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04-25-2015, 06:28 AM   #706
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Ugh, I guess I'll get the OGPS-1 before it gets sold out

04-25-2015, 06:37 AM   #707
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
I had heard that before because it was said to have been a non seller....not many people bought it. Of course it may be different once it is in the camera but I don't understand why GPS was such a big thing to Pentax when sales were virtually non existant on it. Before people keep yelling and screaming, of course it is something some people wanted, but it seems that the demand was not there for it so why include it in the camera. I guess....just because.
It doesn't "cost" anything when included with the camera except for the cost of not having a pop up flash (addressed ad nauseum). Purchased separately it costs 200 dollars. Understandable that few people would purchase the stand alone unit, but would be glad if it was included in the camera body for no additional cost.

The "point" of having the astro tracer (important to note that this is more than just a simple GPS unit), is in having a point of separation from similarly priced cameras from Canon and Nikon. This is exactly what a pop up flash does not do. I would wager that there is no one who bought a D7200 over a 7D MK II purely on the basis that the D7200 has a pop up flash and the 7D MK II doesn't. At the same time, maybe this feature set does stand out in a market place that is pretty crowded with me-too products.
04-25-2015, 06:40 AM   #708
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
They may call light pulses "wireless", but I believe that is misleading and mislabeling. As I have already said multiple times (and won't bother saying again), I believe that RF is the only true "wireless" (when people talk about wi-fi, the "wireless" in the name means RF and nobody would ever accept a modulated light source as being "wireless" in that sense regardless of how the vendor labeled it!)
Well you can't condemn one company saying transmission by light is done without wire, can you?

Now, if (lile most people btw) one can't get that wireless doesn't mean wifi/bluetooth or long distant or whatever but just that tehree's no wire, you end up in this very situation: complaining because the term wireless is misleading.
If it is misleading, show me te wire. Until then, it is wireless.
04-25-2015, 06:41 AM - 1 Like   #709
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
I had heard that before because it was said to have been a non seller....not many people bought it. Of course it may be different once it is in the camera but I don't understand why GPS was such a big thing to Pentax when sales were virtually non existant on it. Before people keep yelling and screaming, of course it is something some people wanted, but it seems that the demand was not there for it so why include it in the camera. I guess....just because.
Because Ricoh wants to stand out. It wants to be different from other Canonikon and it wants to show the dslr is not a dead non-innovative platform.

04-25-2015, 06:45 AM   #710
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
You're right about the maps, with regard to Google maps, needing a data connection, but there are apps that eliminate that issue. I have an app called Maps With Me. It cost me about $5.00 and lets me download as many state or country/regional maps, with or without driving directions, as I want. It makes my phone a complete stand alone GPS device.
Yep. Maps and GPS have not much to do in common but one uses the other one.
A GPS gets you coordinates (and imprecise, mostly, altitude) and nothing else.
Compass will get you direction (but isn't GPS but used in complement).
ALtimeter will get you proper altitude readings.

Maps... well, that's when you wanna look at what those coordinates corresponds so either you have the map already or you need cell connectivity.
In any case, the gps doesn't need cell or the K3-II would have been delivered with a SIM card.

---------- Post added 25-04-15 at 14:46 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
I haven't seen a smartphone that doesn't have it. Your iPhone should be able to get a fix without cell towers too, but it might take a while. The GPS receivers that were used in earlier phones weren't that good, so it could take minutes to get a fix. But some newer ones are pretty fast, with or without cell towers.

At this point Pentax might be better off just including one of those Qualcomm Snapdragon chips. Everything is taken care of then. Very fast general purpose CPU (interface). Really fast WiFi. BT. NFC. Perhaps the best commercially available GPS receiver on the market. Capable image processor. Video encoder. And many more things. If the image processor from Fujitsu/their successor company is better, maybe use that for the connection to the processor.
And battery reduced to nothing. Brilliant.

---------- Post added 25-04-15 at 14:49 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
I had heard that before because it was said to have been a non seller....not many people bought it. Of course it may be different once it is in the camera but I don't understand why GPS was such a big thing to Pentax when sales were virtually non existant on it. Before people keep yelling and screaming, of course it is something some people wanted, but it seems that the demand was not there for it so why include it in the camera. I guess....just because.
Probably the same reason you kept moaning for a couple days now.

Just because.
04-25-2015, 06:50 AM   #711
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Yep. Maps and GPS have not much to do in common but one uses the other one.
A GPS gets you coordinates (and imprecise, mostly, altitude) and nothing else.
Compass will get you direction (but isn't GPS but used in complement).
ALtimeter will get you proper altitude readings.

