Ricoh Imaging? Or that it's Pentax on the inside? Same people (fewer, Hoya took care of that), same product philosophy...
How could we say it's no longer Pentax because of a mere name change?

By the way, during Hoya it was Pentax Imaging Systems. I think you're a bit hasty to declare their nonexistence

[RonHendriks1966]

A D4/1Dx competitor would be a better fit, as this is an area nothing in the Pentax range currently covers. High burst speed, great high ISO capability, lowish (24 or less) megapixels, snappy autofocus, big viewfinder, tethering and decent video.

If such a camera were to come in a K-3+ sized package, and cost < $4000, it would make a BIG splash at Photokina. Maybe in 2016

Buffer size would be crucial, and I did say 24 *or less*
Needless to say, two high quality, fast, silent AF zooms would also have to appear at the same time....

That would be nice. I've often thought it would be great if Pentax made a camera basically dedicated to sports and action shooting.

We all want something and mostly something different.

• I think it would be great if the K-3 body was used for the Full Frame camera. Some changes, but not bigger (except for the viewfinder).
• Using the same grip as the K-3 uses, D-BG5. (loyalty to your customers and not milking them)
• Same for the battery, D-Li90.
• It would be great to use the 16 megapixel sensor from D4s/Df. It has plenty enough pixels.
• We don't get it all new, since developement is to expensive and we can't have the 645Z being the lame old tech camera.
• So the same 25 AF point module, PRIME III engine (with just 16 mp it would be snappy fast), metering and all that. (probably even the FluCard )
• Looking at the capability's of the sensor, keeping the 8,3 fps as in the K-3 is possible. Not yet the big sportscamera (D4s/1Dx), but a very capable one.
• Team up with Sigma and get some lenses. The 120-300mm/f2.8 is crusial for this to be any kind of action camera.
• Some new lenses, 24-75mm/f2.8 and 70-200mm/f2.8 (or so). A collapsable kitzoomlens (make it small like those fancy mirrorless, 30-60mm/f2.8-4.0).

And on the price. Well it has to be cheaper then Df. That is out of the league when you want to cater a large groupe of current K-mount users.