Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
08-29-2014, 10:36 PM   #1201
ogl
Pentaxian
ogl's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,247
QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
I really want more info about the sensor. Bit depth, dynamic range? And just general impressions, some sensors have decent specs but were never liked very much. There are many more properties to a sensor than just MP
Tests and reviews for the camera Sony A5000 - DxOMark

http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Sony-A5000-versus-Pentax-K-5-II___929_829

08-30-2014, 12:58 AM - 1 Like   #1202
Pentaxian
mecrox's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Oxford, UK
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 2,115
QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
Complaints about the price are really overdone. The price is only marginally more than the K-50 and it has clearly had a lot of R&D put into it. I also think it will be aimed at people who buy the limited lenses and if you are prepared that much money on lenses, you are probably prepared to pay a bit more to get a high-quality body.
That's an extremely good point. But I wonder. The Limiteds strike me as very traditional in their design, very Japanese in fact since they are carefully distinguished one from another by elements of design which are sometimes quite intricate (such as their hoods and lens caps). They are like netsuke. The choice of material - bare metal - is also very traditional. The design of the K-S1 with its ultra-modern cues, polycarbonate skin and LEDs is completely different from this approach. I don't think the two go together aesthetically, in fact I think they clash, though I realize this is subjective and in any event no criticism of the K-S1. The two are simply different. A Pentax take on a Leica (though still a small DSLR) would be more in line with the Limiteds. One can say that view is old-fashioned but given the price of these little lenses, who but older folks with some spare cash could ever afford them? These are not the gen-X folks the K-S1 is apparently intended for, to judge from Pentax's own publicity material. A newly made "plastic fantastic" line like the recent DA 35mm f2.4 would be a different matter, perhaps - affordable and much closer in design to the K-S1. Ricoh's reearch would probably indicate to them whether customers for the K-S1 are the type of folks who buy prime lenses at all. It may all be gen-Zoom these days.

I think the issue with the price is that while the KS-1 is in many ways a mid-level camera under the surface with many fine technical specifications, it looks more like an entry-level camera on the outside. The three things missing are a tilt-swivel LCD, onboard wifi and a touchscreen*. One can say this doesn't matter and perhaps in Asia and Japan it won't - Ricoh must have done their research again - but I suspect that in the West where tastes are different it will act as a hefty drag on the sticker price. if the K-S1 isn't really intended so much for the West, that may not matter so much.

*Moving the controls to a flat plane at the back of the camera in a smartphone style presupposes that many users will be holding the camera at arm's length and using the rear LCD as their VF. In that event, the logic is to go the whole way and implement a touch screen rather than stop half-way. After all, the interface of the rear LCD with its picture of a control dial on the right-hand side looks as if it should be touch-sensitive. That may well be what a lot of folks expect when first they see it. Interestingly, the Pentax USA publicity video shows a user holding the camera in just this fashion. Perhaps Ricoh will have something to say about this at Photokina. If they have deliberately rejected this approach, it would be interesting to know why.

Last edited by mecrox; 08-30-2014 at 01:19 AM.
08-30-2014, 02:11 AM   #1203
Veteran Member
theperception2008's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Łódź, Poland and Riverside, California, U.S.A
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 488
Also remember that Sony sensors tend to score a few points lower then when used by Pentax. Look at the Nex 6 which uses an identical sensor as the K-5II. If the trend holds true, the K-S1 should be equal to the K5II or even edge it out by a few points.
08-30-2014, 02:31 AM   #1204
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,323
QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
*Moving the controls to a flat plane at the back of the camera in a smartphone style presupposes that many users will be holding the camera at arm's length and using the rear LCD as their VF.
That would defeat the purpose of buying a DSLR.

The new interface is not designed to be used just like a smartphone; but to be more familiar (than a "classic" DSLR) and less intimidating so it won't turn people away. It appears quite intuitive, too. It's not like Pentax had to go all the way and launch another Android failure-of-a camera.

08-30-2014, 02:54 AM - 3 Likes   #1205
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Gladys, Virginia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 16,216
You all are being silly. First of all, this is not for forumites. That is to say, this will not be primary camera for people who like larger SLRs, need the fastest frame rate, deepest buffers, etc. This is for new users, hopefully some who don't currently use Pentax cameras, that will grow the base. Second, I think the camera is targeted more at the Asian market, rather than the North American market. Not to say folks won't buy it here, but Pentax just doesn't have a great presence (in the US anyway) here, whereas they have a lot more presence in Asia. I think they have a better feel for what will sell in Japan than I do. Finally, the price will come down relatively quickly, depending on the initial sales. It can easily sell for similar price to the K50 and still turn a profit. It is just easier to launch a camera with a little higher price tag and drop it if the demand isn't there than to release it too low and feel like you under priced it.

