[IchabodCrane]

Having thought about this a little more, here's where I think Ricoh is coming from:

1) The high-res functionality of the K-3.2 is most suited for landscape and architectural photography. Those who are attracted to the camera for this purpose will have the least need for a built-in flash.
2) GPS info, in general, will become an expectation for every photo taken as the mobile phone industry is creating and delivering on that expectation. In essence, Ricoh are getting out ahead of the curve in the DSLR business.
3) Most high end DSLR owners already have a flash unit. Now whether they wish to carry it around with themselves all of the time is another matter.

All that said, Ricoh should have come out with a non-self powered small flash for the times when people need one and don't want to lug their big Pentax or Metz flash around, assuming they have one. I think every other camera maker who came out with a flashless camera included such a thing free of charge for their camera models short of something like a D4 (where all owners are pros with complex flash gear anyway). They shouldn't tell people their solution is to fork over another $150. Oly, Sony, etc. didn't make people do that.

[D1N0]

Having thought about this a little more, here's where I think Ricoh is coming from:

1) The high-res functionality of the K-3.2 is most suited for landscape and architectural photography. Those who are attracted to the camera for this purpose will have the least need for a built-in flash.
2) GPS info, in general, will become an expectation for every photo taken as the mobile phone industry is creating and delivering on that expectation. In essence, Ricoh are getting out ahead of the curve in the DSLR business.
3) Most high end DSLR owners already have a flash unit. Now whether they wish to carry it around with themselves all of the time is another matter.

All that said, Ricoh should have come out with a non-self powered small flash for the times when people need one and don't want to lug their big Pentax or Metz flash around, assuming they have one. I think every other camera maker who came out with a flashless camera included such a thing free of charge for their camera models short of something like a D4 (where all owners are pros with complex flash gear anyway). They shouldn't tell people their solution is to fork over another $150. Oly, Sony, etc. didn't make people do that.

Yeah Free flash for every one!

Pentax K3 II only $1299,-

[mikeSF]

If they are going to add a better AF and pixel shift in a firmware update for the K-3, I agree.

said no successful corporation ever.

[reh321]

Do pocket wizards provide wireless P-TTL??

I meant I use a pop-up as a Wireless P-TTL controller.

You had my hopes up for a moment. "Wireless" normally implies RF, so you're using optical triggering because wireless P-TTL doesn't currently exist.

And really, I would not even think of complaining if Pentax announced a kind of small P-TTL triggering system with the K-3II. That's the only thing I need a pop-up flash sometimes.

So we agree that a packaged wireless P-TTL system would be an optimal solution

[kadajawi]

Thanks for responding. Just to make sure I understand, LR will edit the DNG or PEF file itself? I ask because I was always under the impression RAW files were non-editable once they left the camera.

They don't change the raw data, but they will add and change metadata around it. That can be EXIF data, the date, but also the location, tags, edits you've done in LR. Not sure about PEF files... maybe there they use sidecar files. But with DNG yoh can clearly save to DNG. I have set it to automatically do it.

[jaad75]

"Wireless" normally implies RF, so you're using optical triggering because wireless P-TTL doesn't currently exist.

I know how it works, but that's how they officially call it. And it's nothing wrong with that cause it is.. well... wireless....

So we agree that a packaged wireless P-TTL system would be an optimal solution

Yes, of course. Plus, it could be much more advanced than what could be done with a pop-up... say it could offer a wireless HSS...

[derekkite]

said no successful corporation ever.

Maybe, but if Ricoh plans to live on an 18 month itch cycle they will starve to death.

I think bodies are extremely competitive in price, with marginal improvements available. The money is in lenses. This spring I have the choice of a 150-450 lens or a body. Pentax would love it if I bought the lens, and by upgrading my two k3 bodies they are sure to get it, as well as the interest of my friends who get marginal but necessary improvements (adequate buffer) by spending money on a body while I get them with a firmware upgrade along with my new lens.

I shoot lots but am a ways from the 200k shutter rating.

The camera manufacturers don't have a viable and future proof business model, none of them.

And where I come from a $1200 for a camera body is a big deal.

[reh321]

So we agree that a packaged wireless P-TTL system would be an optimal solution

Yes, of course. Plus, it could be much more advanced than what could be done with a pop-up... say it could offer a wireless HSS...

When I told my wife about this whole discussion, she remembered a wedding we went to some years ago. I don't want to get into yet another wedding photo discussion here, but the bottom line was that the Pro had an optically-fired slave, seemed to be everywhere, and may have been irritated every time I accidentally set off his slave. My best picture from the event was a picture I took of my wife and a friend setting up the punch table. The angle I took the picture from resulted in an overlap of my flash and their slave flash in such a way that the ladies at the punch table were over-exposed, and you can see in the picture how their slave caused that to happen.

This picture also illustrates one of the major downsides of optical triggering. True wireless triggering, which gives you a choice of at least four different channels, gives some hope of avoiding that problem (unless there are "too many" RF systems there).

[Parallax]

Ya, that might work great until you're out of range of a cell tower, then it doesn't work at all.

Actually, you don't need a cell signal for the GPS and GPS aps to work.

[jaad75]

This picture also illustrates one of the major downsides of optical triggering. True wireless triggering, which gives you a choice of at least four different channels, gives some hope of avoiding that problem (unless there are "too many" RF systems there).

Have you ever tried the Wireless P-TTL? Or let's say Nikon's CLS? It's not just a dumb optical slave you're talking about - flashes are not triggered by accident that easy (albeit it happens sometimes) and you can always choose one of 4 "channels" if you have another shooter on site.

[D1N0]

So the pentax k-3 can wirelessly trigger external pentax flashes as a controller (not flashing the pop up). Why would the K-3 II not be able to do the same? How is the wireless signal sent? Via infra red? Then the K-3 II should be able to do it as well.

[reh321]

Have you ever tried the Wireless P-TTL? Or let's say Nikon's CLS? It's not just a dumb optical slave you're talking about - flashes are not triggered by accident that easy (albeit it happens sometimes) and you can always choose one of 4 "channels" if you have another shooter on site.

Yes, that is exactly what I mean. I have both a Canon proprietary P-TTL system and a Cactus system. My experience with them just added to my distain for optical triggering.

[jaad75]

So the pentax k-3 can wirelessly trigger external pentax flashes as a controller (not flashing the pop up).

Like every modern Pentax camera can.

How is the wireless signal sent? Via infra red?

Via visible flash pulses. You can put a filter so it goes in infrared only, of course.

[normhead]

Actually, you don't need a cell signal for the GPS and GPS aps to work.

On what phone? Are you saying there are now phones with GPS units built in? I'm using an iPhone 3 so I need cell tower. About newer phones I have no idea.

Check this out... opened in the default image editor "Preview" on a mac, and click the GPS window in the "Inspector and you can see where it was taken. The image by the way, is a pixel peeping crop demonstrating pixel shift.

[reh321]

So the pentax k-3 can wirelessly trigger external pentax flashes as a controller (not flashing the pop up). Why would the K-3 II not be able to do the same? How is the wireless signal sent? Via infra red? Then the K-3 II should be able to do it as well.

No, as far as I know, Pentax does not currently have a true "wireless" system ... which is one of the reasons the Cactus system was made available at a discount through this forum.
Not infra-red; normally Radio Frequency is used for a true wireless system.
The only system available to K-3 users is called "wireless", but it is simply an optical system such as a described in my story about the slave unit at the wedding.