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01-09-2015, 12:19 PM   #391
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
The A7 is the only way for us Pentaxians to use our beloved 3 princes almost properly. It's not brought up in many topics for nothing.
What your "almost properly" is to use AF lenses without AF and through adapters. And for the sensor format, all Canon FF body do support the Pentax lenses, nothing new.

It is brought up in many topics because:
- user fail to stay on topics
- moderator do not prevent it

It is not like all user here think of A7, want an A7 or already have one... Just that few other continously push the subject while more and more are upset.

01-09-2015, 12:24 PM - 1 Like   #392
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Well, if someone wants to use those three lenses like they were designed for they would shoot film.
01-09-2015, 12:30 PM   #393
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
Well, if someone wants to use those three lenses like they were designed for they would shoot film.
+1, agree.
01-09-2015, 12:36 PM   #394
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QuoteOriginally posted by jpzk Quote
I use my "two amigos" (31 and 43 ltd ) on my Fuji X-E2 .... very much properly !

JP
JP, I think what Clavius meant was that one can use FA31 and 43Ltd on a FF sensor camera properly (although not sure what properly means). Your Fuji X-E2 has a shorter flange distance with an APS-C sensor. Sure, if one finds that it works for him/her using the "three amigos", that's fine.

01-09-2015, 12:51 PM   #395
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
What your "almost properly" is to use AF lenses without AF and through adapters. And for the sensor format, all Canon FF body do support the Pentax lenses, nothing new.

It is brought up in many topics because:
- user fail to stay on topics
- moderator do not prevent it

It is not like all user here think of A7, want an A7 or already have one... Just that few other continously push the subject while more and more are upset.
I can see that people express their views in hope of convincing others to do the same and they are of course entitled to their opinion (and that should be the spirit of this forum).

As much as people boasted about how we may have miss the boat (since we don't have a Pentax FF model yet) by not getting into the Sony band wagon, my take on this subject is simple and based on two simple facts.
-I would rather save my money for a Pentax FF camera when it comes out because while I can afford a FF camera but I don't want to jump to another brand by giving up some features such as AF.
-I can still use my three amigos on my Pentax APS-C camera (FF lens on APS-C sensor - advantage, same DOF and cropped) and sometimes get better results...

Last edited by aleonx3; 01-09-2015 at 01:04 PM.
01-09-2015, 01:02 PM   #396
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I think it is fairly clear that Pentax is committed to K-mount. It is also clear that Pentax is committed to Q and 645. That means Pentax will need to create a fourth mount and complete lens line-up to offer a short-register mirrorless camera, or make a mirrorless camera body, adapters and NO LENSES at all, or buy Olympus (which would just bring them the m43 problem and solve little). I think the NO LENSES idea is highly unlikely (though Ricoh could brand something that way).

The sooner the Sony advocates on this Forum accept that fact and move on, the happier they and we will be. There's nothing wrong with using a Sony A7 and a K adapter. Nothing!! Go ahead - do it!!

I suspect there will be K-mount bodies, lenses and users for quite some time to come before Pentax is actually doomed.
01-09-2015, 01:35 PM   #397
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I suspect there will be K-mount bodies, lenses and users for quite some time to come before Pentax is actually doomed.
I don't know about that, I keep hearing it's right around the corner! THE END IS NIGH!!!
01-10-2015, 03:41 AM   #398
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I think it is fairly clear that Pentax is committed to K-mount. It is also clear that Pentax is committed to Q and 645. That means Pentax will need to create a fourth mount and complete lens line-up to offer a short-register mirrorless camera, or make a mirrorless camera body, adapters and NO LENSES at all, or buy Olympus (which would just bring them the m43 problem and solve little). I think the NO LENSES idea is highly unlikely (though Ricoh could brand something that way).

The sooner the Sony advocates on this Forum accept that fact and move on, the happier they and we will be. There's nothing wrong with using a Sony A7 and a K adapter. Nothing!! Go ahead - do it!!

I suspect there will be K-mount bodies, lenses and users for quite some time to come before Pentax is actually doomed.
Agree with a fourth mount make sense but where it make least sense to me is FF because K-mount was designed for it. The difficulty to design good wide angle almost disappear (except for some extreme UWA) and you can get smaller tele. The FA 43 & FA77 would be bigger with shorter registration distance at is would be for DFA100... But also a 70-200 would be bigger too. And of course you can keep K-mount and put an EVF on it or remove the mirror. Even through I think as of today you need to have an OVF model in your product line.

Then it leave us with some smaller sensor maybe bigger than Q because you loose too much shallow deph of field control and arre too much limited in high iso performance. From price, shallow deph of field and high isos, APSC look like a sweet spot and it would really make sense. Still the tele past 60-80mm start to be quite big. That would the challenge.

My conclusion is it make more sense to create an APSC or m4/3 or something arround that to be mirorless. To not be too agressive on the registration distance as a good compromise between WA and tele and to have of course and adapter to K-mount that preserve AF and all. Ideally the mount would be made with K-mount is mide so same diameter, support for screw drive and same connectors so you can easily addapt K-mount lenses on it just with a basic adapter.

This would give us with Q in Q mount, APSC with K-mount and the new short registration distance mount, FF in K-mount and MF with 645 mount.