Re-releasing the same cameras with tweaks of features is not enough to grow the brand. That's what Nikon does with the D5x00 line and the differences between the cameras are pretty small. Pentax did that with the K30 to K50 launch. This camera is different enough from other cameras out there that it could be a good seller and definitely will stand out. That's what Ricoh is aiming at with this camera in my opinion.
08-30-2014, 02:56 AM   #1206
Veteran Member
VisualDarkness's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,441
QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
I just realized there are a lot more young 20 somethings that like to have a good time in the pool than there are professional photographers in the world. Maybe Ricoh already knows that....................
After spending the last week playing around as a mentor (and a photographer) during a student orientation week I can see way more people buying the K-S1 simplicity and cutting edge design rather than my big advanced K-5's. Most people don't take photos to make a photography career, most do it to encapsulate wonderful memories with the people they love around them.

I'm not a selfie person but most of the people around me are. Most students only takes pics of themselves or of themselves in a group of friends and got no real joy photographing random people or things around them. One of the main questions I got when shooting during the week was "Do you have any pics of yourself? Should I take one of you?" because that is how people view photography, the joy of keeping memories of yourself in fun situations.

I on the other hand get more joy from documenting and observing external things and others than myself, so for me it's not a problem not to be in a picture. But the trend is going away from that and most don't view photography as a tool to capture the external, they view it as a tool to capture themselves and their friends.
08-30-2014, 05:02 AM   #1207
Pentaxian
Na Horuk's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Slovenia, probably
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 10,862
QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
Tests and reviews for the camera Sony A5000 - DxOMark Sony A5000 versus Pentax K-5 II - Side by side camera comparison - DxOMark
So the new 20MP sensor basically performs about the same as the K-50, only a little more MP.
08-30-2014, 05:08 AM   #1208
Site Supporter
Zygonyx's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Ile de France
Posts: 3,068
... and no AA filter + anti A in-bodied.


I agree with those who do think this product has quite not the same target as K-50, actually it compares barely :
- K50 is for enthusiasts / experts using the Advanced ergonomy with either need of WR, + eventually they like strong colours on traditionnal-shaped SLR (actualy i do believe this isea to colour the K50 was not so sucessfull)
- K-S1 is less experts and for younger / more feminine users that will appreciate the new design and interface, in a more "urban" environment.


Last edited by Zygonyx; 08-30-2014 at 05:14 AM.
08-30-2014, 06:00 AM   #1209
Junior Member




Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 33
Not quite sure what to make of this one.... Yet.

I would prefer to have much better image quality than be a "Hey look at me i am all stylish" which seems to be the attempt at marketing this model. No top lcd, button placement is dubious much like the fuji x-s/t1. I didn't see an " official " spec stating it being weather sealed for either the camera and or kit lens, however it probably is.

I'l wait for a few decent sample photos and actually handling it before making any decisions.

For the time being the k-5 II/IIs seems the better choice, or on the lower end or at least the more point & shoot of the K-30/50.

Last edited by Chippedoff; 08-30-2014 at 06:03 AM. Reason: updating
08-30-2014, 06:16 AM   #1210
Pentaxian
thibs's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Photos: Albums
Posts: 5,260
QuoteOriginally posted by KX5 Quote
Because the SMC Pentax-DA 18-55mm F3.5-5.6 AL II has been abandoned for many years and we don't know yet if the new 18-55mm II SMC DA ED will be the same opticaly (no cosmetic change with the actual DA-L version on k-s1 pictures).
What new 18-55mm II SMC DA ED ?
08-30-2014, 06:16 AM   #1211
Pentaxian
johnmflores's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somerville, NJ
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 5,185
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The new interface is not designed to be used just like a smartphone; but to be more familiar (than a "classic" DSLR) and less intimidating so it won't turn people away. It appears quite intuitive, too. It's not like Pentax had to go all the way and launch another Android failure-of-a camera.
Exactly. And when you take a step back and think about it, a mode dial on the top of a camera without a top LCD display doesn't make a whole lot of sense, it's just that we've all gotten use to it there.

QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
... and no AA filter + anti A in-bodied.