Maps... well, that's when you wanna look at what those coordinates corresponds so either you have the map already or you need cell connectivity.
In any case, the gps doesn't need cell or the K3-II would have been delivered with a SIM card.

---------- Post added 25-04-15 at 14:46 ----------



And battery reduced to nothing. Brilliant.
That's the problem I have. When I am driving, I have a stand alone GPS unit that I use, purely because using my phone for GPS just eats up the battery. Hate to get where I am going and then I can't use my phone for the purpose I use it most -- making phone calls.
04-25-2015, 06:58 AM   #712
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
Because Ricoh wants to stand out. It wants to be different from other Canonikon and it wants to show the dslr is not a dead non-innovative platform.


Understand and I am in the I like GPS for no additional cost camp too. I just wonder what market research was done going forward. I mean how many will actually use it, 10%, 20%....50%. I hope Pentax understands that.


Those of us in PF. or all forums for that matter, are very verbal but we only represent a small percentage of the total base of Pentax cameras. so let's say there are 1000 active users here and we all say we want a certain accessory. that is 100% concurrence, meaning 1000 users say yes, but lets say the base is 10000 Pentax cameras of the given model. That is a low percentage to make such a big change that others really did not want or care about. I know, this is just an easy example that I use for explanation purpose only.


Also, we know that North America and Europe is not where the total market share is for Pentax, it is Asia. We basically have to accept what it is that Pentax thinks will sell cameras and without a marketing plan from them, as I can see, I just hope they didnt make any of these changes on a whim. Look at the K-S1. From an image perspective, it takes great pics. but it is a non seller also, same goes for the K-01. The market is fickle and people can walk away from a product even though a lot of us may think it is a really great camera.
04-25-2015, 07:05 AM   #713
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
Understand and I am in the I like GPS for no additional cost camp too. I just wonder what market research was done going forward. I mean how many will actually use it, 10%, 20%....50%. I hope Pentax understands that.


Those of us in PF. or all forums for that matter, are very verbal but we only represent a small percentage of the total base of Pentax cameras. so let's say there are 1000 active users here and we all say we want a certain accessory. that is 100% concurrence, meaning 1000 users say yes, but lets say the base is 10000 Pentax cameras of the given model. That is a low percentage to make such a big change that others really did not want or care about. I know, this is just an easy example that I use for explanation purpose only.


Also, we know that North America and Europe is not where the total market share is for Pentax, it is Asia. We basically have to accept what it is that Pentax thinks will sell cameras and without a marketing plan from them, as I can see, I just hope they didnt make any of these changes on a whim. Look at the K-S1. From an image perspective, it takes great pics. but it is a non seller also, same goes for the K-01. The market is fickle and people can walk away from a product even though a lot of us may think it is a really great camera.
I bet this is one of those things that no one "needs," but once you have it, you would be upset if a future camera you purchased didn't have it. There are a lot of things like that in life.

As to the K-01, I am an unashamed apologist for that camera. The problem was purely that Pentax didn't release a version two of it. Stick an EVF on it, phase detect auto focus on the sensor and bump the buffer/frame rate a little and you would have a killer little k mount camera. The problem was just that (as usual) forum folks slagged a camera they didn't understand and didn't fit with their image of what a camera is supposed to be like.

And it included a pop up flash too...

04-25-2015, 07:15 AM   #714
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I bet this is one of those things that no one "needs," but once you have it, you would be upset if a future camera you purchased didn't have it. There are a lot of things like that in life.

As to the K-01, I am an unashamed apologist for that camera. The problem was purely that Pentax didn't release a version two of it. Stick an EVF on it, phase detect auto focus on the sensor and bump the buffer/frame rate a little and you would have a killer little k mount camera. The problem was just that (as usual) forum folks slagged a camera they didn't understand and didn't fit with their image of what a camera is supposed to be like.

And it included a pop up flash too...


Agree on that. I never really thought that GPS in my car would be that important....but would not live without it now, except everyone just uses it in their smart phones.


And correct too, I wont comment on forum folks because I have been hammered by others for the last couple days just because I had an opposite opinion that they don't like. Oh well, I thought that the forum was about discussion but I guess some people here only like the discussion if it agrees with what they think is right. Not everyone here is like that, but some.
04-25-2015, 07:42 AM - 1 Like   #715
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
Agree on that. I never really thought that GPS in my car would be that important....but would not live without it now, except everyone just uses it in their smart phones.


