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04-22-2015, 07:20 AM   #631
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom777 Quote
it will go UP in price says monochrome
I don't think so
as I said k3 is a better buy in my books, saving 450/500 ( and I'm talking about the Prestige edition Gunmetal with grip )
, and I don't think there will be much difference in IQ well maybe the pixel-peepers will see a difference
Tom G
Jump the gun much?

1) We haven't even see the official press release plus specs.
2) We do not know how much the picture quality will differ.

That is, the rest of us. You, however, somehow know all of this already?

04-22-2015, 07:21 AM   #632
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04-22-2015, 07:30 AM   #633
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QuoteOriginally posted by bxf Quote
I guess the "problem" with viewing the models simply as a choice is that one wants (some of) the improvements of the newer model, without having to give up anything one is used to having.
And to add to this, Ricoh has stated with their introduction of the lower models is to pull in some of the cell-phone-photo crowd (questionable how well that went with the k-s1...) but those folks are entry-level people that would appreciate the convenience of an on-board flash, not to mention its usefulness. By removing it you have limited the eventual upgrade path that the customer has when they outgrow their entry-level cameras, and they may look elsewhere. That and immediately cutting out a segment of the market that will not buy a camera without one will limit Ricoh's potential customer base. I think this is about choice, and those choices may impact the short and long-term growth prospects of the company's brand - PENTAX. They should be focusing on customer attraction and retention and it appears this will do neither.
04-22-2015, 07:30 AM - 2 Likes   #634
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
That's because they haven't had the benefit to see de picture improvement yet.
I guess someone always will complain

QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
They don't care. Except if itsn't good enough, then they can complain about IQ too
Oh well..their loss..Negativity never makes the day better

04-22-2015, 07:54 AM - 3 Likes   #635
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
i really can't understand all the complaining. And this even without knowing everything the K-3 Mark II will feature.
I have a theory about that.
Some people love to complain so much that they're afraid to wait for the facts, just in case it turns out the specs are something they actually like. They don't want to risk having nothing to complain about so get an early start.
04-22-2015, 07:56 AM   #636
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
I have a theory about that.
Some people love to complain so much that they're afraid to wait for the facts, just in case it turns out the specs are something they actually like. They don't want to risk having nothing to complain about so get an early start.
hehe..you might be on to something here
04-22-2015, 07:59 AM   #637
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
I guess someone always will complain



Oh well..their loss..Negativity never makes the day better
I really don't understand. The K3 II is going to have features built in that Canon and Nikon can't build into their cameras, even if they wanted to. Assuming there really is improvement in SR, that alone will bump image quality in a lot of settings. Assuming better sensor, I can't see being so upset at the lack of a pop up flash.

I remember when people were asking for a kx sensor in a K7 body. And then a full frame sensor in a K3 body (which wouldn't work). Now, people complain when you give them five new features and take one thing away that most upper end amateur/pros wouldn't use anyway.

My guess is that a lot of the people who are complaining weren't going to buy a K3 II anyway -- at least not at anywhere close to the release price. If you need to convince yourself that you don't need a new camera, then that's fine, but there is no sense beating the package up before we have even seen what it is really going to look like.
04-22-2015, 08:06 AM   #638
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I really don't understand. The K3 II is going to have features built in that Canon and Nikon can't build into their cameras, even if they wanted to. Assuming there really is improvement in SR, that alone will bump image quality in a lot of settings. Assuming better sensor, I can't see being so upset at the lack of a pop up flash.

I remember when people were asking for a kx sensor in a K7 body. And then a full frame sensor in a K3 body (which wouldn't work). Now, people complain when you give them five new features and take one thing away that most upper end amateur/pros wouldn't use anyway.

My guess is that a lot of the people who are complaining weren't going to buy a K3 II anyway -- at least not at anywhere close to the release price. If you need to convince yourself that you don't need a new camera, then that's fine, but there is no sense beating the package up before we have even seen what it is really going to look like.
I guess the point is that none of these things require the pop-up flash to be removed - logically anyway (maybe Pentax had to but I can't think how these things interact in such a way that would require it to go). It's possible that the GPS module could only be fitted in by doing so, but that's not the same kind of development as improved SR, DR, IQ etc. I think that is why people are bemused by it's removal.

And quite frankly I think it's legitimate to be annoyed if something you use is removed from future iterations of a product. It doesn't in anyway make the K-3II a failure or say anything about it's potentially improved IQ.

04-22-2015, 08:09 AM   #639
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No flash is an usp for the K3II (among other things) there are no other aps-c dslrs without a pop up flash.
04-22-2015, 08:12 AM   #640
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QuoteOriginally posted by MMVIII Quote
a camera which helps him to keep track of his phototours, even allows him to filter and sort his entire photocollection by coutry, location, site and helps him to find photos of a certain area
Don't know if you didn't know, but this is what I'm doing already since 2013, w/o the need for an expensive camera GPS unit just like so many others.