In the long run, you could sell the APSC K-mount to be compatible with the FF mount, for OVF instead of EVF and for capacity to handle any long lense without issue... Not forgetting fast AF.

APSC short registration mount could be sold as small body for trips etc, good for being unobtrusive and still high quality with EVF etc.

The FF will be K-mount, will be OVF only the first years for sure and it would be the ultimate swiss knife camera, good high iso performance, lot of deph of field, lot of sharpness, good colors... supporting all kind of lenses and for the more serious work. It would have at least 36MP to support the APSC K-mount lenses in 15MP.

01-10-2015, 05:26 AM   #399
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Other than being able to mount non-k mount lenses on your camera, I don't know that there is a huge benefit to having a new (shorter) mount. That certainly doesn't seem like a good reason for a company to pitch all of their existing glass out the window and start over.

It was clear that Sony decided that the alpha mount was not their future and so they transitioned away from it. They've done a pretty good job of supporting the e mount with APS-C lenses, but even that has taken time to develop.
01-10-2015, 05:50 AM   #400
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
It is also clear that Pentax is committed to Q and 645.
I don't see much evidence that Ricoh is truly committed to Q. Look at the minimal development they've put into it. The Q10 was just the Q in a cheaper body. The Q7 increased the sensor size but didn't improve much else and it miraculously fitted in the exact same body shape. Then the Q-S1 one came out with purely cosmetic changes. On the lens side, they now have the three zooms, but primes have not surfaced. The Q macro is the only reference product from CP+ 2014 that never arrived and in a recent interview said there were development problems with it and that K and 645 had priority over it.

I think that Ricoh was not impressed by Pentax's mirrorless efforts when they took control. They quickly ditched the idea of specific lenses for the K-01 and gave it minimal promotion. They decided that the best they could do with Q was reposition it down market. Now it sells OK here in Japan, but it's a cheap camera. Personally, I'm not optimistic about the future of Q. They might persist with it, but in terms of resources I would consider it half a mount at best.
01-10-2015, 06:55 AM   #401
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
any new APS-C - no any interest at all...
agree entirely
01-10-2015, 07:13 AM   #402
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My Take of the Pentax Future

Ricoh will keep the Pentax brand for OVF and DSLRs, and then expand Ricoh's successful and highly regarded GR family to compete with Sony E and Fuji. Of course, the new GR will incorporate Pentax technology such as image processing, SR and auto-focus. They will then offer an adapter for K mount, just as Sony does for A mount.
01-10-2015, 08:09 AM   #403
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QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
I don't see much evidence that Ricoh is truly committed to Q.
Perhaps you are correct today. Things change. The unexpected 645 success likely altered resource allocation plans.

But as of April, 2013, in a conversation with James Malcolm and a group of PF members who are Q users, Malcolm stated unequivocally, Pentax is committed to K-mount, Q and 645. They considered Q to be the true growth engine over the long term.

"He unequivocally stated Pentax is committed to the Q-mount, the K-mount and the 645-mount, and will continue to develop releases and products that leverage these mounts and keep them fresh and competitive. They see Q-mount as in its very early stages, and perhaps the best poised for true growth. They see a true Q system and Q ecology and stated there will be significant progress and technology in Q in the future."

QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
The Q7 increased the sensor size but didn't improve much else and it miraculously fitted in the exact same body shape.
My impression has been Q was developed with the 1:1.7 sensor in mind but at the time of release only the 1:2.3 had certain desired video capabilities.

I've written elsewhere I would not be at all surprised to see a short-register, large-sensor MILC emerge under the Ricoh brand with Ricoh DNA and adapters - but the problems of too few lenses and/or too many mounts would remain.

Last edited by monochrome; 01-10-2015 at 08:19 AM.
01-10-2015, 09:58 AM   #404
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
any new APS-C - no any interest at all...
I am very interested in APS-C. To me FullFrame and MediumFormat are something you read about, but I can't image my ever sacrificing enough money to actually own one myself.
01-10-2015, 10:28 AM - 1 Like   #405
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
They considered Q to be the true growth engine over the long term.
That is a pretty scary thought. Most people know very little about Pentax and K-mount. Very, very few people even know the Q exists. Its a novelty item that appears to be a platform for Ricoh to develop mirrorless technology. I have never seen a Q in the wild. I have never even bothered to read a review of one of the bodies or lenses. I had always assumed Ricoh would discontinue the mount once they were ready to develop a larger sensor MILC system.

If they think the Q is where the "true long term growth is" then that would explain why they are so out of touch with the market. The Panasonic Lumix DM1 smartphone has a sensor that is almost 3x larger than a Q. Smartphones are moving up market with better camera features and conveniences that the Q just can't touch. People who are serious about image quality will opt for larger sensor mirrorless cameras. People who are more concerned with convenience with chose a premium smartphone. The people buying the Q are mostly the small group of corporate loyalists who care more about brand name than they do IQ or convenience, and people who like it as a cute novelty. Nothing wrong with novelty. I have a coffee cup shaped like a camera lens. Its not the best coffee cup I own, but I use it for the novelty of it. That's where the Q fits into the market.
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