And correct too, I wont comment on forum folks because I have been hammered by others for the last couple days just because I had an opposite opinion that they don't like. Oh well, I thought that the forum was about discussion but I guess some people here only like the discussion if it agrees with what they think is right. Not everyone here is like that, but some.
JimC, did people hammer on you or disagree with your thoughts? Not the same thing.
04-25-2015, 08:06 AM   #716
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QuoteOriginally posted by K David Quote
FWIW, the move away from an on-camera flash indicates, I think, an increased interest in picking up professional photographers. When was the last time you saw a professional photographer use an on-body pop-up flash? Never to almost never. Most of the time professionals aren't even mounting flash units on top of a camera unless it's to bounce it.
Exactly.

Focus on image quality (without gigapixel marketing), improved AF, panning friendly SR, and no flash, are a move to position it in the pro level.

Astrophotography is picking up, and astrotracer is a cheap way to get decent results without getting bulky and expensive telescope+mount. Just need to get it to work properly with zooms.

And itīs also another way to market their in-camera SR.

Now they just need to improve tethering via flucard past basic functions and they have a camera that makes it easy/cheap for the pros to try the system without having to sell their current, which is a show-stopper. They can then like it and move up.
04-25-2015, 08:09 AM - 2 Likes   #717
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
And correct too, I wont comment on forum folks because I have been hammered by others for the last couple days just because I had an opposite opinion that they don't like. Oh well, I thought that the forum was about discussion but I guess some people here only like the discussion if it agrees with what they think is right. Not everyone here is like that, but some.
Okay, I've been watching this and now I think it's time to clarify a couple of things:
Yes, this is a discussion forum. It's not a soapbox.
I don't think you got "hammered" for having an opinion that differed from anyone else's. How many #1 hit songs have there been over the years that people initially liked (or at least didn't dislike) that they came to dread hearing? Not because of the song itself, but because you couldn't turn on a radio at any given moment without hearing the same song over, and over, and over..............

Last edited by Parallax; 04-25-2015 at 08:19 AM.
04-25-2015, 08:09 AM - 4 Likes   #718
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
Agree on that. I never really thought that GPS in my car would be that important....but would not live without it now, except everyone just uses it in their smart phones.


And correct too, I wont comment on forum folks because I have been hammered by others for the last couple days just because I had an opposite opinion that they don't like. Oh well, I thought that the forum was about discussion but I guess some people here only like the discussion if it agrees with what they think is right. Not everyone here is like that, but some.

I think that you took some heat because you took the leap from "this is not good for me" to "this is not good for Pentax". People here are ok with the first but will challenge you on the second. And I've yet to be convinced by your arguments.


Pentax can't challenge Nikon and Canon by being just like them. They have to be different and they've said that many times. They are looking for niches where they can be successful and profitable.


For any photo enthusiast that's had to put away their camera in the rain or come back from a hike or vacation and weren't sure where they took certain photos, the K-3ii suddenly stands out when compared to Nikon, Canon, Olympus, Fuji, Panasonic, Samsung, and everyone else at the same price point. The GPS and weather sealing gives people in the camera shops something to talk about that's not just me too.


Now if they would only embed wifi...
04-25-2015, 08:14 AM   #719
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimC1101 Quote
I had heard that before because it was said to have been a non seller....not many people bought it. Of course it may be different once it is in the camera but I don't understand why GPS was such a big thing to Pentax when sales were virtually non existent on it. Before people keep yelling and screaming, of course it is something some people wanted, but it seems that the demand was not there for it so why include it in the camera. I guess....just because.
Sometimes the detail missed is the price (sometimes economics does work). Again referring to the Q in a K-3 thread, the "08" wide-angle lens is acknowledged to sell very poorly; I can't speak for others, but that particular lens costs twice what I bought my camera for, so I just cannot justify paying that for a lens that I would love to have on occasion ... but just on occasion. Thus poor sales for that particular lens does not mean that there is little demand for a wide-angle lens in the Q-mount, but a prime wide-angle lens priced like the prime standard lens might sell just fine. Bringing my thought back to the K-3ii, GPS is becoming a common accessory for photographers; only time will tell whether it is more popular than tiny point-sized light sources.

---------- Post added 04-25-15 at 11:17 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
JimC, did people hammer on you or disagree with your thoughts? Not the same thing.
I have discovered on my own that at some point people here get tired of hearing certain things and are rather heavy-handed in expressing that. We could be a little more gentle with each other (largely, we are all on the same side afterall)
04-25-2015, 08:19 AM   #720
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
JimC, did people hammer on you or disagree with your thoughts? Not the same thing.


To disagree with each others thoughts is to be expected, that is what a forum is all about, point/counterpoint, but when others are jsaying to stop posting or just move along because they have a different opinion, that is not disagreement.


Discussion is great. I have been posting here for a while, but I never heard anyone say that others opinions don't matter.,,,and it is all because of a disagreement on a fricken pop up flash. It has not been from everyone, just a few.
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