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04-20-2015, 08:38 AM - 1 Like   #436
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
LOL we will know soon enough.
Two days aren't gonna change a thing.


Yep...a lot of speculation.


You know what makes me laugh is that some people are thinking that Pentax is trying out some new innovations now so that they can make changes in the FF before it is released based on feedback from K-3II users. I really don't think that they will be waiting like that until the last minute for a camera that is to be out for sale in October. That would be cutting it really close, 6 months from now, for user feedback and make engineering changes waiting for user change feedback. I did not think Pentax can respond that well...but then again.....this is not pentax now.....it is the new PENTAX. .

04-20-2015, 08:42 AM - 1 Like   #437
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QuoteOriginally posted by infoomatic Quote
any info on the sensor? If no improvements concerning noise/DR it's not of interest for me (I think there has been virtually no improvement since K5 except higher resolution without AA-filter)
I think good news are very likely. The latest 24 MP Sony sensor (the one used in the D7200) has been updated towards having an 1 EV higher dynamic range, topping even the legendary 16 MP sensor, and of course the previous 24 MP sensor (the one which the K-3 contains). Source: dxomark.

Pentax will most likely want to have the latest sensor from Sony as well, so that the new K-3 is on par with the D7200 and the D5500 with respect to that.

Actually, I believe that the K-3 coming so sudden, must be an emergency reaction caused (or accellerated) by the recent D7200 arrival. At the moment, the D7200 is the package with the best sensor (=best image quality) paired with the best autofocus (taken from the big pro bodies like D4). Ricoh just needed to react to that, URGENTLY.

And I can tell ya, I would have been off to Nikon already in spring, if Ricoh hadn't reacted so quickly.
I always was afraid, that Ricoh could want to delay the K-3 update to happen after the FF arrival in autumn/winter, aiming to maximize the number of upgraders from the K-3 to the more profitable FF system.

Last edited by Frater; 04-20-2015 at 09:05 AM.
04-20-2015, 09:10 AM   #438
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frater Quote
And I can tell ya, I would have been off to Nikon already in spring, if Ricoh hadn't reacted so quickly. I always was afraid, that Ricoh could want to delay the K-3 update to happen after the FF arrival in autumn/winter, aiming to maximize the number of upgraders from the K-3 to the more profitable FF system.
Judging by your signature you seem to have two bodies and a small amount of lenses invested in K mount, would have made your transition to Nikon easy...
04-20-2015, 09:18 AM   #439
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frater Quote
The latest 24 MP Sony sensor (the one used in the D7200) has been updated towards having an 1 EV higher dynamic range, topping even the legendary 16 MP sensor
The problem is, the only potential evidence it actually is the new sensor is the DxO's dynamic range measurement. There is a chance they've used a tweaked version of the IMX193 to get such a good result - it is possible there was not enough time to adopt the newest one... I know the IMX271 prototypes were probably circulating for months before Sony Semiconductors made an announcement, but then, if they really used the IMX271 in the D7200 why did they keep the fps at such a low level? Even if they could not use the newest processor, the Milbeaut 7 can take up to 12 fps - why didn't they make it let's say 8-10 fps, so it could be more competitive compared to the 7DII or even K-3? Is there really a higher APS-C model in their pipeline? I don't think so, but...

04-20-2015, 09:22 AM - 1 Like   #440
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QuoteOriginally posted by jaad75 Quote
The problem is, the only potential evidence it actually is the new sensor is the DxO's dynamic range measurement. There is a chance they've used a tweaked version of the IMX193 to get such a good result - it is possible there was not enough time to adopt the newest one... I know the IMX271 prototypes were probably circulating for months before Sony Semiconductors made an announcement, but then, if they really used the IMX271 in the D7200 why did they keep the fps at such a low level? Even if they could not use the newest processor, the Milbeaut 7 can take up to 12 fps - why didn't they make it let's say 8-10 fps, so it could be more competitive compared to the 7DII or even K-3? Is there really a higher APS-C model in their pipeline? I don't think so, but...

