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08-31-2014, 10:36 AM   #181
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Indeed. If that particular device is suitable for camera WiFi (i.e. it meets the voltage, size, space, temperature, heat emission and a number of other technical requirements.

If its $2 why is an EyeFi Mobi $50 - $90 at B&H? Eye-Fi Pro is twice that.

Hint: According to IchabodCrane the real cost is $10 out the factory door. That adds $20 to the retail price. What feature of a Pentax camera should they delete to substitute WiFi? Pick one $10 cost feature ($20 Retail) and tell me why you'd rather have WiFi than that feature.

Hint: (Maybe) Metal Frame?
Hint: (Maybe) High-Grade polycarbonate body versus nylon?
Hint: (Maybe) Prime M II processor?
Hint: (Maybe) a combination of many things such as those three? At what point is it no longer a Pentax - just another cheap Canon?

Pentax decided the Flucard for PENTAX combines the real utilities of a hinged screen and connectivity in one optional device.

It's similar to offering an optional extended warranty for an additional $20. I can choose whether I want to take the risk or save the money.

I'm good with that.
That's not what I said and hope that's not what others thought I meant. Here's my original comment:

" And what does wifi add to the cost of a camera... $5, $10?"

For all I know the answer might be $2 or $20 but probably closer to $2. Regardless, it must be very low and I doubt not much more than a bunch of LED lights on the grip. If you had to choose, it seems obvious which of those options is more useful to the target market.




08-31-2014, 10:54 AM   #182
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Indeed. If that particular device is suitable for camera WiFi (i.e. it meets the voltage, size, space, temperature, heat emission and a number of other technical requirements.

If its $2 why is an EyeFi Mobi $50 - $90 at B&H? Eye-Fi Pro is twice that.

Hint: According to IchabodCrane the real cost is $10 out the factory door. That adds $20 to the retail price. What feature of a Pentax camera should they delete to substitute WiFi? Pick one $10 cost feature ($20 Retail) and tell me why you'd rather have WiFi than that feature.

Hint: (Maybe) Metal Frame?
Hint: (Maybe) High-Grade polycarbonate body versus nylon?
Hint: (Maybe) Prime M II processor?
Hint: (Maybe) a combination of many things such as those three? At what point is it no longer a Pentax - just another cheap Canon?

Pentax decided the Flucard for PENTAX combines the real utilities of a hinged screen and connectivity in one optional device.

It's similar to offering an optional extended warranty for an additional $20. I can choose whether I want to take the risk or save the money.

I'm good with that.
Leaving off wifi is a mistake across the range. Wouldn't it be simpler just to admit it? Palming off the issue to add-on cards is a cop out and does nothing to enhance Pentax's rep as a company that gets it. Besides, if they did actually get it then they would never have teamed up with Flu for smartphone stuff, or at least got them to change the name, knowing that their brand name is in English about as unfortunate as you can get. What are they going to do next? Leave off camera straps on the grounds they cannot afford them but team up instead with outfit called Ringpiece? The K-S1 has many very good things going for it but no wifi isn't really one of them. And a moment's reflection would suggest that saying a smartphone is an adequate substitute for a tilt-swivel LCD doesn't add up. Ricoh just don't want to do it, is all. No need to buy into their excuses. If Ricoh want to put up with the likely result - lower sales - that shouldn't be our problem.
08-31-2014, 11:12 AM   #183
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DReview says that camera has no metal frame.
08-31-2014, 11:18 AM   #184
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
That's not what I said and hope that's not what others thought I meant. Here's my original comment:

" And what does wifi add to the cost of a camera... $5, $10?"

For all I know the answer might be $2 or $20 but probably closer to $2. Regardless, it must be very low and I doubt not much more than a bunch of LED lights on the grip. If you had to choose, it seems obvious which of those options is more useful to the target market.



A few dollars is very small, but the LED's cost even less. Think on the order of ~$.10 per.

---------- Post added 08-31-14 at 11:20 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
Leaving off wifi is a mistake across the range. Wouldn't it be simpler just to admit it? Palming off the issue to add-on cards is a cop out and does nothing to enhance Pentax's rep as a company that gets it. Besides, if they did actually get it then they would never have teamed up with Flu for smartphone stuff, or at least got them to change the name, knowing that their brand name is in English about as unfortunate as you can get. What are they going to do next? Leave off camera straps on the grounds they cannot afford them but team up instead with outfit called Ringpiece? The K-S1 has many very good things going for it but no wifi isn't really one of them. And a moment's reflection would suggest that saying a smartphone is an adequate substitute for a tilt-swivel LCD doesn't add up. Ricoh just don't want to do it, is all. No need to buy into their excuses. If Ricoh want to put up with the likely result - lower sales - that shouldn't be our problem.

If this is the camera of the "selfie"* generation, then no wifi would be worse than leaving off both dials (they already left off one). The whole point of those pictures is sharing.




