[mee]

Imagine if Pentax would have released the K-S1 as a FF and it was the camera we have all been waiting for for years...with the LED's et al. I think we would have been sitting in stunned silence right now. :P

Oh how I would have lauughhhheedddd...























..... and then criiieeeddddd.

[ruggiex]

Imagine if Pentax would have released the K-S1 as a FF and it was the camera we have all been waiting for for years...with the LED's et al. I think we would have been sitting in stunned silence right now. :P

I'll take one... (if it's entry level FF price)

[JPT]

I started a thread about this a while ago and was shouted down, but here goes again.

Pentax started out with APS-C and some very small bodies and lenses. They were touting the size advantage of APS-C. The *ist DS was just 505g. Most lenses are APS-C optimised and tend to be smaller than the competition. The whole Limited range of primes is part of this philosophy.

Then they added a lot of useful features like SR, weather sealing, an extra control dial, pentaprism viewfinder. Although it was there from the beginning, AA batteries take up more space and make the overall body bulkier. The result of this is that the cameras have got bigger and bigger until the K-50 which is fairly big and 650g. This was the smallest DSLR that Pentax was selling until the K-S1. I feel that Pentax had lost their size advantage and I can understand why some remained so fond of their K-x.

I think they've corrected this now. They've compromised on the batteries, WR and control dial. On the other hand they've retained the pentaprism, which is an interesting choice. And it clearly isn't aimed at beginners only.

Complaints about the price are really overdone. The price is only marginally more than the K-50 and it has clearly had a lot of R&D put into it. I also think it will be aimed at people who buy the limited lenses and if you are prepared that much money on lenses, you are probably prepared to pay a bit more to get a high-quality body.

[filoxophy]

Probably a new version called "18-55mm II SMC DA ED" will be available on the new K-S1.
In 2009 a similar version existed (so much better than the actual 18-55 DAL).
Need to be confirmed by the Pentax staff.

In what sense do you use the word "probably"? Just curious...

[KX5]

In what sense do you use the word "probably"? Just curious...

Because the SMC Pentax-DA 18-55mm F3.5-5.6 AL II has been abandoned for many years and we don't know yet if the new 18-55mm II SMC DA ED will be the same opticaly (no cosmetic change with the actual DA-L version on k-s1 pictures).

[ogl]

I really want more info about the sensor. Bit depth, dynamic range? And just general impressions, some sensors have decent specs but were never liked very much. There are many more properties to a sensor than just MP

Tests and reviews for the camera Sony A5000 - DxOMark

http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Sony-A5000-versus-Pentax-K-5-II___929_829

[mecrox]

Complaints about the price are really overdone. The price is only marginally more than the K-50 and it has clearly had a lot of R&D put into it. I also think it will be aimed at people who buy the limited lenses and if you are prepared that much money on lenses, you are probably prepared to pay a bit more to get a high-quality body.

That's an extremely good point. But I wonder. The Limiteds strike me as very traditional in their design, very Japanese in fact since they are carefully distinguished one from another by elements of design which are sometimes quite intricate (such as their hoods and lens caps). They are like netsuke. The choice of material - bare metal - is also very traditional. The design of the K-S1 with its ultra-modern cues, polycarbonate skin and LEDs is completely different from this approach. I don't think the two go together aesthetically, in fact I think they clash, though I realize this is subjective and in any event no criticism of the K-S1. The two are simply different. A Pentax take on a Leica (though still a small DSLR) would be more in line with the Limiteds. One can say that view is old-fashioned but given the price of these little lenses, who but older folks with some spare cash could ever afford them? These are not the gen-X folks the K-S1 is apparently intended for, to judge from Pentax's own publicity material. A newly made "plastic fantastic" line like the recent DA 35mm f2.4 would be a different matter, perhaps - affordable and much closer in design to the K-S1. Ricoh's reearch would probably indicate to them whether customers for the K-S1 are the type of folks who buy prime lenses at all. It may all be gen-Zoom these days.

I think the issue with the price is that while the KS-1 is in many ways a mid-level camera under the surface with many fine technical specifications, it looks more like an entry-level camera on the outside. The three things missing are a tilt-swivel LCD, onboard wifi and a touchscreen*. One can say this doesn't matter and perhaps in Asia and Japan it won't - Ricoh must have done their research again - but I suspect that in the West where tastes are different it will act as a hefty drag on the sticker price. if the K-S1 isn't really intended so much for the West, that may not matter so much.

*Moving the controls to a flat plane at the back of the camera in a smartphone style presupposes that many users will be holding the camera at arm's length and using the rear LCD as their VF. In that event, the logic is to go the whole way and implement a touch screen rather than stop half-way. After all, the interface of the rear LCD with its picture of a control dial on the right-hand side looks as if it should be touch-sensitive. That may well be what a lot of folks expect when first they see it. Interestingly, the Pentax USA publicity video shows a user holding the camera in just this fashion. Perhaps Ricoh will have something to say about this at Photokina. If they have deliberately rejected this approach, it would be interesting to know why.