Who has the magic touch with 'em Sony sensor,--Ricoh(pentax). We gotta get that sweet IMX271 in there, get 19FPS up in that *&^%$(housing)......you know am saying!!!
04-20-2015, 09:27 AM   #441
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QuoteOriginally posted by jaad75 Quote
The problem is, the only potential evidence it actually is the new sensor is the DxO's dynamic range measurement. There is a chance they've used a tweaked version of the IMX193 to get such a good result - it is possible there was not enough time to adopt the newest one... I know the IMX271 prototypes were probably circulating for months before Sony Semiconductors made an announcement, but then, if they really used the IMX271 in the D7200 why did they keep the fps at such a low level? Even if they could not use the newest processor, the Milbeaut 7 can take up to 12 fps - why didn't they make it let's say 8-10 fps, so it could be more competitive compared to the 7DII or even K-3? Is there really a higher APS-C model in their pipeline? I don't think so, but...
Frame rate is a system - shutter, sensor, processor, bus - and they all need to integrate with proprietary software and firmware. We believe Pentax has an edge extracting image quality from Sony sensors and integrating the system components. Maybe Nikon spent their effort on WiFi, NFC, 4K video and reprogramming the Milbeaut (EXPEED) image processor at the expense of the bus - or ultimate still image FPS.

Opinion seems to be coalescing around the idea that the K-3II will be cutting edge, best available technology - a real killer camera.
04-20-2015, 09:29 AM   #442
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
We believe Pentax has an edge extracting image quality from Sony sensors and integrating the system components.
Opinion seems to be coalescing around the idea that the K-3II will be cutting edge, best available technology - a real killer camera.
That's what I said. .didn't I just say that..
04-20-2015, 09:49 AM   #443
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Frame rate is a system - shutter, sensor, processor, bus - and they all need to integrate with proprietary software and firmware.
Sure, but do you really think the D7200's mechanics couldn't keep up with a slightly higher frame rate? There is a chance, but I don't think that's the main reason...

04-20-2015, 10:31 AM - 1 Like   #444
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QuoteOriginally posted by jaad75 Quote
Sure, but do you really think the D7200's mechanics couldn't keep up with a slightly higher frame rate? There is a chance, but I don't think that's the main reason...
The d7200 mirror mechanism is made from epoxy, snot and cat hair....I doesn't have a chance at 19FPS.
04-20-2015, 10:32 AM   #445
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QuoteOriginally posted by jaad75 Quote
Sure, but do you really think the D7200's mechanics couldn't keep up with a slightly higher frame rate? There is a chance, but I don't think that's the main reason...
I have no experience with the D7200. Otherwise one would have to speculate Nikon limited the camera for market positioning reasons. That wouldn't be unheard of.
04-20-2015, 10:37 AM - 1 Like   #446
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QuoteOriginally posted by Stavri Quote
Judging by your signature you seem to have two bodies and a small amount of lenses invested in K mount, would have made your transition to Nikon easy...
Yep, that's convenient isn't it? No my Pentax investments where stalled mainly because I'm switching from landscape/travel to people&street photography, including a fashion blogger model (hobby, not professionally).
The three zooms collect dust since then, and my DA50/1.8 became my most loved and valued lens, regardless of it being the cheapest of the bunch. The DA40 Limited is also a little gem for discreet street photo of any kind, love that too.

But this switch towards people photo also had a dark side to it. It started to generate frustrations with my K-5 ii system, was disappointed by various signs of low quality from my zooms, and found the body's AF to be not fit for purpose. Too unreliable when used with fast 1.x apertures. Something I never experienced before with my f/8 landscape photography.
But where else could someone like me go?

The K-3 wasn't an upgrade option. Yes the AF points were less huge, and I saw previous K 5 ii(s) user reports of it being snappier, but not nececessarily more precise, I stumbled over reports in different forums which claimed, that for some lenses the K-3 AF turned out to be even worse than the K-5 ii(s). That was too much of a mixed bag for me, for the money been asked for.

