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08-28-2014, 10:24 AM   #1036
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I'll bet this camera is made for Asia, which (I think) is the principle Ricoh consumer market.
That was one issue I had with the "shirtless" video - none of those happy young people using their K-S1 looked Japanese.

That, and the fact that it actually appeared to be an advertisement for a Pentax camera. Now I have to believe in unicorns...

08-28-2014, 10:27 AM   #1037
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While I am intrigued by what Ricoh is trying to do with the KS-1, the target market would likely respond to internal WiFi and a flip screen more than AA filter simulator? I may pick up a body in 1 year once the price hits $400 as it may be a great backpacking camera since it is so small and light. Also, I can't wait to find out how the 20 MP sensor performs. The one trend I like with the KS-1 is getting the body smaller. While Pentax has had small DSLRs in the past (ist D, Kx), the size has been creeping up with each new model.

Dale
08-28-2014, 10:28 AM - 1 Like   #1038
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
  1. From what I hear the target market has moved on from Instagram nd Facebook (fastest growing demo in both is women over 54)
  2. From what I hear the target market has moved on from touchscreen for photos since a fingertip is about as precise as a bludgeon
  3. WR - is that a real 'Want' or just something WE think THEY want
Really - are you a member of the target group (I freely admit I am not).

The way I view this, nearly every single objection I have heard is from Western people who don't see the things they want in a new camera, but purport to speak for other people and the camera not having the things they think other people will want in the camera.

I'll bet this camera is made for Asia, which (I think) is the principle Ricoh consumer market.
From what I can observe, that target market has not moved on from shopping at Best Buy which is precisely where you can't find a Pentax camera. I could better understand what Ricoh is doing here had they coincidentally announced a marketing agreement with a retailer that caters to the target market for this camera. What's the point of appealing to 20-somethings if they can't find your camera in the places where they're buying their cameras?
08-28-2014, 10:29 AM   #1039
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QuoteOriginally posted by jimr-pdx Quote
Good to know I will not have very many of you lining up to borrow mine.
You can drop by and show it to me when you get it, me being just down the road and all...


Steve

08-28-2014, 10:31 AM   #1040
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QuoteOriginally posted by THoog Quote
Now I have to believe in unicorns...
Unicorns are food.

---------- Post added 08-28-14 at 02:32 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by DDoram Quote
While I am intrigued by what Ricoh is trying to do with the KS-1, the target market would likely respond to internal WiFi and a flip screen more than AA filter simulator?
Bingo!

You win the jackpot for having the absolute correct answer. Why Pentax is ignoring these two, unstoppable trends is bizarre. I will not update my system until I see these.
08-28-2014, 10:43 AM - 1 Like   #1041
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kharan Quote
I don't care for Pentax is doomed, but do you really think that things are fantastic right now in Pentax's lineup?
I dunno...my K-3 still has its new camera smell and I shot for seven years before that with a K10D. My lens needs are well-covered (fancy that). I am not shopping.

Would I buy a K-S1 if I were in the market? Hell no! I have huge hands and think the K-50 is a far better value. Will the camera sell well? As noted many times on this thread, there is a wide variance in taste world wide. The camera is a nicely-spec'd and over-priced upgrade over the K-500.

Is there something dreadfully wrong with the Pentax lineup? If you ignore the lack of a FF camera and a larger-format mirrorless, the lineup is pretty good. Add in the projected 70-200/2.8 and things look better. With stronger marketing things might look better, but what do I know. I am not looking to buy anything.


Steve

---------- Post added 08-28-14 at 10:45 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I'll bet this camera is made for Asia, which (I think) is the principle Ricoh consumer market.
Yep, I am not clear why it is being released in the Americas or Europe.


Steve

---------- Post added 08-28-14 at 10:47 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by WillWeaverRVA Quote
And yes, it will be supremely difficult to market a real camera to that age group.
There is a significant number of members of this site that fall into the "under 30yrs" age group and even quite a few that are still in high school.


Steve
08-28-2014, 10:49 AM   #1042
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
From what I can observe, that target market has not moved on from shopping at Best Buy which is precisely where you can't find a Pentax camera. I could better understand what Ricoh is doing here had they coincidentally announced a marketing agreement with a retailer that caters to the target market for this camera. What's the point of appealing to 20-somethings if they can't find your camera in the places where they're buying their cameras?
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yep, I am not clear why it is being released in the Americas or Europe.


Steve
I have been intensely contrary the last few days - i fully admit it - because this feels just like the pre-release phase of the K-01 and I think we helped kill an imperfect but decent camera before it even was released. I hope that doesn't happen again.

However, one of my very first reactions (I can't even find the post now) was something along the lines of, "Nice camera. I think they'll sell a lot of them in Asia. Not so sure about the US unless they get them in Target, Costco and BestBuy - and what's the chance of that if they don't support the sell-through with advertising?"

