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12-29-2014, 06:01 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Strange how so many have seen something completely different and definitive from that translated interview.... it seems if one is skeptical or generally pessimistic they saw 'FF is not coming', optimists saw 'FF is coming', while I read 'FF is possible' (aka we are avoiding answering the question)
You can read anything because they haven't made it clear.

12-29-2014, 06:35 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Daikokuya Quote
The interviewer is Mikio Tanaka, a flamboyant photographer with many ties to camera makers. His twitter is interesting.


Tanaka: How would you do given the enormous presense of Canon, Nikon, and Sony in FF?


Ricoh Imaging: We have a secret plan to counter them!
Cheap MF with fixed lens.

---------- Post added 12-29-2014 at 06:37 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Strange how so many have seen something completely different and definitive from that translated interview.... it seems if one is skeptical or generally pessimistic they saw 'FF is not coming', optimists saw 'FF is coming', while I read 'FF is possible' (aka we are avoiding answering the question)
Yes....it's possible but it's not clear if it will be or not. Nobody knows.
12-29-2014, 08:25 AM   #33
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For all our focus on FF, sales of FF are still notary good, and the production issues highlight the substantial investments in these systems.

I do not think the SLR format is going away so, but the inexorable rise of the smaller system camera is starting to make a dent in the overall capacity to carry large lens line-ups. So this interview partly addresses the context adroitly IMO.
12-29-2014, 08:32 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Biro Quote
In line with this thought I have to wonder if, by the time any Pentax FF camera arrives, anyone will care anymore. And if - and I repeat if - that turns out to be the case, might that put Ricoh's camera division at risk?
Assuming you're right it's good enough reason not to go ahead with the whole FF thing. Why would any FF fans care? Most of them could have by now migrated or bought a used FF body. Expensive, mechanical DSLRs dinosaurs are not that hot any more, although they could have their niche, like vinyl records do.

12-29-2014, 09:06 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
Never GR with zoom lens.
They never did before either.

- Oh, what's that? Isn't this a GR with a zoom?
- Not it is no GR.
- What is it then ?
- A GX...

This is made up of course but it points out that even following the interview,... it means about nothing.
12-29-2014, 09:33 AM   #36
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gaddigad:
I'd say you are mistaken about dinosaurs; they are still very successful - their winged offsprings, I mean And if we were to make a SLRs vs. terrestrial dinosaurs (i.e. the extinct kind) analogy, we would need a global disaster, perhaps an asteroid leveling down SLR production facilities but leaving MILC ones intact, or somehow selectively killing the stubborn over three quarters of the ILC market insisting on buying DSLRs

Regarding the expected Pentax FF, the user base (us) is not static. People are outgrowing (if not their needs, their income does) APS-C and would want to spend more money on something supposedly superior; they will replace those who couldn't wait.
12-29-2014, 09:42 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rudy Quote
There is no FF in 2015, although this might be a year that helps them decide

oh boy
12-29-2014, 10:27 AM   #38
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For the record, no one posting on this thread actually knows anything. If anyone posting on this thread actually knows anything and Ricoh decodes the UserName that person won't actually know anything ever again.

The only person on this entire Forum who actually seems to know anything (by the indicated accuracy of events that have followed predictions in his posts) has recently posted that he doesn't know anything (new).

Consider this: If Ricoh really intends Pentax to be the 3rd major camera brand they'll need to develop a FF system camera, not just a standalone body with a 36x24 sensor inside. That means flashes, optics, accessories, AF improvements (both speed and the distribution of focus points across the (larger) focusing screen) and a host of native flourishes such as Wi-Fi and tethering

And do the same thing simultaneously for 645 - where they actually have a market advantage.

I know nothing about the camera business and less than nothing about Ricoh's plans - but I'm not holding my breath for February.

12-29-2014, 11:20 AM   #39
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No, none of us know anything specific and concrete from Ricoh. True. Reading the interviews is like taking a projective test - you put more of yourself into the interpretation than the object you are interpreting puts into it. That said, and acknowledged, there is something to be said for the fact that when the answer is no they say "There are no specific plans at this time." If you read the entire document and look at how they answer, not just what they say, then interpreting their answers can make more sense. Are we getting a FF in February? No idea.
12-29-2014, 11:38 AM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Daikokuya Quote
It's good for us to know that they showed us some kind of schedule like "We will decide whether we make it into a product or not next year".
I suspect that the decision to make the product it's intimately connected to the decision whether to announce their intention to produce it. In other words, the reason they've not made their intention clear is they're not 100% when and if they'll produce an FF camera, and so they're not willing to commit to it via an announcement. And so if they do decide to make the product next year, I believe they'll announce their intention shortly thereafter.

That announcement could be tied to their announcement of the two FF telephoto zooms, which will probably be released next year. It's possible they'll be announcing those lenses as early as this February. Since one of those lenses will likely be a DFA 70-200 f2.8, questions about FF will inevitably arise at that time. So I believe there's a legitimate chance the FF could be announced in a couple of months (although I wouldn't expect any such product to appear any time before the end of next year).
12-29-2014, 12:07 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
For the record, no one posting on this thread actually knows anything. If anyone posting on this thread actually knows anything and Ricoh decodes the UserName that person won't actually know anything ever again.

The only person on this entire Forum who actually seems to know anything (by the indicated accuracy of events that have followed predictions in his posts) has recently posted that he doesn't know anything (new). Yup, they probably have pictures of... well you now...

Consider this: If Ricoh really intends Pentax to be the 3rd major camera brand they'll need to develop a FF system camera, not just a standalone body with a 36x24 sensor inside. That means flashes, optics, accessories, AF improvements (both speed and the distribution of focus points across the (larger) focusing screen) and a host of native flourishes such as Wi-Fi and tethering Absolutely!!!