Fuji X-T1? well it is sexy, the X lenses even more so, but they are waaays too expensive for my hobby budget. Getting the X system with all the lenses you want is as expensive as going full frame. Also, the X-T1 is not ideal for my hands, and like all mirrorless (inlcuding the Sony A7), it is probably more something for the fine art photo enthusiast, rather than people or even action. Let's hope they will discover the consumers' budgets and provide appropriate budget lenses. They made a start with that, and also Sigma's future entry to the X mount will help making the X system attractive for that market segment. Let's give Fuji a few years, then we'll see again.

Nikon D7100? had a too-shallow RAW buffer, no good for my fashion model shooting.

Canon's? Somehow I don't like them, and their sensors have fallen behind Sony's by now. Only if one was really keen on good video, one would have to go for Canon.

Then the D7200 came out and changed everything, Nikon had listened, and they had fixed all D7100 issues some were complaining about. Including: bigger RAW buffer, the newest (?) Sony sensor replaces the old "banding" Toshiba, and, an (even) better pro-level autofocus, not only better in the dark night (as claimed by Nikon) but also in the daylight (observed by early reviewers). As-if made for me. Not "sexy" in terms of new fancy gimmicks of any kind, but seemingly evolved to be a solid, mature and useful workhorse. As if for pros, or for consumers with a pro mindset.

Now, the sudden announcement of the K-3 successor changes (or could change) everything again What a row of good news after boring 2014.

I do like the explcit emphasis been on the autofocus. Thank god Ricoh must have listened to their ambassadors (including those which were used to Nikon/Canon's AF performance before), and not to Pentax fanboys defending "their" respective AF against any accusations since the K10D. Well done, Ricoh, you seem on the right track.

Now the interesting part: where will the K-3 just catch up with the D7200, and where will it exceed it...

Last edited by Frater; 04-20-2015 at 12:37 PM.
04-20-2015, 10:48 AM   #447
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Otherwise one would have to speculate Nikon limited the camera for market positioning reasons. That wouldn't be unheard of.
Sure, but then we would have to think the D400/D8xxx/D9xxx/D..whatever is in their plans, again - maybe, but unlikely IMHO. Or maybe they just didn't have the new sensor on time and used the old good IMX193 with a couple of tweaks... The D7200 measurement is not that much higher than the D5500 one that it wouldn't be possible... In that case, I'm wondering if there is a chance Ricoh got it soon enough to implement it in the K-3II... And then the same story goes with the newest Milbeaut...
04-20-2015, 11:05 AM   #448
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QuoteOriginally posted by jaad75 Quote
I'm wondering if there is a chance Ricoh got it soon enough to implement it in the K-3II... And then the same story goes with the newest Milbeaut...
Well, if it is announced this week but isn't actually released until late June or July . . . . what does logic tell you?

Same goes for the FF - why would they wait until October to officially show working bodies unless they're waiting on a new component?
04-20-2015, 11:06 AM   #449
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frater Quote
But this switch towards people photo also had a dark side to it. It startet to generate frustrations with my K-5 ii system, was disappointed by various signs of low quality from my zooms, and found the body's AF to be not fit for purpose. Too unreliable when used with fast 1.x apertures. Something I never experienced before with my f/8 landscape photography.
I use the K-5II AF for the same purpose, mostly @ f/2 and often in low light and I think it's really great, except its tracking abilities of course. In fact for AF-S (and especially low light AF-S) it is one of the best and most accurate I ever used and I used a lot of different cameras, full frame Nikons and Canons included.

---------- Post added 04-20-2015 at 01:16 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Well, if it is announced this week but isn't actually released until late June or July . . . . what does logic tell you?
They have to start the production now. And there is no time to put the new stuff in if they got it AFTER official announcement. Hopefully they had it long before...
04-20-2015, 11:16 AM   #450
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
I think i have said more then enough already
The FBI knows what you know !!!
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