---

Last edited by mecrox; 08-30-2014 at 01:19 AM.

[theperception2008]

Tests and reviews for the camera Sony A5000 - DxOMark

Sony A5000 versus Pentax K-5 II - Side by side camera comparison - DxOMark

Also remember that Sony sensors tend to score a few points lower then when used by Pentax. Look at the Nex 6 which uses an identical sensor as the K-5II. If the trend holds true, the K-S1 should be equal to the K5II or even edge it out by a few points.

[Kunzite]

*Moving the controls to a flat plane at the back of the camera in a smartphone style presupposes that many users will be holding the camera at arm's length and using the rear LCD as their VF.

That would defeat the purpose of buying a DSLR.

The new interface is not designed to be used just like a smartphone; but to be more familiar (than a "classic" DSLR) and less intimidating so it won't turn people away. It appears quite intuitive, too. It's not like Pentax had to go all the way and launch another Android failure-of-a camera.

[Rondec]

You all are being silly. First of all, this is not for forumites. That is to say, this will not be primary camera for people who like larger SLRs, need the fastest frame rate, deepest buffers, etc. This is for new users, hopefully some who don't currently use Pentax cameras, that will grow the base. Second, I think the camera is targeted more at the Asian market, rather than the North American market. Not to say folks won't buy it here, but Pentax just doesn't have a great presence (in the US anyway) here, whereas they have a lot more presence in Asia. I think they have a better feel for what will sell in Japan than I do. Finally, the price will come down relatively quickly, depending on the initial sales. It can easily sell for similar price to the K50 and still turn a profit. It is just easier to launch a camera with a little higher price tag and drop it if the demand isn't there than to release it too low and feel like you under priced it.

Re-releasing the same cameras with tweaks of features is not enough to grow the brand. That's what Nikon does with the D5x00 line and the differences between the cameras are pretty small. Pentax did that with the K30 to K50 launch. This camera is different enough from other cameras out there that it could be a good seller and definitely will stand out. That's what Ricoh is aiming at with this camera in my opinion.

[VisualDarkness]

I just realized there are a lot more young 20 somethings that like to have a good time in the pool than there are professional photographers in the world. Maybe Ricoh already knows that....................

After spending the last week playing around as a mentor (and a photographer) during a student orientation week I can see way more people buying the K-S1 simplicity and cutting edge design rather than my big advanced K-5's. Most people don't take photos to make a photography career, most do it to encapsulate wonderful memories with the people they love around them.

I'm not a selfie person but most of the people around me are. Most students only takes pics of themselves or of themselves in a group of friends and got no real joy photographing random people or things around them. One of the main questions I got when shooting during the week was "Do you have any pics of yourself? Should I take one of you?" because that is how people view photography, the joy of keeping memories of yourself in fun situations.

I on the other hand get more joy from documenting and observing external things and others than myself, so for me it's not a problem not to be in a picture. But the trend is going away from that and most don't view photography as a tool to capture the external, they view it as a tool to capture themselves and their friends.

[Na Horuk]

Tests and reviews for the camera Sony A5000 - DxOMark Sony A5000 versus Pentax K-5 II - Side by side camera comparison - DxOMark

So the new 20MP sensor basically performs about the same as the K-50, only a little more MP.

[Zygonyx]

... and no AA filter + anti A in-bodied.


I agree with those who do think this product has quite not the same target as K-50, actually it compares barely :
- K50 is for enthusiasts / experts using the Advanced ergonomy with either need of WR, + eventually they like strong colours on traditionnal-shaped SLR (actualy i do believe this isea to colour the K50 was not so sucessfull)
- K-S1 is less experts and for younger / more feminine users that will appreciate the new design and interface, in a more "urban" environment.

[Chippedoff]

Not quite sure what to make of this one.... Yet.

I would prefer to have much better image quality than be a "Hey look at me i am all stylish" which seems to be the attempt at marketing this model. No top lcd, button placement is dubious much like the fuji x-s/t1. I didn't see an " official " spec stating it being weather sealed for either the camera and or kit lens, however it probably is.

I'l wait for a few decent sample photos and actually handling it before making any decisions.

For the time being the k-5 II/IIs seems the better choice, or on the lower end or at least the more point & shoot of the K-30/50.

[thibs]

Because the SMC Pentax-DA 18-55mm F3.5-5.6 AL II has been abandoned for many years and we don't know yet if the new 18-55mm II SMC DA ED will be the same opticaly (no cosmetic change with the actual DA-L version on k-s1 pictures).

What new 18-55mm II SMC DA ED ?