I agree with those who do think this product has quite not the same target as K-50, actually it compares barely :
- K50 is for enthusiasts / experts using the Advanced ergonomy with either need of WR, + eventually they like strong colours on traditionnal-shaped SLR (actualy i do believe this isea to colour the K50 was not so sucessfull)
- K-S1 is less experts and for younger / more feminine users that will appreciate the new design and interface, in a more "urban" environment.
True, and that's not to say that the K-S1 won't be used to take serious photos as the specs look quite promising and up to the task. After all, my publisher never asks me whether or not I use a black DSLR or a fancy-pants one. They just want publishable results, like this, taken with the K-01:



If I didn't have a K-5 to back up my K-3, the K-S1 would certainly be a contender for second camera.
08-30-2014, 06:38 AM   #1212
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 341
This camera is meant to attract cell phone shooters, so let's talk about what would attract cell phone shooters to upgrade, and what wouldn't. My contention is that a dedicated SLR should do everything a cell phone camera does, and better. But that's not always the case, is it?

When I was travelling a few months ago, there were a few occasions where I shot a panorama with my K30, but then shot another with my iPhone as a backup. Until Pentax cameras have a panorama function, they'll always seem a little bit hobbled compared to a humble cell phone, at least in this respect.

Moreover, I'm no fan of Instagram, but many many others are. More powerful filters with the ability to customise and save them would also add to the user experience.
08-30-2014, 06:46 AM   #1213
Loyal Site Supporter
monochrome's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kirkwood (St. Louis) MO
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 20,423
I think this camera is designed to appeal to people who want to move beyond a cell phone. Apple and Samsung have pretty much figured out that user experience.
08-30-2014, 06:49 AM - 1 Like   #1214
K-9
Veteran Member
K-9's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: USA
Photos: Albums
Posts: 1,966
QuoteOriginally posted by VisualDarkness Quote
After spending the last week playing around as a mentor (and a photographer) during a student orientation week I can see way more people buying the K-S1 simplicity and cutting edge design rather than my big advanced K-5's. Most people don't take photos to make a photography career, most do it to encapsulate wonderful memories with the people they love around them.

I'm not a selfie person but most of the people around me are. Most students only takes pics of themselves or of themselves in a group of friends and got no real joy photographing random people or things around them. One of the main questions I got when shooting during the week was "Do you have any pics of yourself? Should I take one of you?" because that is how people view photography, the joy of keeping memories of yourself in fun situations.

I on the other hand get more joy from documenting and observing external things and others than myself, so for me it's not a problem not to be in a picture. But the trend is going away from that and most don't view photography as a tool to capture the external, they view it as a tool to capture themselves and their friends.
QuoteOriginally posted by asw66 Quote
This camera is meant to attract cell phone shooters, so let's talk about what would attract cell phone shooters to upgrade, and what wouldn't. My contention is that a dedicated SLR should do everything a cell phone camera does, and better. But that's not always the case, is it?

When I was travelling a few months ago, there were a few occasions where I shot a panorama with my K30, but then shot another with my iPhone as a backup. Until Pentax cameras have a panorama function, they'll always seem a little bit hobbled compared to a humble cell phone, at least in this respect.

Moreover, I'm no fan of Instagram, but many many others are. More powerful filters with the ability to customise and save them would also add to the user experience.
Selfies? Attract cell phone users? How is this possible when people who are used to taking selfies and want to upgrade from their phones will not be able to take selfies easily enough with this camera, as it does not have a swivel and tilt out LCD. If that is Pentax/Ricoh's intention, they've failed. Also, if they are used to instantly posting their pics to social media, which was accesible with the press of a button on their phones, they cannot do it with this camera, as there is no wi-fi.

Flip out LCDs and Wi-Fi have become standard for years on non-pro cameras in this price range, so excluding that is a huge mistake. The first rule of selling, especially for a hurting brand, is not to eliminate customers. Well, they've just done this.

Does anyone know if they finally have HDMI out on this camera, as they've excluded on so many previous bodies?
08-30-2014, 07:06 AM   #1215
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,323
Smartphones don't have swivel and tilt out LCDs...
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
af, camera, care, colour, design, ff, flash, format, iso, k-01, k-3, k3, kit, kit lens, leds, lens, level, look, medium, pentax, pentax k-s1, pentax news, pentax rumors, performance, price, scheme, steve, value
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Some Thoughts on the K-01 and Mirrorless From Pentax Biro Pentax Mirrorless Cameras 108 06-25-2014 03:20 PM
Mirrorless K-Mount Camera Joshua A Photographic Industry and Professionals 12 08-22-2013 04:28 AM
K-mount mirrorless....FF RonHendriks1966 Pentax Full Frame 13 05-28-2013 03:13 PM
Waiting on my first mirrorless: K-01! Penta Welcomes and Introductions 2 01-30-2013 05:49 AM
New Pentax: K-5, K-r and Mirrorless models coming JohnBee Pentax News and Rumors 32 08-08-2010 01:57 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:27 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top