[monochrome]

The tilting screen is also easy enough to implement, but they just haven't decided to do it. Perhaps the weather sealing issue was part of the reason. Perhaps they didn't see the demand for it.

It's on the 645Z and there have been a few hints it will be on the FF*.



* I know absolutely nothing - just a guy in Missouri, but this is what I imagine.

* I think of the FF as a 645Z Jr. - my bet is dual processors, dual bus, dual cards - a FAST camera - hinged LCD, OVF with an overlay, Wi-Fi, different form factor from a traditional dSLR, massively weather sealed, awesome IQ for FF -- a different FF.

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Last edited by monochrome; 11-10-2014 at 08:21 PM.

[clackers]

The tilting screen is also easy enough to implement, but they just haven't decided to do it. Perhaps the weather sealing issue was part of the reason.

I thought I read an interview where they were proud of the WR tilt screen on the 645Z.

[JPT]

I thought I read an interview where they were proud of the WR tilt screen on the 645Z.

Yes. That's what I was referring to. They implied that WR had been the reason they had stayed away from tilt screens before, but that now they had solved the issue.

[kadajawi]

It's on the 645Z and there have been a few hints it will be on the FF*.



* I know absolutely nothing - just a guy in Missouri, but this is what I imagine.

* I think of the FF as a 645Z Jr. - my bet is dual processors, dual bus, dual cards - a FAST camera - hinged LCD, OVF with an overlay, Wi-Fi, different form factor from a traditional dSLR, massively weather sealed, awesome IQ for FF -- a different FF.

But unlike the Canon processors Milbeaut doesn't seem to support dual processors. It wasn't designed for that. So I doubt that will happen. Your specs do sound good.


I think they really may do that testing thing, however that only means that the "proper" camera will take even longer to get a feature. When will the K-3 be replaced? Another year or two? So if the test camera gets the feature too late, it will be the generation AFTER the replacement of the K-3 that will get it. By that point competitors' cameras will be sci-fi already... Some competitors, like Samsung and Sony are used to a much faster release cycle. Just look at how fast Samsung is spewing out phones. The NX1 is supposed to get a relative pretty soon.

[gazonk]

SR noise does not have to be filtered. Those who care about audio will record externally, those who don't won't notice. They can put in a warning that audio might be affected by the SR. That's all.

Is it really only because of noise that they dropped it on the K-3? I'm so happy with the SR in video on the K-5. I'm not using video a lot, but when I do, I always use a Røde mic. The built in microphone is so bad that SR noise or not is pretty irrelevant. They should have kept hardware SR as an option for those who use external mics!

[Aristophanes]

If Ricoh was going to experiment with EVF technology Q would be the line to do it on.

The Ricoh GXR has EVF option.

[kadajawi]

Is it really only because of noise that they dropped it on the K-3? I'm so happy with the SR in video on the K-5. I'm not using video a lot, but when I do, I always use a Røde mic. The built in microphone is so bad that SR noise or not is pretty irrelevant. They should have kept hardware SR as an option for those who use external mics!

That is the official explanation. I know! It's a minor issue that can be easily worked around, and for THAT they give up an excellent feature?! That's why I'm so infuriated. Had they asked their customers, those who care a bit about video, this would have been the reply. Give us the option... don't force it down our throat, but how hard can it be to offer more than one stabilization option?

[Mikesul]

But unlike the Canon processors Milbeaut doesn't seem to support dual processors. It wasn't designed for that. So I doubt that will happen. Your specs do sound good.
.

But why would they have to use the current Milbeaut? Might that processor not be improved or modified?

[kadajawi]

But why would they have to use the current Milbeaut? Might that processor not be improved or modified?

Sure Fujitsu is improving it, but they are quite slow. Canon is too, but their architecture lets them scale up quite easily. Giving those capabilities to the Milbeaut may not be trivial. Canon had that for ages, yet Milbeaut never gained that feature. Maybe they'd have to start from scratch, who knows. Btw., IIRC during a teardown of the 7D II an ASIC chip was noticed... so they might try to stretch the functionality of their DIGIC that way.

Samsung is developing their own chips and have plenty of experience in making some of the fastest there are. Sony might be doing their own... at least I don't know any other chip with similar capabilities.

To be honest in terms of video the latest Milbeaut as used by Nikon with some firmware tweaks to get it to Nikon level and add SR would satisfy me, in terms of stills too. I'm not that demanding. But that doesn't stop them from lagging behind the consumer electronic giants.

[reh321]

But why would they have to use the current Milbeaut? Might that processor not be improved or modified?

The company has only so much money to spend on R&D and only so much in-house technical resources (no, these aren't the same statements, because they might be out-sourcing some R&D work). They'll have to decide which investments are most likely to provide the most bang for the buck (or yen). Unfortunately, they can't satisfy all of us simultaneously; I can only hope that my priorities end up near the top of the list.