*good god I hate that word

08-31-2014, 12:23 PM   #185
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@mecrox :
I don't think you can say that Ricoh left off wi-fi.
Moreover, the flucard alternative like build in wi-fi or Eye-fi device are software-dependent, and my experience is not that good e.g. with Samsung's remote device nor android's "easyshare" autonom eye-fi card+soft : those two alternatives are basically bugging when you update android OS, even after upgrading the dedicated softs...
Customers need first of all working and reliable systems.
Not all of them are geeks

Last edited by Zygonyx; 08-31-2014 at 12:36 PM.
08-31-2014, 12:51 PM   #186
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
@mecrox :
I don't think you can say that Ricoh left off wi-fi.
Moreover, the flucard alternative like build in wi-fi or Eye-fi device are software-dependent, and my experience is not that good e.g. with Samsung's remote device nor android's "easyshare" autonom eye-fi card+soft : those two alternatives are basically bugging when you update android OS, even after upgrading the dedicated softs...
Customers need first of all working and reliable systems.
Not all of them are geeks
So are you saying that the Japanese imaging industry is unable to implement a working wifi solution in-camera? No brand has working wifi worth the name? Always possible I realise, especially with Apple involved, but ..

How about the Pentax Crustie, an attractive wickerwork basket available in 127 color combinations in which you can keep your very own carrier pigeon ($150 extra) for immediate despatch of those fun party pictures to social media? For only $150 extra, you can upgrade to a pigeon capable of carrying video files.
08-31-2014, 01:31 PM   #187
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
DReview says that camera has no metal frame.
Where? I don't remember reading such a thing.
08-31-2014, 03:11 PM   #188
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QuoteOriginally posted by LeeRunge Quote
Wi-Fi would have been attractive on this camera. I use a Eye-Fi and would rather see it built into the camera. Battery issues aren't a big deal if you can turn transfer off in the software. I doubt the added cost would be much.

Touchscreen not so much. Some things in life are better with less menu's to dig through to change settings. Old school dials still trump touchscreens for ergonomics in a camera imo. I'm much younger than most of you. I'm curious to see what they did for the handling with this K-S1 when it's reviewed. Dpreview didn't seem to hot on it but other sites like imaging review will do a better job reviewing the camera. If they minimized menu digging it might be a simple slick interface which would be a big plus for the camera.

Any other camera's out there use the 20mp sensor in this KS-1?
You either have touchscreen OR an articulating screen.

Wi-fi is a no-brainer. All the SD card options are now obsolete kludges. Done.

08-31-2014, 03:32 PM   #189
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Where? I don't remember reading such a thing.
DPReview says this: The remainder of the body is a mix of composite and metal and it feels very solid.
Probably poly carbonate and aluminium.

QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
You either have touchscreen OR an articulating screen.
There is no reason why it can't be both.
08-31-2014, 05:33 PM   #190
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote

There is no reason why it can't be both.
Try touching a screen while articulated. You'll put stress on the articulating arms and have no solid resistance. It's a usability and warranty considearation. Articulating screens are meant to be passive. The best part of a touch screen is the capacity to eliminate tactile controls by substitution. But if you have a touch screen that articulates and cannot accurately present tactile feedback then you'll have also include tactile controls. Size advantage lost.
08-31-2014, 06:03 PM   #191
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
DReview says that camera has no metal frame.
Physical Specs (from the Ricoh website)

Body dimensions (W x H x D): 4.75 x 3.65 x 2.75
Body weight
Without battery or removable memory: 17.6 oz
Loaded and ready: 19.7 oz
Primary construction material(s): Reinforced polycarbonate over metal chassis
Operating temperature: 32-104F (0 to 40C)
08-31-2014, 07:21 PM   #192
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QuoteOriginally posted by LeeRunge Quote
K-50 and K-500 are current entry/mid level cameras. Maybe this one will MSRP for 750 and street for the same price which would make it more competitive. If they discontinue the K-50/500 for this K-S1 that would probably be a silly move. Pentax weather sealing and feature rich entry cameras are what attracts people to the brand vs Nikon/Canon who water down the entry level to avoid cannibalism of the upper camera's.

It's a shame they didn't at least weather seal this one for the same price as the K-50.
It's a shame about the K-30 you mean
09-01-2014, 12:31 AM   #193
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Wi-fi is a no-brainer. All the SD card options are now obsolete kludges. Done.
Agree 100%. I guess it's nice that Pentax teamed up with a company to create a "custom" wifi card, but just integrate it into the body! It doesn't need to be able to publish anything--just to be able to push image files to my device. As it is, we're stuck with an expensive memory card option; one capacity, one speed. I've tried Eye-Fi... Maybe this flucard is miles better, but I was not at all impressed. It was very kludgy and more complicated than it needed to be.
09-01-2014, 12:59 AM   #194
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Do you know if in-bodied wi-fi with exchange and monitoring functions can avoid dedicated soft/application ?
Are there such good examples wit other manufacturers ?
just asking : with Samsung no, afaik.
09-01-2014, 01:13 AM   #195
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
Do you know if in-bodied wi-fi with exchange and monitoring functions can avoid dedicated soft/application ?
Are there such good examples wit other manufacturers ?
just asking : with Samsung no, afaik.
Yeah, I don't know. Just registering my opinion on the matter. Nikon sells little wifi dongles for like $50, including the associated app. Anyone have any experience with those? Of course, you would lose WR with something like that, and it's still something to plug in and easily lose...
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