My Garmin etrex 20 records my track while I'm hiking or driving. It creates and stores a track file on its SD card. A track is just a dense chain of positions, each tagged with the satellite's time.

Back at home, some software (in my case: GeoSetter) reads all recorded tracks, and transfers track positions to my files' metadata.


Someone could use his/her smartphone as well, instead of a Garmin. There are apps around from recording tracks to full-blown offline navigation.

This is what I meant when I said, that the GPS inclusion into cameras is redundant for those already having already a GPS device with them (such as a smartphone, a handheld GPS, or a car GPS).

Having the GPS in cam has the advantage of course, that this adds some comfort and relief for those, which want an as-easy-as-possible solution w/o the requirement to get familar with geotagging with smartphone apps and the help of 3rd party helper software. The price to pay is, that this sucks up the camera battery charge.


I don't comprehend yet, why the loss of the pop-up flash was requried. Aren't there DSLRs around yet, which have both GPS and a pop-up Flash? My suspicion is, that Ricoh may want to bully customers into buying an expensive and profitable system flash unit.

Last edited by Frater; 04-22-2015 at 08:30 AM.
04-22-2015, 08:15 AM   #641
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QuoteOriginally posted by Caat Quote
I guess the point is that none of these things require the pop-up flash to be removed - logically anyway (maybe Pentax had to but I can't think how these things interact in such a way that would require it to go). It's possible that the GPS module could only be fitted in by doing so, but that's not the same kind of development as improved SR, DR, IQ etc. I think that is why people are bemused by it's removal.

And quite frankly I think it's legitimate to be annoyed if something you use is removed from future iterations of a product. It doesn't in anyway make the K-3II a failure or say anything about it's potentially improved IQ.
Your guess is not quite a professional engineer opinion. Apparently they didn't make the hump any smaller, so perhaps they had design issues. Right now everything we, all of us, say is spoken out of ignorance.
04-22-2015, 08:15 AM   #642
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I really don't understand. The K3 II is going to have features built in that Canon and Nikon can't build into their cameras, even if they wanted to. Assuming there really is improvement in SR, that alone will bump image quality in a lot of settings. Assuming better sensor, I can't see being so upset at the lack of a pop up flash.

I remember when people were asking for a kx sensor in a K7 body. And then a full frame sensor in a K3 body (which wouldn't work). Now, people complain when you give them five new features and take one thing away that most upper end amateur/pros wouldn't use anyway.

My guess is that a lot of the people who are complaining weren't going to buy a K3 II anyway -- at least not at anywhere close to the release price. If you need to convince yourself that you don't need a new camera, then that's fine, but there is no sense beating the package up before we have even seen what it is really going to look like.
Don't discount the probability that at least some of these people are actually paid to spread FUD.
04-22-2015, 08:16 AM   #643
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04-22-2015, 08:17 AM   #644
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
the difference in picture quality will be so noticable, that i really can't understand all the complaining. And this even without knowing everything the K-3 Mark II will feature. Some people....Oh well, someone will never be satisfied no matter what
28MP BSI Confirmed

K3 -> D7200 sensor is another plus if you are buying your first Pentax (like me) or have an X<24 MP camera, but not enough alone to justify the upgrade from a K3 imo. It's just icing on the cake, if the cake is better too however, it might be worth it even for K3 owners, only time will tell.

K3 is still selling for over $1000 in Europe. If the price doesn't drop significantly after the new APS-C flagship, buying the K3II instead of the K3 will be a no brainer.
04-22-2015, 08:17 AM - 2 Likes   #645
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frater Quote
Don't know if you didn't know, but this is what I'm doing already since 2013, w/o the need for an expensive camera GPS unit.

My Garmin etrex 20 records my track while I'm hiking or driving. It creates and stores a track file on its SD card. A track is just a dense chain of positions, each tagged with the satellite's time.

Back at home, some software (in my case: GeoSetter) reads all recorded tracks, and transfers track positions to my files' metadata.


Someone could use his/her smartphone as well, instead of a Garmin. There are apps around from recording tracks to full-blown offline navigation.

This is what I meant when I said, that the GPS inclusion into cameras is redundant for those already having already a GPS device with them (such as a smartphone, a handheld GPS, or a car GPS).

Having the GPS in cam has the advantage of course, that this adds some comfort and relief for those, which want an as-easy-as-possible solution w/o the requirement to get familar with geotagging with smartphone apps and the help of 3rd party helper software.
There's also a flash in my smartphone and a camera. Entire dslr redundant. What was Pentax thinking!
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