Frankly if I were Ricoh I would punt 'Americas' altogether and come back later, like Fiat has - maybe after buying another company and cannibalizing their distribution agreements.

There's a small part of me that wants to know the USA share of FF cameras in the global total - if it is comparatively significantly larger than APSc then we know why Pentax doesn't have a FF.
08-28-2014, 10:52 AM   #1043
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kenntak Quote
That really seems to be a jump to a conclusion. Are you saying people in that age group are not interested ins DSLRs? I know quite a few who are.
I'm not saying they're not interested. I'm considering whether or not a DSLR designed for a demographic that doesn't own DSLR's, by and large, is a good idea or a bad idea.

---------- Post added 08-28-14 at 10:53 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
I bought my first DSLR (Kx) when I was 33
Mine was a K200D, when I was 33.

---------- Post added 08-28-14 at 10:54 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
Target market sounds like marketing BS to me.
Me too.

08-28-2014, 10:58 AM   #1044
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Unicorns are food.

08-28-2014, 10:59 AM - 1 Like   #1045
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
What a long, long way we are from something called photography and the notion of "I love photography and this camera is just made for me." Need to get back to that, for folks of any age, imho. The notion that you'll buy a camera just because it's sky-blue and not because you value it as a good camera is pretty insulting whether someone is 16 or 66, I think.
Look at the specs. It's a damn good camera.
08-28-2014, 11:02 AM   #1046
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
Look at the specs. It's a damn good camera.
All the current DSLRs are good cameras. This one seems expensive relative to the competition.

Last edited by luftfluss; 08-28-2014 at 11:15 AM.
08-28-2014, 11:09 AM   #1047
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
You can drop by and show it to me when you get it, me being just down the road and all...

Steve
Yeah I hopped from just south to just north of you Pentax party in Kalama soon!!

Those crazy Irish, suggesting that they leave the Red Deer but slaughter the unicorns!
So says seamus o'raghellaigh
08-28-2014, 11:26 AM   #1048
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I have been intensely contrary the last few days - i fully admit it - because this feels just like the pre-release phase of the K-01 and I think we helped kill an imperfect but decent camera before it even was released. I hope that doesn't happen again.

However, one of my very first reactions (I can't even find the post now) was something along the lines of, "Nice camera. I think they'll sell a lot of them in Asia. Not so sure about the US unless they get them in Target, Costco and BestBuy - and what's the chance of that if they don't support the sell-through with advertising?"

Frankly if I were Ricoh I would punt 'Americas' altogether and come back later, like Fiat has - maybe after buying another company and cannibalizing their distribution agreements.

There's a small part of me that wants to know the USA share of FF cameras in the global total - if it is comparatively significantly larger than APSc then we know why Pentax doesn't have a FF.
Ricoh has the same problem as Olympus but worse (in the USA). The PEN series has struggled because those who are most likely to buy them can't find them in the places where they shop. By contrast, the OMD series has been a hit quite likely because their target audience largely shops in very big camera stores which, for the most part, all carry Olympus.

If Ricoh wants to truly succeed in the western world, they need to get a better handle on coordinating the product development with their retailing strategies and efforts. Often getting one right and the other wrong is not much better than not doing anything.
08-28-2014, 11:34 AM   #1049
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
Ricoh has the same problem as Olympus but worse (in the USA). The PEN series has struggled because those who are most likely to buy them can't find them in the places where they shop. By contrast, the OMD series has been a hit quite likely because their target audience largely shops in very big camera stores which, for the most part, all carry Olympus.

If Ricoh wants to truly succeed in the western world, they need to get a better handle on coordinating the product development with their retailing strategies and efforts. Often getting one right and the other wrong is not much better than not doing anything.
What really makes that annoying is both companies make outstanding, different cameras and wonderful lenses - and so few buyers ever have a chance to appreciate them.*


*Full Disclosure: I have owned only Olympus and Pentax cameras and lenses, both bought new and used.
08-28-2014, 11:57 AM   #1050
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QuoteOriginally posted by ElJamoquio Quote
Who is the target market? The target demographic?

I think it's tough to convince 25-35 year old people to purchase a camera... when they already have on on their phone.
QuoteOriginally posted by WillWeaverRVA Quote
If the video is any indication, their target market seems to be the 18-24 category. And yes, it will be supremely difficult to market a real camera to that age group.
Well those two categories and maybe even a little the 14-18 years group is clearly the target for this model. If they manage to sell 300.000 of these K-S1's over the coming periode then the camera is a huge succes. This will be (when succesfull) the best selling camera with K-mount between now and x-mas 2015 (expect some new colors in a few periodes).
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