[Mikesul]

The company has only so much money to spend on R&D and only so much in-house technical resources (no, these aren't the same statements, because they might be out-sourcing some R&D work). They'll have to decide which investments are most likely to provide the most bang for the buck (or yen). Unfortunately, they can't satisfy all of us simultaneously; I can only hope that my priorities end up near the top of the list.

Good answer! The reasoning may also be part of the explanation for the lack of emphasis on video.

---------- Post added 11-11-14 at 06:24 AM ----------

Sure Fujitsu is improving it, but they are quite slow. Canon is too, but their architecture lets them scale up quite easily. Giving those capabilities to the Milbeaut may not be trivial. Canon had that for ages, yet Milbeaut never gained that feature. Maybe they'd have to start from scratch, who knows. Btw., IIRC during a teardown of the 7D II an ASIC chip was noticed... so they might try to stretch the functionality of their DIGIC that way.

Samsung is developing their own chips and have plenty of experience in making some of the fastest there are. Sony might be doing their own... at least I don't know any other chip with similar capabilities.

To be honest in terms of video the latest Milbeaut as used by Nikon with some firmware tweaks to get it to Nikon level and add SR would satisfy me, in terms of stills too. I'm not that demanding. But that doesn't stop them from lagging behind the consumer electronic giants.

Interesting observations. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[monochrome]

That is the official explanation. I know! It's a minor issue that can be easily worked around, and for THAT they give up an excellent feature?! That's why I'm so infuriated. Had they asked their customers, those who care a bit about video, this would have been the reply. Give us the option... don't force it down our throat, but how hard can it be to offer more than one stabilization option?

I'm quite certain Ricoh would welcome your engineering expretise as part of their video develoment team.

[Mikesul]

I have no inside information or engineering expertise. But I am a long term user of Pentax and other camera equipment and a confessed gadget geek. For some time I have wondered if the introduction of the Sony A7 and A7R had any impact on the release of a Pentax FF. Prior to the Sony release I had speculated that the "very special, very unique" offering Pentax execs had hinted at might be a full frame, light weigh, weather sealed, k-mount, mirrorless camera. Since Pentax has used Sony sensors recently Sony's plans might have delayed the Pentax introduction. About the only thing that would draw me to FF any time soon would be for Pentax to release a K-mount, stabilized equivalent (improved with Pentax features, of course) of the A7R.

[monochrome]

I have no inside information or engineering expertise. But I am a long term user of Pentax and other camera equipment and a confessed gadget geek. For some time I have wondered if the introduction of the Sony A7 and A7R had any impact on the release of a Pentax FF. Prior to the Sony release I had speculated that the "very special, very unique" offering Pentax execs had hinted at might be a full frame, light weigh, weather sealed, k-mount, mirrorless camera. Since Pentax has used Sony sensors recently Sony's plans might have delayed the Pentax introduction. About the only thing that would draw me to FF any time soon would be for Pentax to release a K-mount, stabilized equivalent (improved with Pentax features, of course) of the A7R.

i believe asahi man says it is a dSLR and I've heard direct statements myself to that effect (not that I know anything).

[kadajawi]

I'm quite certain Ricoh would welcome your engineering expretise as part of their video develoment team.

Though I wouldn't mind working at Pentax, I'd be asking actual professional videographers and cinematographers for feedback... which is what they should have done in the first place.


The workaround is simple: Attach a bloody external microphone! People do that all the time if they want to use their DSLR for video, because the built in microphone just isn't good (and I have the feeling that the weather sealing on my K-5 means it is even worse than that of competitors). Once you do attach an external microphone, which people who care about audio tend to do, the noise the SR system makes goes away, it won't be picked up. That's why Pentax provides a microphone jack.


A minor audio quality issue (noise thanks to SR) leads to a big image quality issue (image quality getting f***ed up by the electronic SR) and at least the removal of a really useful feature. They should just ignore the noise, warn us about it, and give the option to record video with mechanical SR... it's that simple.


As for MJPEG... I have the impression they have left it away because it SOUNDS outdated... they were a bit belittled for only providing MJPEG when everyone else was doing h264 in one way or another. That the actual MJPEG quality was much better than h264 doesn't matter... The inclusion of h264 is understandable and desireable, but the removal of the MJPEG option isn't. It's as if they had left away the option of saving raw files for stills, because raws take up more space. Yes, they do, but the quality of them is better.


The K-3 suffers from a bit of a split personality. It wants to be taken serious for video with the inclusion of a headphone jack and manual gain control (both very good features that bring the camera ahead of some competitors), but then doesn't give options that would be useful to people too, and that had been there before.