And do the same thing simultaneously for 645 - where they actually have a market advantage. YES!!!

I know nothing about the camera business and less than nothing about Ricoh's plans - but I'm not holding my breath for February.
... You are not alone here...

As usual, I concur with Monochrome most on the above (particularly that Nobody has a releasable answer/ knows anything).... I have a few insights/ opinions for consideration (to show all what I DON'T know...)...

I suspect that a next gen APSc DSLR will either preempt the FF DSLR or have a simultaneous release. I say this with the recent subtle (yet 180 degree reversals) repositioning that Nikon and Canon are using through pundits and "sponsored" photographers. Since K-3 came out they have shifted from FF is only "pro" platform to "new gen APSc cameras are better for wildlife and similar applications". Both overhauled the K-3 competitive units. Most "sponsored" mentors are using (and talking about it) a high end APSc along with a smaller FF in the field. The FFs are increasingly talked about for landscape, architecture, and weddings, the way MF was in that space for years vs. FF 35mm film. Subtle but major repositioning industry wide....

Second, it is clear to me from translating the interview myself (not a precise method, idioms and euphamisms are the diamonds to be mined) that Pentax feels that pixel-pitch, crosstalk, and noise improvements from sensor design will eclipse FF capabilities of current sensor platforms. So I believe the 2nd gen K-3* (*whatever nomenclature) is coming faster than FF from a developmental perspective. More importantly, the 24mp APSc pixel density is sufficient to see where smaller/denser sensors can advance (my interpretation of 2 sentences). My time in Japan colors my view of the interview that they "shouted" APSc is a superior platform if the 3 opportunities for improvement get better (as noted above). I still sense that they may approach FF in a first gen in MILC, but OVF is their preferred approach. For those of you that have seen my "far from mainstream" posts on FF, CaNikon spin, SONY failings, and debunking FF (flat-earthers and "pro" wannabes" begging for FF), I believe sensor improvements from advanced material applications and pitch management will happen before a viable 50mp FF eclipses 24-30MP APSc. Complete heresy, I know...

Third, I 100% concur that RP will NOT release a FF DSLR until it is "best-in-class" on pricepoint vs functionality AND all "platform optics are ready" (meaning 12-24 F2.8, 24-70 F2.8, 70-210 F2.8, 300 F2.8, 400 F5.6 or better, and a view of a 250-600 F4 or F5.6ish lens). Primes and a longer macro will be needed as well (some are already there). IMO, Flash is not a huge issue (since geometries for FF and APSc flash delivery are similar), and other accessories can be leveraged with K-3 (some more are still needed). Still ,they need the "whole" kit defined and deliverable to be credible.

On AF improvements, I believe the best solution is "dumbing" the K-3 type sensor to Canon level speed (less precise) is important, and should be user configurable. My wife and I just came back from an 11 day shoot in South America. I learned a ton more "chasing" monkeys with AF... Makes butterflies and birds look easy...
12-29-2014, 12:54 PM   #42
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I'm 100% sure that the FF will be announced, ....after it will be launched. Or the other way around.
12-29-2014, 01:05 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
For the record, no one posting on this thread actually knows anything. If anyone posting on this thread actually knows anything and Ricoh decodes the UserName that person won't actually know anything ever again.

The only person on this entire Forum who actually seems to know anything (by the indicated accuracy of events that have followed predictions in his posts) has recently posted that he doesn't know anything (new).

Consider this: If Ricoh really intends Pentax to be the 3rd major camera brand they'll need to develop a FF system camera, not just a standalone body with a 36x24 sensor inside. That means flashes, optics, accessories, AF improvements (both speed and the distribution of focus points across the (larger) focusing screen) and a host of native flourishes such as Wi-Fi and tethering

And do the same thing simultaneously for 645 - where they actually have a market advantage.

I know nothing about the camera business and less than nothing about Ricoh's plans - but I'm not holding my breath for February.
Fuji appears to be a solid #3 with no FF.

FF is not a prerequisite for being #1, IMO.

As long as FF sensors stay so high-priced it is a barrier to more competitors than Sony, Nikon, Canon, Leica.
12-29-2014, 01:26 PM   #44
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Maybe they just spend all their developmentmoney on the K-S1 and now are waiting for it to return......
12-29-2014, 01:57 PM - 2 Likes   #45
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Well, it is perhaps true nobody knows anything in particulat about their plans.

But what is the point of participating in an interview that will be equally concealing and counterproductive? Can a sensible marketing person be aware that a stream of such "interviews" does nothing good to the brand? Then again, what is the point in DC publishing it? Where is journalist's common sense there, or if there is some? Why publish something that is not a meal for human brain, or worse, not even food for cats?

Maybe DC is hinting us loudly: there is nothing to see here boys, and we are publishing it for you to see, once again. A company that follows only its own idiosyncratic quirks and issues a plastic toy like K-01 and K-S1 and then artificially pushes both into an upper medim range offer and price level -- twice their real worth -- must have lost some touch with common sense. They are fooling themselves, and making users ridiculous. So much of our quest for some common sense in this endless saga of pointless interviews then; on which basis can we expect one?

Anyway, if it is Ricoh's will to keep their mouth shut and work in total isolation form their users and users' requests, why we bother even answering such threads, trapped like mice inside a labyrinth? Toss it overboard. Google translate did not miss a beat; the jumble translated is a clear message there is nothing worthy of wasting our time there.

Last edited by Uluru; 12-29-2014 at 02:11 PM.
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